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Old 02-01-2014, 12:31 PM   #41
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4100 rpm. But, I'm just picking on you due to the broad statement. We all know the pros and cons of gas vs. diesel. But Mojo kind of superseded that statement more accurately anyway.

I was picking on you and mojo as well. I will not share my opinion on buying a used v10 tdi, as it's super bowel weekend and I don't want to start a war here I do believe that MB makes the best Diesel engines though, they are powerful, efficient, reliable, and very quiet. Only if they offered the v8 diesel they offered in Europe...
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Old 02-01-2014, 02:13 PM   #42
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I would buy a Fiat / Jeep diesel with - and only with - a lifetime warranty. I'm thinking it's likely to make the MB diesel maintenance look cheap by comparison.

Just my ever-so-humble opinion.
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Old 02-01-2014, 02:41 PM   #43
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I was picking on you and mojo as well. I will not share my opinion on buying a used v10 tdi, as it's super bowel weekend and I don't want to start a war here I do believe that MB makes the best Diesel engines though, they are powerful, efficient, reliable, and very quiet. Only if they offered the v8 diesel they offered in Europe...

Good engines, but not without failures. I drove my MB 3.0L CRD engine for 106,000 mi. and had three failures. First the alternator at 48,000 mi., then the common rail fuel pressure sensor at 84,000 mi., then the glo plug control module at 98,000 mi. None were inexpensive repairs.

Anyway, this WAS a thread about the GC EcoDiesel. I'm glad that others love their vehicles.

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Old 02-01-2014, 03:58 PM   #44
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If it was really bad fuel I don't think I would have gotten 15mpg on the round trip. Fuel does not fix the issues with shift points or holding gear down hill when towing. Nor the overheating. Why not just tell the truth. Never ceases to amaze me how stupid they think you are.
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Old 02-01-2014, 04:09 PM   #45
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I wonder why someone traded in a vehicle with 600 miles. Hopefully the particular unit has problems and it's not a general capability problem with the platform.
X2, I am also suspicious of the dealer's explanation for the malfunction being #1 diesel. I have owned a diesel vehicle for 14 years and 225 k miles. #1 diesel is rarely available and always labeled as such. The diesel you buy at King Soopers is almost certainly the same diesel as at a truck stop. #1 diesel would not stop a properly functioning transmission from down shifting or cause overheating problems.
Let Chrysler get the bugs out of the engine and transmission combo before purchase.
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Old 02-01-2014, 05:55 PM   #46
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May be its worth to wait a year or two till all the glitches are fixed. I personally never buy a first model year car; I prefer last model years as they are the most reliable.
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Old 02-01-2014, 07:23 PM   #47
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I own a 2014 Jeep GC diesel. These units are basically all drive by wire. It is most definately a software issue. Mine has had two updates already. It sounds like some of the issue is the adaptive cruise control. You never said if it was engage or not? Do yourself a favor and try it again after they update the software. There is NO way that truck will overheat. It has extra cooling capacity with the tow package. The fans are controled by the software.
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Old 02-04-2014, 09:07 AM   #48
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We test drove the 2014 ML350 BlueTec and the 2014 Touareg TDI and am surprised, no shocked, to discover the following:

Touareg tongue limit is 616 pounds. The Touareg owners manual expressly prohibits the use of a weight distributing hitch. Would you tow 7,700 with the full 616 on the hitch with out a WDH? Really??

ML350 tongue limit is 576 pounds. The ML350 owners manual does not mention the use of a WDH but it does state: "The maximum permissible trailer drawbar nose weight is the maximum weight with which the trailer drawbar can be loaded. Limit for Mercedes-Benz-approved trailer couplings." There is a mechanical illustration of the specifications and limits of locating the ball, which does not reference a WDH.

The Grand Cherokee has a tongue limit of 740 pounds and recommends the use of a properly installed WDH for over 5,000.

Both MB and VW dealers stated unequivocally that their employees and other customers tow up to 32 foot Airstreams without issue and not to worry.

Exactly what are you guys with Touareg and ML350 doing to get around the specific limits of the manufacture's?

My 2012 25FB has a tongue weight of 837 pounds. I have considered removing the spare/hanger assy, one battery and one LP tank but still will be over. I could move both batteries.

I would not consider towing with either without using a WDH.

I am bewildered at the statements and images of Airstreams being towed by all kinds of vehicles that are obviously over the manufactures specifications.

Guess I will be forced to say with my Sierra HD2500. My wife and I really wanted to get a more comfortable and economical SUV.

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Old 02-04-2014, 09:47 AM   #49
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2012FB...did you actually put the trailer on a Shurline scale or is that the factory number? Interestingly enough, I traded in a 2012 Sierra HD2500 4x4 crew cab for the 2013 Grand Cherokee hemi with the factory tow package. The tongue with a Propride hitch is 1050# and the only disadvantage is that I can't take a lot of extra crap I really didn't need or use! The 2006 25FB weighs 6280 ready to use.
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Old 02-04-2014, 10:08 AM   #50
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Good job Denis, a ProPride install properly weighed to know weight on the receiver before w.d. is applied.

Is the Jeep GC factory receiver strong enough for your use, no reinforcement needed?
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Old 02-04-2014, 10:20 AM   #51
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Trailer Build/MSRP Sticker Number. So your ok with being 310 over?


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Originally Posted by Denis4x4 View Post
2012FB...did you actually put the trailer on a Shurline scale or is that the factory number? Interestingly enough, I traded in a 2012 Sierra HD2500 4x4 crew cab for the 2013 Grand Cherokee hemi with the factory tow package. The tongue with a Propride hitch is 1050# and the only disadvantage is that I can't take a lot of extra crap I really didn't need or use! The 2006 25FB weighs 6280 ready to use.
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Old 02-04-2014, 10:31 AM   #52
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Trailer Build/MSRP Sticker Number. So your ok with being 310 over?
Dennis is showing receiver weight...not TW
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Old 02-04-2014, 11:00 AM   #53
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The 740 pound limit is the weight placed on the TV hitch. Would it not include the receiver weight?


