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Old 10-21-2003, 08:15 AM   #1
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I'm not a happy camper....

As most of you know I ordered a 2004 30' Classic Slide Out a few weeks back. We had looked at a used 34' Cllassic Slide a few weeks earlier but pretty much ruled it out since the hitch receiver that came with my new van has a 1000 lbs limit.

According to the brochure I got from my dealer the hitch weight for the 30' is 900 lbs. so we went ahead and placed the order. Much to my displeasure, I went prowling around the Airstream web site and found that the 2004 units have increased to 1125 lbs. So much for my receiver being adequate.

I haven't priced replacing the receiver but it looks like I'll also need to put replace the spring bars and I'll have to look at the hitch itself also. Needless to say I'm not very happy about the situation.

Jack
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Old 10-21-2003, 09:08 AM   #2
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See if you can get the dealer/Airstream to eat it since the supplied specs were wrong. Point out that the weights advertised were one of the deciding factors. Threaten to cancel the order because of the extra expense that your going to incure do to their advertised inacuracy's
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Old 10-21-2003, 09:47 AM   #3
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Jack,

It is worth a shot but I would bet they will point to this statement at the bottom of the spec PDF.

"Specifications are subject to change without notice. Check with your dealer"

Yeah, right.

I would start with BT and see if they can help you out.
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Old 10-21-2003, 09:56 AM   #4
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Jack,

Where on the wesite did you find that info...the info I saw on the A/S site still had it under 1000 lbs.

Plus, on the 3/4 ton units with trailer pkg, I was under the impression that GM didn't have serveral different versions of the heavier class hitch/receivers. Dad's 3/4 Silverado has a 1200lb hitch weight.

The Reese on my Impala is rated at 1200 when using weight distribution......

If in the end the info is correct I agree with Eric (Toaster) that Airstream should make an concession here given the misinfo. Funny that I had just sent Streamer a PM regarding some improvements and one of them was clearly to have the info on the web updated and have the same info in all the places (understanding that specs changes without notice sometimes), the web should have always been up to date from day one......

Eric
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Old 10-21-2003, 04:21 PM   #5
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Quote:
It is worth a shot but I would bet they will point to this statement at the bottom of the spec PDF. "Specifications are subject to change without notice. Check with your dealer"

Yeah, right.
Well, what if they made it 15 feet instead of 30 feet? Would that make a difference? How about if they omitted the slide-out? "Sorry, we just changed the specifications!"

Uhhh, I don't think so.

You acted in reliance on the information you were provided. If they can change their mind, so can you. I don't believe they can hold you to a purchase if the item has changed materially.

So, I'm thinking you can back out and ask for your deposit back. The dealer's (and Airstream's) alternative would be to help you out with accommodating the changes they unilaterally made.

-Don
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Old 10-21-2003, 06:02 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally posted by Silvertwinkie
Jack,

Where on the wesite did you find that info...the info I saw on the A/S site still had it under 1000 lbs.

Eric
The link is a PDF file on the specification page.

http://www.airstream.com/airstream/p...ec_classic.pdf

I just checked the rating tag on the receiver and at least on the 3/4 ton vans the rating is 1000 lbs. equalized and 10,000 lbs. max towing.

Jack
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Old 10-21-2003, 06:13 PM   #7
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Improving news

As it ends up I have some improving news. The dealer called A/S and asked why the hitch weight went up 225 lbs for 2004. (Apparently the 2004 brochures didn't arrive at the dealer's until this week and he had given me a 2003....although the model year was not stated anywhere in the booklet. The new brochures now state 1125 lbs which agrees with the web site.)
The answer was that the trailer used to determine weight was a 2004 30' Classic Limited Slide Out. The Limited designation means that there are additional things added, insulation, 15K BTU A/C, power stabilizer jacks, and probably some nicer interior items. According to A/S my Classic Slide out will come in the 900 lb. hitch weight realm.

What makes this nice is the dealer, Bill Thomas Camper Sales, wants me to feel confident with my new Classic and has offered to upgrade my hitch components at his cost rather than retail. Since I know that I have added the 15K A/C unit and spare tire and with full LP tanks, I wonder how close that 900 lb. weight will we be? With this in mind and with some of my other hitch components nearing 22 years of age (not the receiver since its new), I'll probably take him up on his offer and upgrade to a heavier receiver and other components.

Jack
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Old 10-21-2003, 08:39 PM   #8
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I had always heard that Bill Thomas was a class dealer. This is just more proof.
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Old 10-21-2003, 08:43 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally posted by thenewkid64
I had always heard that Bill Thomas was a class dealer. This is just more proof.
My salesperson personally talked to him and this offer came from Bill directly.

Jack
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Old 10-21-2003, 09:14 PM   #10
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On my 34', the Limited package added 220 lbs TOTAL, and 50 lbs on the tongue, 20 of it extra propane. On a 30', the Limited added 120 lbs TOTAL and nothing to the tongue. This was for '01, and the Classics haven't changed that much. The Limited doesn't make 225 lbs difference on the tongue. Sounds like a case of tell the buyer something so he'll go away.

For '03, the dry 30' Classic was 7230, with a 730 lb tongue weight, and if you load it to GVWR of 8700 lbs, tongue weight should be at least 870.

