Another New Lithium Solar Upgrade Thread - Could use input

[5280BDocker]

Hello all,

Since our acquisition of our 2017 GI GT, we have had a major road trip from Denver to Maine. Going off grid along the way. We are currently plugged in here at the Belgrade Lakes before our return in a few weeks.

We have easily come to the conclusion that the current stock configuration with solar and batteries is insufficient. We need to be off grid for multiple days. We plan to use this for trips to Alaska and the West and finding some nice Fly Fishing waters along the way. So, Upgrades here we come starting in August.

Below is our configuration. With the knowledge and support in this forum, hopefully you guys can set me straight if I left something off that I should add.

I always appreciate your support.

Randy



• 4 -BattleBorn Batteries 100Ah 12V GC2
• Vicron Multiplus Inverter 3000W
• Battleborn Victron Battery Monitor
• VE Bus Smart Dongle
• Victron Smart MPPT 100/50
• MicroAir Easy Start
• 300 AM Fuse/holder
• 225 Amp Isolation Manager
• Battleborn Victron Color Control GX
• Current Surge Limiter
• 4 - Zamp Obsidian 100W Panels
• Assorted Cabling/ Terminals etc…
Disconnect Switch

[PB_NB]

Hi Randy, The list you show is impressive and will serve you well but it really depends on what you want to get out of it.

There are some calculators to help you plan out your consumption and then work towards a system that will cover your needs.

I think the AC demands are huge and if that is in your plans, then this might not be enough to cool your rig! There are some pretty impressive 1000W solar arrays on this forum that could speak to that.

Our plan is a bit simpler with just 2 little portable panels and a 250ah battery at this stage with future additions coming in the fall.

I hope your trip up North works and the borders open up so you can travel without issues.

[nateallen80]

Randy,
You’re going to need a 400 amp fuse instead of a 300 amp fuse. You may be able to go with a 100/30 victron mppt instead of a 100/50. You can check out Chris’s 400 AH Battleborn and the Victron 3000w inverter/charger install on their AI at their Irene Iron Fitness YouTube channel. It’s pretty instructive for those components.

I have 2 battleborns installed currently, but have 2 more and a Victron 3000w inverter in boxes here waiting on time to complete that project myself.

[5280BDocker]

Thanks PB. We will try to keep our needs a bit simple. Since we are in the West most times, AC is not a huge issue. We would like to run it briefly potentially to cool down. We do not have the challenges some in the SE might have. As for other power demands, I lost the need for a blow dryer a while ago. My wife may need hers. Potential some computers and phones. Other than that just standard stuff.

On another note: If I take the generator and the AGM batteries out underneath, Is there potential room for more or larger tanks. We see the tanks as the most limiting constraint.

Thanks All.

Randy

[PB_NB]

The great part about lithium batteries is they are less than 1/2 the weight of AGM's so swapping them gives you battery power while reducing weight and you can install them inside without the concern of fumes entering your living space.

This could definitely free up space for other things like tanks, I suspect that there would be way to repurpose the space gained with additional or larger tanks but I am not too sure about specifics of the storage areas in your rig.

We have a limited tank sizes in our trailer and have begun mapping out places to dump along the way. Most campgrounds have facilities now and there are some gas stations and other public dump spots.

[5280BDocker]

The Batteries have arrived! Not too intimidating.

[PB_NB]

Wow! that does look like a bit of work ahead of you!

[5280BDocker]

So. How do you eat an elephant? You are right. Lot's of work. What can go wrong

[uncle_bob]

Hi

There's only just so much room on the roof. Unless you do something crazy (fold outs ...) there is some very finite max you can put up there. In addition, even if you did decide to go crazy, weight on the chassis will limit you as well.

Once you know your max solar, regardless of the size of the battery bank, that is your long term daily power usage limit (without running the generator). 400 to 800 W of solar is not an uncommon match up for 400AH of lithium.

Only you know your typical power usage. There's no way for the rest of us to *know* what will or will not work for you. That said, A/C on 400W / 400AH is going to be *very* brief. Better to fire up the generator for that part of it.