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Dennis is showing receiver weight...not TW
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Old 02-04-2014, 11:11 AM   #54
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Dennis is showing receiver weight...not TW
If I may ask, what is the difference between the two?
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Old 02-04-2014, 11:41 AM   #55
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I have a 2014 JGC V6 gas. I tow a 25 ft. Tradewind. Tows great. 12 mpg pulling a fully loaded Airstream, 21 mpg around town, 24/25 mpg on the highway.

The manual does state a tongue wieght limit of 740 pounds, no mention of WD. In the sales literature it also states a tongue weight of 1200 pounds when using WD.

I have had trouble with the tranny shift points in the first few months of driving. Mostly an irratant, not a real problem. I found out, the tranny software adapts over time to your driving. The shift points have all smoothed out over the last few months. Now it's real smooth.

I did have CanAm reinforce the hitch. They welded on a simple square tube to the front cross bracket The shop guy said his brother in-law had a new GC and the hitch had bent maybe 1/4" after a trip to the Rockies and back. So for WD the reinforcement is a good idea.

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Old 02-04-2014, 11:50 AM   #56
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The 740 pound limit is the weight placed on the TV hitch. Would it not include the receiver weight?
Yes, I see that now. Sorry. at 1200 using WD, he's fine though.

Rostam, Receiver weight includes all that you see in the picture. TW basically includes all from the ball coupler back, including the PP jacks and a PORTION of the bar weight....but not any of the PP head nor stinger.
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Old 02-04-2014, 11:54 AM   #57
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TW is a trailer a-frame/coupler spec, and receiver weight is a vehicle/receiver spec.
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Old 02-04-2014, 01:15 PM   #58
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Here is what I find amusing. NOT! In continuing to look for a nicer smaller TV I thought how about a Land Rover LR4 and yes you guessed it, 7,716 capacity but only 550 tongue limit. What do they show at the top of the page just above the towing limits. A LR4 towing what looks like at least a 25' Airstream.

http://www.roverguide.com/8599/land-...ng-capacities/

I just heard back from VW and they said to contact Airstream for their specific recommendation for towing my Airstream with the Touareg. If it wasn't for the specific warning about not using a WD this would be my first choice.

I also just heard back from MB and they instructed me to take the trailer to an Airstream dealer to remove weight from the tongue to less than 576. They had no idea either way about the WD. I don't see getting to under 600 pounds on mine. Relocate both batteries to the mid closet, both LP tanks, spare tire and hanger, put air mattresses in. Is one of the holding tanks far enough back to add balance? Kidding.

Stupid me has my wife besides herself after driving both the Touareg and ML350, as it was to be her daily driver instead of me in the truck.
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Old 02-04-2014, 01:42 PM   #59
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Touareg tongue limit is 616 pounds. The Touareg owners manual expressly prohibits the use of a weight distributing hitch.
This may deserve a separate thread not focused on the Grand Cherokee.

There is lots of background on the ClubTouareg forum as well as this board on the various Touareg weight limits. The owner's manual has been updated more than once in recent years, although I am not sure specifically about the 2014 model. VW was sending updates out to those who wanted to reconcile the 770 lb hitch maximum label with the 616 lb maximum reference in the owner's manual. The hitch also had a label saying 770 lbs when using weight distribution, inconsistent with the owner's manual warning.

Personally, and this is just me, I would use weight distribution, and have the hitch reinforced or at least inspected as to its ability to handle typical weight distribution loads at the vehicle/hitch interface. The VW limits on tongue weight and WD appear to be about the hitch and its attachment, not the vehicle itself.

The 770 lbs figure is 10% of the 7700 lb (3500 kg) tow rating.
The 616 lbs figure is 8%.
The Landrover number you reference appears to be 7%.

The above leads some of us to believe that there is not a lot of engineering going into the published tongue weight limits, that they are somewhat arbitrary.

Everyone has to do what is right for them. I would consider the published maximum axle weights and tire load limits to be hard limits, and the published maximum tongue weight to be a reference to the stock VW hitch, not the vehicle.
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Old 02-04-2014, 02:11 PM   #60
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Euro Airstreams are lighter

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Originally Posted by 2012FB View Post
Here is what I find amusing. NOT! In continuing to look for a nicer smaller TV I thought how about a Land Rover LR4 and yes you guessed it, 7,716 capacity but only 550 tongue limit. What do they show at the top of the page just above the towing limits. A LR4 towing what looks like at least a 25' Airstream.

http://www.roverguide.com/8599/land-...ng-capacities/

I just heard back from VW and they said to contact Airstream for their specific recommendation for towing my Airstream with the Touareg. If it wasn't for the specific warning about not using a WD this would be my first choice.

I also just heard back from MB and they instructed me to take the trailer to an Airstream dealer to remove weight from the tongue to less than 576. They had no idea either way about the WD. I don't see getting to under 600 pounds on mine. Relocate both batteries to the mid closet, both LP tanks, spare tire and hanger, put air mattresses in. Is one of the holding tanks far enough back to add balance? Kidding.

Stupid me has my wife besides herself after driving both the Touareg and ML350, as it was to be her daily driver instead of me in the truck.
I looked at the picture on the LR web site. The Airstream looks to be a European model 684 or 685. Max trailer weight under 6000 pounds, max "nose" weight 330 pounds. So the LR4 specs align with the AS specs....but you can't get that AS in the US.
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