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Old 04-30-2017, 02:24 PM   #81
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Originally Posted by pilotbit View Post
My '17 GT was manufactured in January of 2017.
When performing the steps to check the power source for the Fusion this is my result:

1. House power - OFF, Ignition - ON, Fusion - ON
2. Ignition - OFF, Fusion - OFF
3. House power - ON, Ignition - OFF, Fusion - ON
4. D/C Chassis battery isol. - FUSION STAYS ON

In this state the House battery is dropping by .1 volts approximately every 5 seconds but the solar has not kicked in at 12.6 v in bright sunlight. It would appear that AS has changed the wiring to the Fusion as of January 2017, or by mistake on my unit. I do wonder why the solar is not trying to help the house battery, but I doubt that it could keep up with the drain from the Fusion.
I am not on shore power.


So we have some drawing power from the chassis and others from the coach. Guess folks need to determine which version they have and what they want.

On the solar, yeah, that's a known limitation of the Atkinson charge controller. It won't kick on until the house is below 12.6-12.7v and is the reason why I bought a MPPT controller to replace it. I want my batteries to be charging, even if it's just Float charging, any time there is enough sunlight to turn the controller on. Once I get some free time I'll install it and that should take care of both battery banks (I'll set the Float voltage on the new controller to 13.4v so the BIM keeps the chassis battery connected to the house and solar whenever the controller is on).
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Old 04-30-2017, 02:39 PM   #82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pilotbit View Post
My '17 GT was manufactured in January of 2017.
When performing the steps to check the power source for the Fusion this is my result:

1. House power - OFF, Ignition - ON, Fusion - ON
2. Ignition - OFF, Fusion - OFF
3. House power - ON, Ignition - OFF, Fusion - ON
4. D/C Chassis battery isol. - FUSION STAYS ON

In this state the House battery is dropping by .1 volts approximately every 5 seconds but the solar has not kicked in at 12.6 v in bright sunlight. It would appear that AS has changed the wiring to the Fusion as of January 2017, or by mistake on my unit. I do wonder why the solar is not trying to help the house battery, but I doubt that it could keep up with the drain from the Fusion.
I am not on shore power.

What is difference between House Power OFF and D/C Chassis battery isol.? If the latter is the negative chassis battery disconnect near the driver's accelerator, I think that is how all Interstates are wired. The radio is powered primarily by the house batteries unless the House Power is OFF, then Power is controlled by Sprinter key position like most vehicles. There is a diode bridge circuit in the wiring to allow this dual power setup.

IMHO - the best thing any Interstate owner can do is change out that lousy Atkinson solar controller for a good MPPT controller.
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Old 04-30-2017, 03:19 PM   #83
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Originally Posted by Boxster1971 View Post
What is difference between House Power OFF and D/C Chassis battery isol.? If the latter is the negative chassis battery disconnect near the driver's accelerator, I think that is how all Interstates are wired. The radio is powered primarily by the house batteries unless the House Power is OFF, then Power is controlled by Sprinter key position like most vehicles. There is a diode bridge circuit in the wiring to allow this dual power setup.

IMHO - the best thing any Interstate owner can do is change out that lousy Atkinson solar controller for a good MPPT controller.
Yes, the "Disconnect for the chassis battery" is the negative disconnect at the accelerator pedal.
Sorry, I should have made that clear.

It does appear, however, that some new Interstates have chassis power as their primary power source for the Fusion as pointed out by FlyFishinRVr.

Thanks for the hint on the MPPT controller. I will search the forum for advice on a particular unit.
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Old 04-30-2017, 05:40 PM   #84
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Dead engine battery....quiz (2017 AI)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Boxster1971 View Post
What is difference between House Power OFF and D/C Chassis battery isol.? If the latter is the negative chassis battery disconnect near the driver's accelerator, I think that is how all Interstates are wired. The radio is powered primarily by the house batteries unless the House Power is OFF, then Power is controlled by Sprinter key position like most vehicles. There is a diode bridge circuit in the wiring to allow this dual power setup.


It appears some of the early 17's have been wired incorrectly and they are only pulling from the chassis battery. When you turn the house power ON at the switch by the door, the Fusion comes on after a brief startup delay and if you monitor the battery voltages at the tank panel you can watch the chassis voltage drop slowly but surely. On others, you will see the house battery do this.