Not clear which device your 225A isolation manager is. Some devices with that rating are not a real good idea in this sort of setup .....

Bob

[JohnTF]

It's too late to ask for suggestions - you bought you list of stuff [ to my view mid grade stuff at too high price ] .
And as uncle bob mentions , you have not given any number of you load ?

So now your going to find out down the road .

The correct way of doing what you want , is to do an accounting of loads { FIRST } then see what power you can produce with the available space on roof .
Then in most cases you can not produce enough power / with the available roof space / so you have to eliminate enough of your load - to match the panels you can mount .

The Sun makes for 1,000 watts per sq. meter - under ideal conditions .
Average panel efficiency is about 22% - so you might produce about 200 watts per sq. meter .

Lord Kelvin quote ,
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Featured snippet from the web
“When you can measure what you are speaking about, and express it in numbers, you know something about it; but when you cannot measure it, when you cannot express it in numbers, your knowledge is of a meagre and unsatisfactory kind.”

[5280BDocker]

Gentlemen,

I have a set amount of real estate on the roof of my Interstate, The maximum that I have seen in other builds is 4 100W panels. You may be able to squeeze some thin panels in their and get a few more watts.

I have a finite space in my interior of the Interstate as well. The lithiums have to live there. I know I can get four in. Maybe six but the ratio between solar and batteries will be off. I can't charge them fast enough with 400 W panels.

So the load is a mute point. It is all about real estate. I am trying to maximize what I have. I am all ears if there is a better way.

Always my best,

Randy

[PB_NB]

I know it's sounds crazy but there is a guy on youtube that made some panels that go over your windows like shades and are basically flexible panels. Pretty light and portable but not like the ones sitting on the ground.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Al8rCydNiLs

[InterBlog]

Congrats on a major project undertaking. You haven't said where you plan to integrate all these components, and with your model of Interstate, you might not have much choice.

My husband and I did a DIY job in which we spliced our components into existing void space in our van. It probably quadrupled our labor-of-love, but we have an older Interstate with zero possibility of forfeiting precious storage space to the system - we need that space for cargo.

Anyway, here is a blog post series on that installation in case you are interested (ignore the older posts that became entrained in the search), and one image of our resulting lay-out:

[5280BDocker]

IB,

I am always impressed with your posts and ongoing activity with your AI. Your creativity always blows me away. I wish I had your innovation.

As for the model, I have a 2017 AI GT EXT. Which currently has 2 AGM's underneath and 1 100W flexible panel.

The current plan is to remove the AGM's, potentially the Generator. (Likely, I will keep it to see how it all goes first. I have an issue camping in pristine areas with a generator running. Just my issue. I have lot's of issues:-) Install 4 panels up top. I chose the Obsidians as they are lower profile. Install the Inverter, batteries and components in the back under the bed/sofa. Likely batteries on the curbside and Inverter on the drivers side. I have been viewing many videos including Chris's and Irene Iron Fitness. All the videos I find are really helpful.

So, I will see how it fits when I get home and decide to put the jigsaw puzzle together. Again thanks for the input and knowledge.

Keep it coming!

Randy

[uncle_bob]

Hi

Ok, so we have 400W worth of panels on the roof. They are not at an ideal angle to the sun. This impacts their efficiency. The sun is only up in the sky for some number of hours per day (based on time of year). Campsites may provide some (or a lot of ...) shade. The sky may be full of clouds (maybe on a regular basis). Panel efficiency (and voltage) varies with the temperature of the panel.

All of this makes coming up with a single number for "what will I get" pretty much impossible. The low end for a daily output will be zero (and that does happen). Wide open site/ good weather / summer time in the Great Lakes area might give you 4 or 5 hours times your peak output for daily kilowatt hours. July in the desert southwest could easily double that. Mid winter numbers can come in at half the peak summer numbers.

