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Old 03-23-2006, 07:01 PM   #21
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Lightbulb Same old thinking.....

Porky, if you read the link I posted you may want to look at this again

Time
Time and the elements weaken a trailer tire.
In about 3 years roughly one third of the tire's strength is gone.
Three to five years is the projected life of a normal trailer tire.
It is suggested that trailer tires be replaced after 3 to 4 years of service regardless of tread depth or tire appearance.
Mileage
Trailer tires are not designed to wear out.
The life of a trailer tire is limited by time and duty cycles.
The mileage expectation of a trailer tire would be 5,000 to 12,000 miles.

If you read the article & consider the recommendation to size the trailer tire you choose at essentially 80% when new; then consider that the life is reduced by 1/3 under normal conditions by the third year, where does that leave you?

The conventional thinking that applies to passenger car tires does not apply to trailer tires.... a trailer tire can look o.k. w/ no sidewall cracks & plenty of tread left, but be at the end of its' life

By the way, for those Forum members who have not purchased tires at Discount Tire before.... if you buy the Road Hazard coverage when you purchase the tire, Discount will replace the tire for FREE w/ no treadwear adjustment for the life of the tire (which I imagine would be 3 years on the Carlisle brand).

Is it really worth risking possible significant damage to your trailer from a shredded tire at highway speed to go another year?

Discount Tire Co. is one of the few tire retailers with the b*lls in my opinion to publish sound advice on their website.

I pick when to gamble when I want to take a chance..... towing a trailer is not one of those times
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Old 03-23-2006, 07:57 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Jarzabek
If you read the article & consider the recommendation to size the trailer tire you choose at essentially 80% when new; then consider that the life is reduced by 1/3 under normal conditions by the third year, where does that leave you?
What does "size the trailer tire you choose at essentially 80% when new" mean?

Whant are "normal" conditions?
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Old 03-23-2006, 08:21 PM   #23
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From the experts....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Porky Pig
What does "size the trailer tire you choose at essentially 80% when new" mean?

Whant are "normal" conditions?
"The combined capacity of all of the tires should exceed the loaded trailer weight by 20 percent."

Easier for me to derate the load capacity of the tire by 20%.....

"Time
Time and the elements weaken a trailer tire.
In about 3 years roughly one third of the tire's strength is gone.
Three to five years is the projected life of a normal trailer tire.
It is suggested that trailer tires be replaced after 3 to 4 years of service regardless of tread depth or tire appearance."

Self -explanatory and based on average use which I assume means not exceeding the total estimated actual tire life when utilized at a speed not exceeding the maximum rating of the tire (65 m.p.h. for an ST trailer tire).

For example, if a person towed on the freeway for the majority of a trailer tire life in excess of 65 m.p.h. during typical summer vacation time, the expected life of the tire would be expected to be reduced....

Again, I would read the attachment in its' entirety.....

People often read things, disagree with a point or two, and then ponder that point out of context.....
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Old 03-23-2006, 08:53 PM   #24
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I will run a trailer tire "no more" than 5 years changing them out sometime in their fith year. The tires always "look" good but the damage caused by a blow out can far exceed 4 tires.
I prefer to drive 55 to 60 on the highway but most of the time will run between 60 and 65 trying to keep others from getting road rage and doing something stupid.
Most of the time I use bias tires load range "E".

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Old 03-23-2006, 09:37 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by overlander63
If you fell you must, you can go with an LT tire, of the same size and load range you are replacing. If you do this, LT tires are speed rated for 75, and you should replace the tires even more frequently than you already would. If you would normally replace your tires after 5 years, do it after 3.
Why do you feel LT tires should be replaced more frequently?
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Old 03-23-2006, 09:41 PM   #26
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greeting retreads and well worn....

goodyear has/is bringing out a new/better rv tire........

with MORE breakdown protection in the compound....from ozone, uv, heat, water and so on....

it is supposed to be good for 5 years......without covers......

i guess that's better

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Old 03-23-2006, 10:27 PM   #27
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That website of Discount Tire is interesting reading but, I am of the opinion it is only about 50% accurate. The engineering design standards for tires is so far in excess of their recommendations, it is not funny. Expensive yes. I would listen a lot closer if it were Goodyear, Michelin, or Bridgestone vs. Carlisle or Discount tire.