Someone asked if the solar can keep up with the draw from the Fusion. The Fusion can pull as much as 12A but I've not seen mine do that. I think if you have good sun the solar could keep up but I've not tested that.
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Old 05-02-2017, 05:53 PM   #85
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If the blue jumper on the Atkinson controller has been clipped, the turn on voltage drops to about 12.3 V. So if yours is doing that, might check and if jumper has been clipped, reconnect it and see if that helps.
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Old 05-03-2017, 02:45 PM   #86
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Originally Posted by 73shark View Post
If the blue jumper on the Atkinson controller has been clipped, the turn on voltage drops to about 12.3 V. So if yours is doing that, might check and if jumper has been clipped, reconnect it and see if that helps.
Thanks for the tip. I will check the controller.
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Old 05-05-2017, 09:03 AM   #87
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Originally Posted by 73shark View Post
If the blue jumper on the Atkinson controller has been clipped, the turn on voltage drops to about 12.3 V. So if yours is doing that, might check and if jumper has been clipped, reconnect it and see if that helps.
I checked mine, and though the blue wire is clipped, my controller still turns on right around 12.6 - 12.7v. Maybe due to the temp compensation? Anyway, good tip on how to raise the turn on voltage so the batteries don't get quite so depleted before the solar does something. I finally punted and bought a MPPT controller and am in the process of installing it (too many "life" interruptions, too little time.....sigh).
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Old 05-05-2017, 12:19 PM   #88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FlyFishinRVr View Post
I checked mine, and though the blue wire is clipped, my controller still turns on right around 12.6 - 12.7v. Maybe due to the temp compensation? Anyway, good tip on how to raise the turn on voltage so the batteries don't get quite so depleted before the solar does something. I finally punted and bought a MPPT controller and am in the process of installing it (too many "life" interruptions, too little time.....sigh).
Yes it could be temp compensation if you are experiencing temps below 60degF. Can't get exact voltage range for sealed batteries because the table of temp compensation is only shown for a flooded cell battery. Attaching a copy of the Atkinson manual in case you don't have a copy.
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Old 05-05-2017, 12:28 PM   #89
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Yes it could be temp compensation if you are experiencing temps below 60degF. Can't get exact voltage range for sealed batteries because the table of temp compensation is only shown for a flooded cell battery. Attaching a copy of the Atkinson manual in case you don't have a copy.
Thanks Mike.

Over the winter the temps were definitely below 60*F, so I think that's why I was seeing a higher-than-listed turn-on voltage.

It'll be interesting to see how the new MPPT controller does with the single 100W panel. Given the amount of sunshine my rig gets I think it will be able to easily keep both battery banks fully charged while parked. I'll report back with my findings after I have some time on the new setup (which I still have to finish installing.....).
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Old 05-05-2017, 01:14 PM   #90
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Fusion Confusion

After experimenting with my Fusion in different power modes it seems confusing that sometimes the little power touch button in the upper right corner of the unit stays lighted red when you power it off and other times it goes off entirely. The radio will operate with the house batteries on and ignition off or with ignition on and house batteries off just as my 2014 did. But, with house batteries on and ignition off when you turn the radio off the power light stays on. But, if you turn the ignition on while the house batteries are still connected and then touch the power button turning the Fusion on and then off again, the red light goes out even with the house batteries on, and stays off when you turn the ignition off. Seems odd, probably because I just don't understand it.
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Old 05-05-2017, 03:14 PM   #91
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After experimenting with my Fusion in different power modes it seems confusing that sometimes the little power touch button in the upper right corner of the unit stays lighted red when you power it off and other times it goes off entirely.
It seems the Fusion has 2 levels of "sleep". When powered (either via ignition on or house power on), if you press the power button once, it "lightly" sleeps (display, radio, etc. all off), but the button glows red. If you push it again, it comes back on, this time with no startup delay (hence me calling it "sleep" mode because it's still drawing power, just not as much as when fully on). If you HOLD the power button instead of just pressing it, you will more fully "turn it off", but as we've all discovered, it's still drawing power, so I consider this to be a deeper "sleep" state. I think the only way to really kill it is to install a cutoff switch in the harness at the back of the unit. At least one other owner had their dealer do this so they can ensure it won't draw down the batteries while in storage. A good plan, and one I may consider in the future......
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Old 05-05-2017, 06:39 PM   #92
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Originally Posted by FlyFishinRVr View Post
It'll be interesting to see how the new MPPT controller does with the single 100W panel. Given the amount of sunshine my rig gets I think it will be able to easily keep both battery banks fully charged while parked. I'll report back with my findings after I have some time on the new setup (which I still have to finish installing.....).
From memory MPTT will have maximum advantage when the voltage differential between the solar cells is the highest (i.e. near dead battery) and the cells are cold. If these conditions are changed, MPPT gain will go to nearly zero or possibly negative.
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Old 05-05-2017, 10:36 PM   #93
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From memory MPTT will have maximum advantage when the voltage differential between the solar cells is the highest (i.e. near dead battery) and the cells are cold. If these conditions are changed, MPPT gain will go to nearly zero or possibly negative.
I'll be happy if the MPPT controller stays on when the sun is shining. That seems like an obvious thing that all solar controllers should do, but the Atkinson does not. That alone should greatly improve the performance of my panel. Time will tell.....
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Old 05-06-2017, 10:41 AM   #94
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I'll be happy if the MPPT controller stays on when the sun is shining. That seems like an obvious thing that all solar controllers should do, but the Atkinson does not. That alone should greatly improve the performance of my panel. Time will tell.....
I agree. That atkinson charger needs to be shot in the head just because.
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Old 05-06-2017, 02:49 PM   #95
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From memory MPTT will have maximum advantage when the voltage differential between the solar cells is the highest (i.e. near dead battery) and the cells are cold. If these conditions are changed, MPPT gain will go to nearly zero or possibly negative.
MPPT controllers also only provide their benefit when in bulk charging mode. If you have lead acid batteries, the charge controllers still use PWM for absorption and float charging. Add in the fact that the voltage converter consumes energy, MPPT controllers probably provide little net benefit. Only time I would bother with them is with a grid tied system where there is a direct financial gain associated with each kW that goes back on the grid.
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Old 05-06-2017, 06:26 PM   #96
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Victron has a good white paper on PWM vs MPPT on their site:

https://www.victronenergy.com/upload...WM-or-MPPT.pdf

It might help dispell some myths and rumors about one vs the other....
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Old 05-07-2017, 06:56 PM   #97
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Someone asked if the solar can keep up with the draw from the Fusion. The Fusion can pull as much as 12A but I've not seen mine do that. I think if you have good sun the solar could keep up but I've not tested that.
Sorry for quoting myself, but I wanted to keep this in context.

I tested this today and can say that with my new MPPT controller and single 100W solar panel, the solar can indeed keep up with the Fusion. I was finishing my new controller install (just cleaning up really....I make a mess ) and I had the Fusion keeping me entertained with some music. Over the course of about 2hrs, my battery voltage never moved. When I got to the coach the batteries were Floating at 13.4v (both house and chassis....YAY!!!!), and when I left they were still sitting at 13.4v. The solar panel was producing about 3.5A, and nothing else was on (no inverter, no fridge, no propane, etc).

I doubt very seriously you could achieve that with the Atkinson controller (I never could....I had to run the engine or genset to keep the batteries from slowly dying when I ran the Fusion), but with a decent charge controller it appears totally do-able.
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Old 05-09-2017, 11:59 PM   #98
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Originally Posted by FlyFishinRVr View Post
Sorry for quoting myself, but I wanted to keep this in context.

I tested this today and can say that with my new MPPT controller and single 100W solar panel, the solar can indeed keep up with the Fusion. I was finishing my new controller install (just cleaning up really....I make a mess ) and I had the Fusion keeping me entertained with some music. Over the course of about 2hrs, my battery voltage never moved. When I got to the coach the batteries were Floating at 13.4v (both house and chassis....YAY!!!!), and when I left they were still sitting at 13.4v. The solar panel was producing about 3.5A, and nothing else was on (no inverter, no fridge, no propane, etc).

I doubt very seriously you could achieve that with the Atkinson controller (I never could....I had to run the engine or genset to keep the batteries from slowly dying when I ran the Fusion), but with a decent charge controller it appears totally do-able.




Remember everyone - installing an in-line Fusion kill switch is a superb option.

Isolates the source of the drain ...simply and effectively
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Old 06-23-2017, 04:32 PM   #99
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Remember everyone - installing an in-line Fusion kill switch is a superb option.

Isolates the source of the drain ...simply and effectively
Just got my Interstate back from the dealer for misc. items that needed to be addressed. One of the things was the Fusion draining my chassis battery, they rewired my Interstate with an updated wire diagram from the factory(according to the tech). Now my Fusion turns off when I kill the engine, no need to hold the power button to put it in sleep mode. When I start the engine the Fusion goes thru the boot up process. The good: no more dead starter battery. The bad: can't listen to the radio without the keys in the ignition.
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Old 06-23-2017, 04:44 PM   #100
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they rewired my Interstate with an updated wire diagram from the factory(according to the tech). Now my Fusion turns off when I kill the engine, no need to hold the power button to put it in sleep mode.
Is this regardless of the position of the Main Disconnect switch by the sliding door? Saying it another way, does your radio now only turn on/off via the key?
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