Taking this back to battery numbers: 4 hours times 400W is 1.6 KWH. At 14V into your Lithiums, that's 114 AH per day. Up in the northeast with 400W of panels, we are doing well if we get half that at a normal site. YMMV. Running average over a normal week will rarely make it above 60AH per day.

Bottom line is that with 50AH in per day, average use needs to be below that point *or* you need another power source (shore power / generator / alternator .....). This is *not* to say that 50A is your number under this or that set of conditions, only that it's a number I use.

Your A/C unit likely is up around 14A at 120V. Figure that the inverter will pull at least 140A off the batteries to supply this. Your entire daily power budget would be used up with about 20 minutes of A/C run time.

Lots of fun ....

Bob

[Rig Rat]

This looks like a possible solution for Interstate owners who need/want more solar w/o taking up additional roof space. They're not that expensive, are lighter, more compact and easier to store in our AI than a bulky solar suitcase.

You could deploy 400 W of these blankets via suction cups on the outside of your AI and move them in conjunction with the path of the sun.
Several other reviews of their use over time look encouraging for durability/reliability as well.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X9okCt4LGN8

[Rig Rat]

[QUOTE=5280BDocker;2387326]Hello all,

Since our acquisition of our 2017 GI GT, we have had a major road trip from Denver to Maine. Going off grid along the way. We are currently plugged in here at the Belgrade Lakes before our return in a few weeks.

We have easily come to the conclusion that the current stock configuration with solar and batteries is insufficient. We need to be off grid for multiple days. We plan to use this for trips to Alaska and the West and finding some nice Fly Fishing waters along the way. So, Upgrades here we come starting in August.

Below is our configuration. With the knowledge and support in this forum, hopefully you guys can set me straight if I left something off that I should add.

I always appreciate your support.

Randy

************************************************** *******
FWIW, Maybe you've already seen this.

[LB_3]

Originally Posted by InterBlog

Congrats on a major project undertaking. You haven't said where you plan to integrate all these components, and with your model of Interstate, you might not have much choice.

My husband and I did a DIY job in which we spliced our components into existing void space in our van. It probably quadrupled our labor-of-love, but we have an older Interstate with zero possibility of forfeiting precious storage space to the system - we need that space for cargo.

Anyway, here is a blog post series on that installation in case you are interested (ignore the older posts that became entrained in the search), and one image of our resulting lay-out:

To the OP, review the end of my battery adventures thread or the links IB provided for our pictorial schematics. You’ll see the functional equivalents of most of the system you’ve specified. Perhaps you’ll see something you overlooked. (Sterling B2B charger *cough* *cough*).

The Sterling Battery to Battery charger boosts your alternator voltage to a more friendly Lithium Voltage of 14.6v but more importantly provides a battery isolation and current limiting feature. It comes in two flavors (60A and 120A). We chose the 60A trying to limit the strain on our alternator.

You have the option of adding a dedicated alternator (*hint*). We couldn’t go that route because on the T1Ns, everyone that made an adapter bracket discontinued them because the harmonics in that location were causing them to fail. NCV3s don’t have that issue and the redundancy means if you burn out an alternator (from a high sustained load), it won’t leave you stranded. With a second alternator, I would advise ditching the generator.

I would also add a cheap 5A or 10A 12v 3 phase PWM battery charger (on a switch) so you can keep the chassis battery topped off by your solar to help feed all the energy vampires that might leave you stranded in the woods after a week in the woods with the glove box light or radio on.

[1919]

Just an observation, do you need a "Victron Smart Dongle" ?
The newer MPPT solar controller is bluetooth compatible out of the box, do need for a bluetooth dongle. Unless I am missing something.....

[PB_NB]

Originally Posted by Rig Rat

This looks like a possible solution for Interstate owners who need/want more solar w/o taking up additional roof space. They're not that expensive, are lighter, more compact and easier to store in our AI than a bulky solar suitcase.

You could deploy 400 W of these blankets via suction cups on the outside of your AI and move them in conjunction with the path of the sun.
Several other reviews of their use over time look encouraging for durability/reliability as well.

That's pretty cool! I can see these working for many systems where the roof areas are small.