If you want to buy as much safety and prudent judgement as you can, then (1) buy radials that are designed to reduce heat buildup (Michelin invention in 1949)
(2) buy ST's & load no heavier than 75-80% of sidewall rating,
(3) never run underinflated from what is on the sidewall,
(4) buy a pressure monitoring system (90% of tires failures are reportedly due to loss of pressure due to debris and resulting belt separations)
(4) switch to LT(light truck) 16" tires found on the 350 turbo diesels (80psi) which requires new wheels,
(6) switch to steel/steel truck tires (1steel ply/3steel belts/natural rubber carcass) typically found on delivery trucks or motorhomes.

Whenever I stop, I alway walk to the trailer and use the back of my hand to check each tire. If the tire feels more than slightly warm to the touch, then I want to know why. I check the rim flange to see if brake heat is raising the tire temp. Also, temperature will vary on the sunny side of the trailer.
I tow at 58-62mph, check inflation regularly, keep my brakes adjusted, etc. If the tire doesn't run too hot, then the carcass/belt fatigue factor should be a much longer life than 12,000 miles. That number destroys the credibility of the article to me.

I just replaced my tires at seven years with LR D ST225/75R15 trailer tires. (7300lbs-605lbs tongue/10160= 66% load factor)

Tires are more common sense than rocket science.

Just my $.02
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Old 03-24-2006, 12:12 AM   #28
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Does this cover covered/ non-used spares too?

Hi all -

Great info here!

My spare (new 1 year ago) lives up underneath the trialer in a very well insulated location. It has not, so far - knock wood! - ever seen the road in use.

Would these recommendations apply to such a tire as well in your opinion? ie. essentially dead and needing to be replaced with the other 6 tires on my rig.

Thanks for the thoughts.

Axel
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Old 03-24-2006, 04:36 AM   #29
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Am I the only one that thinks it is interesting the a tire company says change your tires often?! Reminds me of my car dealer who wanted to service my tranmission at 33K when the owners manual says no sooner than 50K and 100K in most instances. The car dealer just recommends it. Hum, wonder why....

From all I have heard and read, five years is a good rule. Like all rules, there are exceptions that consider specific towing conditions.

I guess Discount tires has some trailer tires it needs to move......
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Old 03-24-2006, 05:01 AM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ticki2
Why do you feel LT tires should be replaced more frequently?
LT tires don't have the same amount of "anti-aging" compounds in them (sounds like an ad for face cream), and tend to weather check, or deteriorate, faster than ST tires, which have a higher level of those chemicals. An ST tire that is 5 years old will have some weather checking, and look like it should be replaced. An LT (or P type, also) that has sat around the same length of time, will look like, well, it has been out in the sun too long. Weather checking will be much more severe, and deeper, weakening the tire.
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Old 03-24-2006, 05:09 AM   #31
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Lightbulb No offense Paul....

Quote:
Originally Posted by luckydc
Am I the only one that thinks it is interesting the a tire company says change your tires often?! Reminds me of my car dealer who wanted to service my tranmission at 33K when the owners manual says no sooner than 50K and 100K in most instances. The car dealer just recommends it. Hum, wonder why....

From all I have heard and read, five years is a good rule. Like all rules, there are exceptions that consider specific towing conditions.

I guess Discount tires has some trailer tires it needs to move......
I disagree with your train of thought on "preventative maintainance"

I would expect my transmission to fail before 100,000 miles if I waited that long to service it....

If that is how you take care of your vehicles, I can see your reasoning it being suspicious in Discount Tire Co. just wanting to "sell tires"...

