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RAH · 10-06-2013, 07:19 AM

Way back in Post #50 gringo asked "I did a couple quick searches, and didn't immediately see any 4x4 or AWD vans big enough to tow the 27. Who makes a 3/4 ton 4x4 van?"

The 2014 GMC Savana van model 3500 has an option for 4WD and a duramax diesel option. The engine is 6.6L but it is not the same duramax diesel engine in the HD pickups. The pickups come with a LML duramax, the van with a LGH duramax - whatever that means - but they are different. The van engine has lower HP and torque ratings. Tow rating on the van is 10,000 pounds however.

On Monday I placed my order for a GMC 2500 HD pickup, and then discovered these vans. I am now trying to follow the advice someone posted a while back: once you pick a tow vehicle, quit looking and enjoy the ride!

Gringo · 10-06-2013, 04:16 PM

Thanks for the tip. I'll take a look at GMC vans, but it would have to be an older one. We can't justify a new vehicle to sit in storage most of the year, making only noises of depreciation.

Can someone tell me about the mirrors on the Excursions? Are they okay for towing an AS or should I be also budgeting for some aftermarket side mirrors?

perryg114 · 10-06-2013, 05:18 PM

Ford makes heavy duty vans E-250 and E-350. I grew up in vans and there is nothing as versitile as a van.

Perry

Gringo · 10-06-2013, 07:07 PM

Me too. My second vehicle was a Falcon Econoline with the straight six 170. The engine was between the seats, your feet were ahead of the front wheels. I turned that into a surfing buggy in the 60's. Had an E-150 in the 70's, and an E-350 was the basis for my Fleetwood Jamboree, 26 ft. Class C. I think they also make an E-450.

But I don't recall ever seeing a diesel or 4x4 Econoline anything from the factory.

SuperTrouper · 10-06-2013, 09:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gringo

Thanks for the tip. I'll take a look at GMC vans, but it would have to be an older one. We can't justify a new vehicle to sit in storage most of the year, making only noises of depreciation.

Can someone tell me about the mirrors on the Excursions? Are they okay for towing an AS or should I be also budgeting for some aftermarket side mirrors?

Here's what I do until we full time. then We'll spring for replacements. These work fine for us.

http://www.airforums.com/forums/f238...ml#post1097377

Gringo · 10-07-2013, 04:56 AM

Thanks, those look pretty good. I like the idea we can take them off for tooling around town etc. Do the stock Excursion mirrors extend outward at all, or are they fixed ?

How about "tow packages"? I am noticing on the various ads that some say "Tow package" and some say "trailer hitch" and some don't mention either but you can tell from the photos that there is a receiver hitch on most of them.

The factory tow package.....that includes the basic Class something hitch and a wiring harness, right? Still have to add brake controller and mirrors?

SuperTrouper · 10-07-2013, 07:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gringo

Thanks, those look pretty good. I like the idea we can take them off for tooling around town etc. Do the stock Excursion mirrors extend outward at all, or are they fixed ?

How about "tow packages"? I am noticing on the various ads that some say "Tow package" and some say "trailer hitch" and some don't mention either but you can tell from the photos that there is a receiver hitch on most of them.

The factory tow package.....that includes the basic Class something hitch and a wiring harness, right? Still have to add brake controller and mirrors?

My mirrors fold but do not extend. Ford does make some that do.
My EX has a tow package with receiver and 7 way plug and brake controller but I replaced the latter with a Prodigy.

ALANSD · 10-07-2013, 09:26 AM

I also have a Prodigy, and my Exc came with the receiver hitch and dual connectors. It is rated over 10,000lb towing capacity.

Taylormade · 10-07-2013, 03:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gringo

Thanks, those look pretty good. I like the idea we can take them off for tooling around town etc. Do the stock Excursion mirrors extend outward at all, or are they fixed ?