If you add the slide, the 30' Classic was 8000 lb dry, with a dry tongue weight of 1080. This tells you the slide adds 770 lbs, 250 of it on the tongue. The GVWR of 9100 means that fully loaded, your tongue should weigh at least 910. But you're already at 1080. That DOESN'T mean you shouldn't load 10% of that 1100 NCC on the tongue. In fact, you probably need to load the majority of it on the curb side to offset the slide. I would expect a loaded tongue weight of about 1200 lbs. You won't see this on the truck axles because the hitch is distributing some of it back to the trailer axles. But the hitch IS dealing with it.

My numbers are from the Airstream Weights PDF file.

[on edit] Actually, now that I look at the layout, there's a lot more than 250 of the 770 lbs going on the tongue. Go for nothing less than a 15K Reese Titan receiver.
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Old 10-22-2003, 09:38 AM   #11
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Thanks Maurice,

This made up my mind and I called my dealer to let him know we would be upgrading the hitch and components.

Regards,

Jack
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Old 10-22-2003, 06:55 PM   #12
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Jack, with that much weight on only two tires per side, and the odds that the trailer's going to wind up a little nose high or nose low, I'd definitely seek out the Recreational Vehicle Safety & Education Foundation (RVSEF, previously known as AWeigh We Go) and get your rig weighed on a tire by tire basis, which will not only ensure you aren't overloading one, but show you your weight balance in both planes. I hear they usually do weigh-ins on the last day of a rally when folks are headin' home. Doesn't necessarily have to be an Airstream rally.
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Old 10-22-2003, 08:17 PM   #13
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We purchased ours from Bill Thomas.The entire Bill Thomas team was just wonderful!
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Old 10-22-2003, 09:48 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally posted by RoadKingMoe
I'd definitely seek out the Recreational Vehicle Safety & Education Foundation (RVSEF, previously known as AWeigh We Go) and get your rig weighed on a tire by tire basis,
A local SOB dealer had them in a couple of years ago. I took the Safari down and was very impressed on the process and the information that I got from them. I just got off the phone with Silvertwinkie (Eric) and made the comment to him that I will have to find these folks and get a weigh in. It's interesting that you had the same thought.

Thanks for the reminder.

Regards,

Jack
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Old 10-22-2003, 09:51 PM   #15
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My next thought is whether I will put in an Equal-i-zer or a Reese dual-cam. I have used a dual-cam for the last 9 years but the folks at Bill Thomas and others have raved about the Equal-i-zer.

Jack
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Old 10-23-2003, 07:03 AM   #16
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Regardless of the hype, the Equal-I-Zer is functionally no different than dual friction sway controls on a conventional hitch.

Unlike the Hensley and Pullrite, both the Equal-I-Zer and the Dual-Cam resist the tow vehicle turning the trailer as much as they resist the trailer turning the tow vehicle, so the amount of resistance they present to sway must be compromised to allow turning without binding.

The same resistance they provide to sway, however much it is, resists the tow vehicle turning when its front tires are turned and creates understeer, where the tires lose some grip and want to go straight rather than sideways when turned. This is more of a problem on wet pavement.

The difference between the Dual Cam and the Equal-I-Zer is that the Dual Cam tries to keep the rig straight. Where any friction hitch, including the Equal-I-Zer, ALSO resists the tow vehicle when it's turning to get the rig straight, the Dual-Cam is applying force to help get the rig straight.

From my perspective, if you're gonna stick with conventional sway control, chose the lesser of two evils with the Dual-Cam.
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Old 10-23-2003, 10:07 PM   #17
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I spent a lot of time researching last night and came to the same conclusion that the Equal-i-zer was a pure friction type unit where the Reese did apply some force to keep the trailer straight. I've used a Reese dual-cam on both my SOB and my Safari over the past 7 years and have been very happy.

My main issue has been the U-bolt's which on both trailers have entered into the area of the gas bottle trays. The new HP strait-line offering from Reese still gives you the dual-cam, and removes the requirement of the U-bolts.

I'm leaning heavily towards the Reese at this point. Especially since I'll be able to get it at dealer cost.

Jack
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Old 10-24-2003, 07:41 AM   #18
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me too

I just had the Reese dual cam installed. Couldn't use the one with the Ubolts either so I put on the one that actually screws onto the A frame. So far so good.
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Old 10-24-2003, 09:11 PM   #19
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Another point for the Reese Dual Cam HP (no U bolts), here. No problems with it.

Jack,
Sorry to hear of your inconveniences but we're sure this upgrade will be just what you were missing: The Cherry ontop of your beautiful new AS/Truck combination!!

Now you're complete. How does the wallet feel?

(we understand: we had bought a new SUV for the AS and then found out it didn't have enough torque. Sold it losing much and got a used truck)
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Old 10-25-2003, 07:56 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally posted by jcanavera

My main issue has been the U-bolt's which on both trailers have entered into the area of the gas bottle trays. The new HP strait-line offering from Reese still gives you the dual-cam, and removes the requirement of the U-bolts.

Jack
Jack,

As I'm going to 25' from 19', I have been thinking about upgrading my sway control as well from friction to the dual cam...one of the things that held me back was what you had said a while back about the U-Bolts in the way of the LP tank area.

Well, this AM, I took a look at the reeseproducts.com website and got a good look at the HP. I also looked at an '04 Safari (which I am sure the Classic is the same). Took the two pictures and kind of in my mind placed the install on the "A" frame...... My concern is that the frontal mounting arm might conflict with the gas line on the curbside.

Anyone comment on this?

Eric
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