Old habits die hard, new information is just not accepted by some
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Old 03-24-2006, 05:48 AM   #32
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Interesting thread and discussion here. My experience tells me that 65 mph is a safe towing speed for my setup. I had one tire appear to be headed for failure as I did my "Preflight" inspection as it showed a bulge in the sidewall. It was replaced prior to flight. On another occasion, thankfully right after I installed my PRESSURE PRO, I had a failure on the road. The P.P. gave me immediate confirmation of a problem and allowed me to slow to a stop prior to any damage to the trailer. Examination of the tire indicated that the failure may have been due to running over an 'Alligator' cast off from an 18-wheeler. A small wire from the Gator had penetrated the cord, allowing air between the cords and up into the sidewall causing it to fail (according to the tire dealer). It was summertime and I was running with 65psi (cold) and at 70mph which may not have helped at all in this case. Ever since, I cruise at 65mph. I find myself giving a large gap between myself and the vehicle ahead so I can try to avoid the chugholes common at bridge expansion joints where the highway meets the bridge and also to avoid materials like the 'Alligators' on the highway (superslabs). Travel at 55mph seems a little extreme and dangerous if you're out on an Interstate highway, with or without flashing lights. Maybe off the main road, 55mph would be acceptable. I have a problem with folks driving well under the posted limits and hope that they would have reflective strips on their bumpers for night travel. Thanks for sharing all of your experiences and thoughts here.
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Old 03-24-2006, 06:47 AM   #33
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Drivers in the U.S. should read this link

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pschoerrn
Speed limit is my word of the day!! In Germany you can go as fast as you can on most highways, when you are in a car. BUT as soon as you have a trailer behind you are allowed to go only a max. of 49 mph or a max. of 62 mph, depending on your trailer and your TV. 62 mph is restricted to the specific Trailer-TV Combo, so other trailer or other TV then 49 mph.
All bigger Trucks (16500 lbs and up) are restricted to go only 49 mph.

And guess what - we are doing fine with it.

If you want to speed, leave your trailer at home and go a 150 mph if you want, but as soon as you have a trailer behind - slow down! Its not only safer for you, it also is for the others on the road!!

Just my 02.Cents



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We here in the U.S. are just plain stubborn and often highly resistant to change our driving habits as a result

Even when drivers in the U.K. have restrictions on vehicles towing caravans (travel trailers) that are logically based

Some Forum members will disagree with the information contained in this link.....

@ http://www.highwaycode.gov.uk/09.htm

I am content to continue puttering down the road safely at 55 m.p.h. which I might add, is above the minimum posted speed limit on Federal highways of 45 to 50 m.p.h.
I have great respect for something that has survived for longer than I have been alive, and I am not in too much of a hurry to see that it makes it thru another day!
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Old 03-24-2006, 07:30 AM   #34
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Confusion

Ok, I read the Discount Tire thing, and ran across some confusing statements. Like the following:
  • Trailer tires are designed for use on trailer axle positions only, not for the loads applied to or the traction required by drive or steering axles.
  • An "LT" designation on a trailer tire size specifies load range only. It is not designed for use on light trucks.
  • Do not mount "ST" or "LT" trailer tires on passenger cars or light trucks.
I'm ok with the first bullet.

The second bullet point just doesn't make sense. What does "LT" designation mean? I thought LT meant "Light Truck" tire. If it isn't designed to be used on a light truck, what does it mean?

Same with the second part of the third item. I understand not mounting ST tires on a passenger car or light truck, but why can't "LT" trailer tires be used on a light truck.

I think they need to define what a "LT" trailer tire is.

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Old 03-24-2006, 07:50 AM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by luckydc
Am I the only one that thinks it is interesting the a tire company says change your tires often?!
Paul ... you are not alone.

Ford says to change the oil in my Powerstoke every 7,500 miles ... every dealer I've been to wants to change it at 3,000.

Blackstone (oil analysis) says I can go longer after my last sample that had 4,000 miles on it. ("With wear looking this good, you could add some miles to your oil use, if interested.")