The paddle ones don't but the bigger ones, that have two pieces of glass inside, slide outward to become decent tow mirrors. The 08 and above box mirrors are decidedly better, but I like mine just fine and won't be spending the money to upgrade.

jspafford · 10-07-2013, 04:54 PM

I'm with RAH and Canavera - I'm a van fan. If you look for a 12 passenger van, you'll find lots that were used as "Vanpool"carpool vans owned by corporations. They were fleet maintained, mostly freeway miles, and no towing. They are usually 1 ton chassis with 6 liter engines. Here's an example of a 2005 van for sale in CO (your stomping grounds, Gringo?) with 71k milesfor $9500. 2005 Chevy Express Van - Low miles

Holy cow! Adjustable seating inside from 2 - 12, room for way too much stuff, excellent visibility, a surprisingly tight turning radius, 9600#+ towing capacity, for less than $10k. And check our avatar. They look really good in front of an AS.

Do not get 15 passenger! Too much rear overhang and wasted space. There is a diesel option, but I rarely see them on the passenger vans.

slowmover · 10-07-2013, 05:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gringo

Each brand certainly has it's fans, doesn't it? my old die-hard Ford truck uncle in east texas now drives and loves his big Toyota.

In any case, I can't find a big SUV with the Cummins in it, so it's a moot point for me personally. The 7.3 has maintained this reputation as the best for 20 years now. The Dodge truck platform? Not so much. They figure out how to get the paint to stick to them yet?

Interesting that I'm not seeing much here in the way of Duramax defenders.

The DODGE is the only one to stand up to commercial service. Did I say that? I have that experience and have closely questioned others in these businesses. The one with records report the same.

Solo miles aren't acceptable parameters when work is to be done and decisions made. If I told you to buy one and be sure to spend $5k on it to maybe ensure engine reliability then it'd be partisan. The FORD fanbois would have you believe something not proven. The usual irrationality. Folks dying in FORD ambulances due to breakdowns were the lawsuits that blew apart Navistar and Ford. Or maybe the number of million mile Cummins ought to say something. A rarity in the competition. When it's time to get work done for 300k miles at 30k gross it's a Dodge you hook up the past twenty years.

The rest of the truck, 2003 and later is easily as good as the competition, cost-wise.

Since you say you favor an SUV (despite the thread title) you might do your homework. No vehicle of the past 20-years posts worse numbers in steering, handling and braking than an Excursion. A 7.3 won't make up for any of that as it never did post other than ordinary fuel economy . . and while it might outrun a Cummins on the flats, the straight six could always pull the grades better. Design spec on the motor is only 250k, not the 350k of a Cummins. High miles are not your friend in a Ford.

Take your time. Spec'ng a vehicle for one job out of the dozen expected is amateurish. The majority of miles are what count in terms of economy & general performance. Bigger is not better in a TV. You have an Airstream, not a boat anchor. Plenty of choices and not just trucks.

Start with your trailer. What is the weight, loaded for use, etc. Jumping straight into I have to have a truck is not smart. A TT parked in the mountains for use can be moved by others. Or, that one can use another TV and move supplies in more than one trip. Etc.

Or is this thread actually about economy? Assumptions matter.

.

perryg114 · 10-07-2013, 06:50 PM

Slow mover why you so down on Fords? I have heard nothing great about Dodge trucks other than the Cummings engine. Why is an Excursion so much worse than the same exact parts on a pickup of the same era? Same brakes axles transmissions and engines. Yes the Excursion has soft springs but with a load distributing hitch who cares. Soft springs are good for the trailer. If you compare a Ford Explorer to an Excursion the Explorer will handle better. My Ranger has 240k on it and it does not burn oil. It drives alot better than the Excursion because it is half the size. Guess what, barges don't handle as well as speed boats. You think that has something to do with size? Who else made and SUV the size of the Excursion? There is nothing it its class so if you compare it to something that has half the mass then yes it will look bad. Why not compare it to other full size trucks. I have driven full size trucks and it handles much better than any pickup I have every driven. The weight distribution is much better than a pickup. The Excursion is the best tow vehicle I have ever had which may not be saying much. It is much better than the stuff I grew up driving and I am still here.

