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Old 03-05-2012, 08:48 AM   #201
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I've read testimonials from many happy customers. But I'm still looking for the stories of law suits against Can-Am. Hmmm... The courts are mysteriously silent.

Hmmm...
Mysteriously?
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Old 03-05-2012, 09:34 AM   #202
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Seems that there are a stubborn few who refuse to believe that you can modify a vehicle for better performance whether it be for speed, braking, handling, off-roading, racing or even towing. Adding higher load tires and wheels, trans coolers, bigger radiators and batteries are all towing modifications. Beefing up a hitch with larger bolts or frame supports fits in that modification category too.
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Old 03-05-2012, 11:44 AM   #203
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Mysteriously?
Yeah, for years the naysayers of Can-Am have called down doom and gloom to their customers who use smaller vehicles set-up by Can-Am for towing Airstreams. You should have heard the screaming and condemnation on the Airstream Usenet group around 15 years ago when they set-up a Dodge Intrepid for towing. There were things said like "Wait for the lawsuits from the accidents caused by dangerously underpowered tow vehicles...lawyers, insurance companies, etc." and similar "the sky is falling" types of prophesies.

I can appreciate people being concerned over safety issues. But the people at Can-AM are not stupid and have been dealing with these issues since cars were first downsized in the 1970s. Even after all these years, the courts are mysteriously silent from those predicted lawsuits. And Can-Am keeps producing happy customers. If they are doing such a bad job that is guaranteed to fail, where are the lawsuits?

Maybe Can-Am customers are perhaps more conscientious about safely driving their rig than a "normal" RV owner. Maybe they take fewer chances or something. But AFAIK, Can-Am hasn't been involved in court battles for what they are doing. And an unhappy customer is who you usually hear from first, they seem to be the most vocal as opposed to a contented customer.

I'm just sayin'...

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Old 03-05-2012, 01:36 PM   #204
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Originally Posted by mojo View Post
Seems that there are a stubborn few who refuse to believe that you can modify a vehicle for better performance whether it be for speed, braking, handling, off-roading, racing or even towing. Adding higher load tires and wheels, trans coolers, bigger radiators and batteries are all towing modifications. Beefing up a hitch with larger bolts or frame supports fits in that modification category too.
Yes, nothing mysterious about that, nothing at all.
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Old 03-05-2012, 03:12 PM   #205
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Beyond the possible legal implications of having an accident with an undersized vehicle, I prefer to have a margin of error that I don't feel is offered by pulling a trailer that exceeds a vehicle's recommended tow rating. There are enough things to think about when traveling with 4 kids without adding something else to the mix.

Going back to Marinablue's original question, we started out with an Astro van pulling our '64 Overlander. All we did was tow it home from where we bought it in Ohio and it wasn't a pleasant trip, but I now know that the problem was more related to the hitch we were using than the size of the tow vehicle. By the time we had the Overlander fixed up enough to travel we had a 1500 Suburban which worked well for us, although there were times going up hill when I would have liked a little more power. Now with our F-350 pulling the Sovereign we've admittedly got more tow vehicle than we really need, but it sure is nice to drive.

When it came to picking a truck we started with the need for seating for six (including four teenagers), and added in the desire for an 8' box for the truck camper and hauling other stuff around. I grew up driving full sized pickup trucks on the farm and it just didn't seem right to get one that wouldn't take a full sheet of plywood. We could have got away with a 3/4 ton truck, but then we might have been a bit undersized for the truck camper, especially if we ever decided to get a bigger one.
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Old 03-05-2012, 03:39 PM   #206
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I prefer to have a margin of error that I don't feel is offered by pulling a trailer that exceeds a vehicle's recommended tow rating. There are enough things to think about when traveling with 4 kids without adding something else to the mix.
Everyone's situation is different. We don't have 4 kids and otherwise travel light. We look at our "margin of error" differently. The Can Am setup and our vehicle's exceptional overall performance with or without the trailer in tow in our mind relates to a BTA safety factor.
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Old 03-06-2012, 11:04 PM   #207
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Old 03-07-2012, 06:14 AM   #208
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Thumbs down

Your entertaining yourselves gang...the original poster is so confused she abandoned you.

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Old 04-13-2012, 08:32 AM   #209
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I had my 1/2 ton Surburban on exactly three trips before I pulled the back end out of it towing my 24 footer.
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Old 04-13-2012, 09:03 AM   #210
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For me, it's not about brand or vehicle configuration, or whether CanAm does a good job at what they do...it is strictly about specs and ratings.
Professionally, I know, without doubt, that exceeding manufacturers ratings (significantly) will, at a minimum reduce the longevity of MANY components of the vehicle.