Gee, I wonder if the dealer is just trying to sell me an oil change?
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Old 03-24-2006, 08:32 AM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by overlander63
An LT (or P type, also) that has sat around the same length of time, will look like, well, it has been out in the sun too long. Weather checking will be much more severe, and deeper, weakening the tire.
I just replaced a set (LTs) last season, when I checked the manufacturing codes on the sidewalls, and learned that they were 9 years old. they looked brand new. I hadn't put alot of miles on them; don't think the PO (who told me that they were "recent") did either...both of us used the trailer for weekend trips, half a dozen times a year. not "high mileage" travelers. I've even gotten unsolicited comments from neighbors at campsites saying "new tires, eh?".
either the tires weren't as "recent" as the PO remembered, or they were sitting in some warehouse for a long time when he bought them.
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Old 03-24-2006, 09:23 AM   #37
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Jim:

I don't want to get into a argument with, but I did not say I would not service my transmission until 100K. Also, I would apprecaite your not generalizing about "We here in the U.S.." Feel free to speak for yourself but not for me.
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Old 03-24-2006, 10:25 AM   #38
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If we're going to do as other countrys do, then maybe we should start towing with Intrepids? Or are we going to just ask around until we find someone who agrees with us and then take their advice?

I also wonder about the wisdom of taking all my advice on when to change my tires from Discount Tires. After all, their primary purppose is to sell you more tires, as often as possible.

With regular maintenance I don't think blowouts are all that common. If they were an epidemic, we'd hear a lot more about it here. It seems like with 10k members we hear once or twice a year about a blowout, and usually about someone someone knows had it. I'd say whatever we're doing is working for us pretty good.

Of course, this is the kind of thing where the person sending out the warning can always say 'I told you so' when it happens, but blowouts can happen anytime from damage from road debris or other equipment failures or flaws in the individual tire, so nothing you can ever do will protect you completely.

Why don't we just agree to take whichever precautions seem reasonable to us, and let it go at that?
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Old 03-24-2006, 11:25 AM   #39
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Uh....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stefrobrts
If we're going to do as other countrys do, then maybe we should start towing with Intrepids? Or are we going to just ask around until we find someone who agrees with us and then take their advice?

I also wonder about the wisdom of taking all my advice on when to change my tires from Discount Tires. After all, their primary purppose is to sell you more tires, as often as possible.

With regular maintenance I don't think blowouts are all that common. If they were an epidemic, we'd hear a lot more about it here. It seems like with 10k members we hear once or twice a year about a blowout, and usually about someone someone knows had it. I'd say whatever we're doing is working for us pretty good.

Of course, this is the kind of thing where the person sending out the warning can always say 'I told you so' when it happens, but blowouts can happen anytime from damage from road debris or other equipment failures or flaws in the individual tire, so nothing you can ever do will protect you completely.

Why don't we just agree to take whichever precautions seem reasonable to us, and let it go at that?
Uh.... people in other countries don't tow with Intrepids, that would be "experts" from our country. But, because towing speed limit & safe stopping information from a link I posted came from the UK it should be disregarded

Before you "question" the motivation of Discount Tire as just mere profit, you may want consider the relatively responsible position of the largest (by volume sales) tire retailer in the nation that, incidentally, offers "free replacement" coverage. Maybe the company knows a little bit more than most of us

What constitutes "regular maintainance" in your opinion? Certainly not what is professionally recommended

I am not one to say "I told you so"

"Blowouts" attributed to travel tire failure as a result of travel tire continued service past the professional recommended life of the tire are preventable

And, as a nation, WE speed down the road way too often.....

Are you old enough to remember when the national speed limit was 55 m.p.h.? If you want to try a conspiracy theory on; how about the fact that the faster we drive, the more fuel we consume & the more carbon dioxide & monoxide we produce, which lead to more greenhouse emmisions that contribute to global warming....
Discount Tire did not post a record 13 billion dollar profit from the last quarter of 2005...


But, we don't want to get into that because that is a political subject
I started this thread just to pass along professional advice along with my opinion.... If you want to challenge the professional advice I reference, perhaps it would be prudent to offer professional advice from other sources

Personal beliefs never change unless new information is received, processed, and evaluated

I, for one, try to keep my mind open......
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Old 03-24-2006, 02:16 PM   #40
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So far I haven't received any response from Discount Tire relating for further information regarding the statement that the ST tire loses 1/3 of its strength after 3 years. Obviously we would all like to understand how the term "strength" translates to issues like load limits, or other items relative to towing.

I did send the same question to Goodyear and asked an additional question again relating to the mileage design limits of the Marathon ST tires. I'll let you all know what kind of answers I get back.

Regards,

Jack
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