Perry

**GCinSC2** · 10-07-2013, 06:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Airstreamer67

If you do wind up considering a 5.9 Cummins, be sure to check for the known problems: possibility of cracked blocks (known as the "53" block I think), pins that can back out and cause bad damage (the "dowel pin" syndrome), failed fuel lift pumps that can cause inadequate fuel delivery and very expensive damage to high pressure fuel pumps.

53 Block applies to a limited couple of years, easy to research, IIRC 24V 2nd gen trucks. The dowel pin AKA KDP if I found a 12V and was concerned about the KDP, an afternoons work and that is a non-issue, easy fix. Many of the Cummins issues are well documented. I bought a 12V that had a KDP failure, we fixed it that was 6 years ago, they pull like Mules.

One possible tool on any used engine purchase is a fairly cheap engine oil analysis. At oil change, just get a small sample and mail it in, get a wear metal and contaminant report and learn.

Good luck.

Gary

Gringo · 10-07-2013, 06:57 PM

I didn't start the thread, probably should have started another one entirely. But I thought there were already enough TV threads going. This one looked like a good place to get some info, and it was. I got enough feedback to make a decision. It's made. We just flat do not want a pickup truck.

So with my criteria now defined as diesel, SUV, 4 wheel drive, 10,000 lbs towing.....it really comes down to just one choice.

If I needed to haul hay in it most of the year, it would be a different choice. This thing only needs to do one thing. Haul us, our toys, and our airstream around for a few weeks a year. Nothing else.

Taylormade · 10-07-2013, 07:08 PM

So, yeah, the mirrors slide out.

Gringo · 10-07-2013, 07:34 PM

Yes, apparently there is a Ford version that does. Good to know. I've been keeping my eyes peeled trying to find an Excursion to take a look at in person, but so far no luck. I doubt anyone ever imported one to this little island. Probably not even to this little country.

Thanks to everyone for all the advice, by the way. It's been very helpful in making this decision.

TouringDan · 10-08-2013, 12:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jspafford

I'm with RAH and Canavera - I'm a van fan. If you look for a 12 passenger van, you'll find lots that were used as "Vanpool"carpool vans owned by corporations. They were fleet maintained, mostly freeway miles, and no towing. They are usually 1 ton chassis with 6 liter engines. Here's an example of a 2005 van for sale in CO (your stomping grounds, Gringo?) with 71k milesfor $9500. 2005 Chevy Express Van - Low miles

Holy cow! Adjustable seating inside from 2 - 12, room for way too much stuff, excellent visibility, a surprisingly tight turning radius, 9600#+ towing capacity, for less than $10k. And check our avatar. They look really good in front of an AS.

Do not get 15 passenger! Too much rear overhang and wasted space. There is a diesel option, but I rarely see them on the passenger vans.

Great advice here. A one ton TV that will carry all your stuff and tow your Stream with low mileage and about 10K. What a bargain?

Dan

Gringo · 10-08-2013, 01:03 PM

yeah that's a pretty good deal for someone who doesn't want a diesel or four wheel drive.

perryg114 · 10-08-2013, 02:30 PM

Do you need much of a two vehicle on an island? You could tow an airstream with a tractor for that matter. I figured you would be towing on the mainland.

On that island, you are never going to be more than 50 miles from home.

Perry

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gringo

Yes, apparently there is a Ford version that does. Good to know. I've been keeping my eyes peeled trying to find an Excursion to take a look at in person, but so far no luck. I doubt anyone ever imported one to this little island. Probably not even to this little country.

Thanks to everyone for all the advice, by the way. It's been very helpful in making this decision.

Gringo · 10-08-2013, 03:11 PM

No. The island we live on is about 15 miles long by a mile or so wide. It's down south of the Bahamas, just north of the Dominican Republic. The entire little country is only about 90 miles from one end of the island chain to the other. It's about 40 island, 8 of them inhabited.

We need the tow vehicle to keep with our trailer up in Colorado. Not here. Only thing we tow here are boats.