Secondarily, you must be willing to accept the possibility of the words in the following article. (there are others out there, google "liability in towing overloaded" or your favorite phrase.)

TRAILER TOWING ILLEGALLY
DZN, coming from the aviation industry it's pretty simple. We have specs and we follow them. If we don't, things break (like wings), and lawyers get really happy in trial. (Unless of course they are on the defense side). I'll follow the manufacturer recommendations every time.
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Old 04-13-2012, 09:07 AM   #211
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DZN, coming from the aviation industry it's pretty simple. We have specs and we follow them. If we don't, things break (like wings), and lawyers get really happy in trial. (Unless of course they are on the defense side). I'll follow the manufacturer recommendations every time.
Well, that makes 2 of us!
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Old 04-13-2012, 09:08 AM   #212
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Legality gets really interesting once a jury is thrown into the mix (trust me on this one). It's hard to look past personal preferences and get to "what is this going to do to me if I ever have a bad accident and I am at fault"? And so I will tell you. The only thing that matters in the end is what the manufacturer specs say.
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Old 04-13-2012, 09:12 AM   #213
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Well, that makes 2 of us!
Brilliant minds? hahaha.
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Old 04-13-2012, 09:17 AM   #214
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Old 04-13-2012, 04:30 PM   #215
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If you understand, no explanation is needed; if you have to ask, no expanation is possible! I simply love towing with my GMC dually! I love the diesel growl, I love the comfort of the crew cab, I love the power, I love the handling, I love the looks, I love the mpg, - I even love that "big butt" look and I think that it looks great hooked up to the Airstream!
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Old 04-13-2012, 05:57 PM   #216
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i used to pull my 30 ft with a half ton pickup just had to run it in drive instead of overdrive. But i retired it to just a plow truck and bought a 1 ton dually pickup and i love it, but i also had no problem with the half ton just didnt get in any hurry with it and it was fine. Just want to make sure it has a hitch under it
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Old 04-13-2012, 06:54 PM   #217
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DZN, coming from the aviation industry it's pretty simple. We have specs and we follow them. If we don't, things break (like wings), and lawyers get really happy in trial. (Unless of course they are on the defense side). I'll follow the manufacturer recommendations every time.
The two don't compare. SAE ratings are not at all the same thing. They have no force of law, for starters (coming from a captive group of engineers), and the ratings are obviously about keeping tow ratings restricted to a profitable vehicle type while ignoring almost all others. Then the testing is rigged by vehicles towed and conditions equally rigged. For some trailers under some conditions the SAE J2807 rating is valid. It otherwise has holes big enough to drive a truck right through. As a guideline set it is a huge disappointment.

1T DRW pickups get used by LTL and oilfield hotshot -- trucks "rated" for a 21k GVWR -- for 300k miles with 24k trailers. A 9,000-lb flatbed trailer with a 16,000-lb load on it. Day in, and day out, 24/7/365 for three to five years. Might have to replace an automatic tranmission a time or two.

The single (valid) concern is tire rating. Second is axle rating. Keep an eye on those and the rest comes right along. Law enforcement looks to just these things. Precedents are established, and it is not with what a private individual feels comfortable recommending (the vehicle manufacturer).

What CAN AM does today the rest of us did all through the 1960's and '70's. If one doesn't want to, then, fine. For those who do not wish to pay an extraordinary amount for a TV -- up front and mile-by-mile -- and who want one that has better handling, braking, economy and the rest, then there are alternatives to what the industry points us at. With a long and well understood way of doing just that.

TV recommendation comes down to use. Full time is different than a vacationer is different than a family is different than a couple. A big variety of uses, and of users.

.
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Old 04-13-2012, 07:17 PM   #218
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Your entertaining yourselves gang...the original poster is so confused she abandoned you.

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Old 04-13-2012, 07:22 PM   #219
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So who is speaking to them (any longer)?
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Old 04-13-2012, 09:49 PM   #220
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Thanks for some clarification RED'. Unfortunate that towing discussions get sidetracked by legal warnings without substance when "bigger" runs out of steam.

We spend half the year away from home with our Airstream and do not need a vehicle capable of towing two Airstreams. We need it for one trailer (not for half a trailer nor two trailers) and a good daily driver.

Enjoy all towing threads but repeated legal warnings contribute nothing to the discussion.

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