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Old 11-28-2022, 03:58 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by scho7623 View Post
I haven’t considered an SUV as my TV. Does an SUV like Ford Expedition have sufficient payload capacity for the 23’ AS? I can also look it up, but wanted to ask if you had any issues with the payload capacity. We are just two adults probably weigh ~300lbs together, no kids, no pets.
There are a number of full-sized SUVs that will be fine for the task. Payload for the Expo differs depending on options.
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Old 11-28-2022, 03:59 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by SlowPokePete View Post
I would say you are good to go with most 1/2 ton pickups or equivalent SUV (towing capacity AND payload being considered) with a 23 footer.

At 25' and up, payload on many 1/2 tons and SUV's become an issue...I tow my 25' GT with a Tundra and would definitely prefer a larger margin in terms of payload. For the time being, this is what I've got to work with as I don't have $70k to buy the F-250/350 I would like to replace it with.

That said, one thing to consider is whether or not you will move to a larger sized Airstream in the future ...bumping up to a 25' also gets you the wider trailer, and I know many folks end up going with something bigger after their original purchase.

If this is potentially the case, I would go straight to a 3/4 ton truck, or find a 1/2 ton with sufficient payload to not be right at the limit for a bigger trailer.

SPP
I don’t anticipate upgrading to a bigger rig at least for ~5 years. What are some popular SUVs other AS owners use as their TV?
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Old 11-28-2022, 04:02 PM   #23
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Lots of people recommend a mid sized SUV for a 23. There are many choices, including Audi, MW, and Mercedes. Especially if the OP doesn’t otherwise want or need a pickup for other (non towing) duties.
This will be my only vehicle and I’d like to use it as a daily vehicle as well. So I think an SUV can be a good option. Do you have any recommendations?
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Old 11-28-2022, 04:32 PM   #24
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And the you can’t tow with anything but a Klingon battle cruiser sized diesel pickup truck crew has arrived. Towed a 34’ footer with a 3500 ford van. You’ll be just fine with a half ton pickup or equivalent.
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Old 11-28-2022, 04:40 PM   #25
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I have the same vehicle but 2021 and am happy towing with a Lexus GX460. Smaller than a truck (which was desirable to us) but capable of 6,500 pounds.
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Old 11-28-2022, 04:53 PM   #26
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Originally Posted by scho7623 View Post
I haven’t considered an SUV as my TV. Does an SUV like Ford Expedition have sufficient payload capacity for the 23’ AS? I can also look it up, but wanted to ask if you had any issues with the payload capacity. We are just two adults probably weigh ~300lbs together, no kids, no pets.
As long as you get a SUV such as the Suburban/Tahoe, Expedition/Expedition Max or Nissan Armada with the max tow package, you should be good with a 23' trailer. Expect a payload of around 1500# with one of them and a max towing capacity of 7500 - 8500#

The Wagoneer/Grand Wagoneer are another option but they have notoriously low payload (1200 to 1300# is not unheard of) even though they have a high towing capacity (up to 10,000#)

Like others have said, since a 23' trailer has a max weight of 6000# so you could also get by with a luxury European SUV such as a Audi Q7, MB GLS/E, or BMW X5. Most have a max trailer weight of 7000# - 7500# but you may need to have the hitch strengthened to support the tongue weight and WD hitch.
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Old 11-28-2022, 05:08 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by scho7623 View Post
This will be my only vehicle and I’d like to use it as a daily vehicle as well. So I think an SUV can be a good option. Do you have any recommendations?
I am a fan of pickup trucks for work vehicles, but not for this purpose. They bring with them too many compromises IMO. I had many SUVs that towed this weight of trailer. The best towing one was a BMW X5. I also had an X3, two Ford Explorers, and two Ford Expeditions, but those last two are larger than you need, again IMO.

I like the BMW, and Audi. I think some Mercedes models can work very well. Several years back I would have included VW, but not now. I would consider some Ford and GM models, not so much the Stellantis products. Any mid size SUV with appropriate specs can work at this towing weight, as long as you are willing to manage your cargo and not try and take everything with you on every trip. And selecting a pickup doesn't guarantee that it has sufficient capacity, it has to be spec'd for it. A friend towed an AS27 with a RAM 1500. His pickup had several hundred pounds less payload capacity than my 3 series BMW, and he eventually sold it and went to a heavy duty pickup.

There is a group of Airstream owners who believe that a pickup is the first and last answer for towing. While pickups can work well, they just aren't necessary unless you need the high cargo capacity. You will tend to get a lot of recommendations that aren't specific to your use. The fact that you will have one vehicle and it needs to serve more than one purpose. Whether you drive in a city or somewhere with more space. How long will your Airstream trips be, several weeks or several months. How many passengers will come along. All that figures into it.

Cheers

Jeff
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Old 11-28-2022, 05:54 PM   #28
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Just switched from an F150 to an F250. What a difference. If you can get one grab it. More than likely you get a larger Airstream down the line. So go bigger without th the F250.
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Old 11-28-2022, 05:59 PM   #29
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Originally Posted by jeffb831 View Post
The Wagoneer/Grand Wagoneer are another option but they have notoriously low payload (1200 to 1300# is not unheard of) even though they have a high towing capacity (up to 10,000#)
My Wagoneer's door sticker says "combined weight of occupants and cargo is 1446 lbs". I have a 23FB on order and I plan on towing it with my Wagoneer.
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Old 11-28-2022, 06:23 PM   #30
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On the contrary, I own two Teslas, a 2020 Model S and 2022 Model X. Would never consider either one of them as a useful TV for either one of my airstreams. Or my gooseneck livestock trailer.

But thanks for confirming what what chapter and verse we're on in the hymnal.
I apologize. I stopped reading that rambling, mocking post rather quickly and missed the part where you mentioned your love of Tesla.

I'll force myself to finish such posts in the future.
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Old 11-28-2022, 09:17 PM   #31
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The GM full-size SUVs (Tahoe, Yukon, Suburban) are good TVs. I tow a 25FB with a short-wheelbase Yukon. We enjoy the better maneuverability and comfortable ride compared to the half-ton pickups.

I carry a fair bit of gear in the Yukon, and with the heavy tongue weight of the 25FB I'm maxed out on payload. My Yukon would be very good for a 23.

I have seen payload stickers for late-model GM SUVs ranging from 1428 on a max-optioned Yukon Denali to 1780 for a no-options base model Tahoe.

(Full disclosure: it's time to retire the Yukon, and we'll being going with a half-ton pickup this time, mainly for increased payload. I will miss the Yukon.)
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Old 11-29-2022, 12:51 AM   #32
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Originally Posted by propchef View Post
I apologize. I stopped reading that rambling, mocking post rather quickly and missed the part where you mentioned your love of Tesla.

I'll force myself to finish such posts in the future.
Obviously you didn't dismiss the post right away as you claim, since you took the time to quote the entire thing, comment on it and then comment on the second post.

But nonetheless apology accepted, it takes a big person to admit that they must force themselves to overcome attention deficits. But with a little practice, and remembering that reading is fundamental, you'll get there. And you'll make us all so proud when you do.
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Old 11-29-2022, 01:28 AM   #33
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I initially towed our 2015 23D International Serenity with my 2007 Mercedes ML320 CDI turbo diesel. The torque was great and we got 16 mpg towing at 55 mph which was the sweet spot for the drivetrain. The third gasket failure at 207,000 miles retired the Mercedes as the repair was more than three times the cars value.

We now tow the 23D with a 2021 Toyota Land Cruiser which has the 5.7L v8 coupled to a 8 speed transmission. I get similar mileage (11 to 12+ mpg on gasoline) to our 2012 Ram 2500HD Cummins towing our 31' Classic. That rig sales 19,200 pounds.
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Old 11-29-2022, 04:47 AM   #34
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2019 Expedition

Have a 2011 23’ FC FB. love how the expedition with the heavy duty tow package performs. I prefer a SUV over a pickup. Have towed from Arizona to Banff and all points in between. Never have an issue with hills, up or down. Expedition is rated to pull 9000 LBS. 900 LB. Hitch weight. The 23’ weighs 6000 LB with a 600 LB hitch weight

One downside of an SUV is carrying a generator, must convert to propane

As others have said, if you think you might go larger then the expedition is not the vehicle. 23’ has many advantages
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Old 11-29-2022, 06:28 AM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scho7623 View Post
This will be my only vehicle and I’d like to use it as a daily vehicle as well. So I think an SUV can be a good option. Do you have any recommendations?
I tow with a Dodge Durango R/T Tow N Go. It is a great tow vehicle. It, along with the R/T or SRT trims, would be a great match for the 23FB.
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Old 11-29-2022, 07:39 AM   #36
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Originally Posted by propchef View Post
I apologize. I stopped reading that rambling, mocking post rather quickly and missed the part where you mentioned your love of Tesla.

I'll force myself to finish such posts in the future.
I did the same thing. I thought, “man this person really hates Tesla”, and “why add it here?” Then stopped reading it.
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Old 11-29-2022, 10:28 PM   #37
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There are plenty of EV forums you can go and expound on your knowledge.

Actually, the OP might like towing with a Tesla.
I've considered an EV, but then quickly realized how often I'd have to visit the charging station, and that was enough to stop considering an EV as an option.
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Old 11-30-2022, 03:06 AM   #38
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I'm pulling with a Ram 3500 with a Cummins. But if I were towing a 23' TT I'd be using a Jeep Gladiator Sport with max tow package. It has better payload than a Ford F150, and the same tow capacity. The torque is astonishing. In fact, that's what we towed with when we had a 22' Caravel. Steep downhills were no problem either; it has tow mode. There's a reason you see so many of them at the International Rallies.
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Old 11-30-2022, 03:35 AM   #39
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We ordered our 23’ in 2021. After a lot of research (here and elsewhere), we ordered an F-150 in 2021. We had to order it because none of the trucks on the lot had the options we wanted and the payload we needed. I’m very glad that we got it when we did because we got both the max tow package and heavy duty payload package. Payload is 2406.
We are newbies at towing a trailer and my main concern was towing the trailer safely. That’s why we went with the numbers (payload, towing capacity, etc.) and decided to go with the truck vs cutting it close with another vehicle.
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Old 11-30-2022, 07:55 AM   #40
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We tow our 2013 AS23D International with a 2019 Ford Ranger Lariat SuperCrew. I am completely satisfied with this combination. We took it on a trip last May from Oregon to the east coast and back - 8500 miles in all - and it performed flawlessly including through Colorado mountain passes where speed up and down was primarily dictated by prudent speeds on curves. The 10-speed transmission with tow mode makes efficient use of the available HP & torque. We got 13.5 MPG over the complete trip, 14.5 going east and 12.5 going west. The 23D tongue weight is 170 lbs more than the 23FB which would give you that much more capacity. Our yellow sticker indicates 1378 lbs capacity which was enough for us. Fully loaded for a 6-week trip we had all axles within load limits. We don’t take everything we own with us though, so depending on how you define camping this might not be enough. The Ranger is a great daily driver though, which was one of our criteria for a tow vehicle.
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