Generators and inverters

[Julaeaton]

I have 2005 Bambi 19. This model has no inverter. I’m thinking of purchasing a propane generator if I need to run the AC off grid. Fridge is gas and I don’t have a tv. I only use a fan in addition to the fantastic fan. I’m hoping to upgrade to a 23ft international with solar in the future so I’d want a generator that would suit that as well but only want to buy what I need. Do generators come with inverters or do I need to have an inverter installed in the AS to use a generator? Thank you

[uncle_bob]

Hi

Ok, here's a quick run down:

1) An inverter is a gizmo that converts your battery DC to 120V AC. They come on various models and not on others. They let you run a coffee grinder or a TV when off grid.

2) Any generator you can easily buy puts out 120V ( or 240V) AC. Some play games internally generating this or that and putting out the finished product through an internal inverter. You can't buy that sort of generator without the built in inverter so don't worry about it.

What you *do* want is a quiet generator. Some are made for construction sites. Noise there is not an issue. At a campground noise is very much an issue. The quiet versions cost more money. Sorry about that.

Honda makes some very good generators. You can get an EU2200i with a propane conversion it. If your A/C has a soft start setup installed, it probably will run your A/C.

Champion is the king of the "bang for the buck" generator world. They make a 3400W dual fuel unit that will run most A/C units without a soft start installed.

Fun !!

Bob

[Dennis C]

Your Bambi and the new 23 footers only have a single air conditioner unit, so you don’t necessarily need a huge generator. A smaller unit will likely do well for you, especially if combined with a soft starter. How you use a generator is a very personal decision, and there are ongoing debates about what size is right, gasoline vs. propane, etc. I’m a fan of the Champion products. Great bang for the buck.

[Hannibal01]

I've sought the advice of those who own generators, and I've also studied various reviews and testing from Consumer Reports, for example. Many owners swear by their generators, but their experience may not be long term. Organizations such as Consumer Reports may offer surprising good ratings on Chinese made generators such as Predator, but they do not test these products for long term use and durability. Most of the less expensive generators are made in China and some compare surprisingly well to Honda and Yamaha but they do not have the same durability as Honda and Yamaha. If you plan on heavy usage, and expect long term durability, there are unfortunately no options except for the Japanese made brands....

[GetawA-S]

Juleaton,
Another consideration is weight and storage space. Getting something too big with stress to yourback and your suspension.
The key is determining how you will use your appliances in concert. A 2200 W Honda provide a bit more than half your 30 A shore power. A/C and heat generating appliances are power hogs. That size generator won’t run more than one at a time. Also, motors without a soft start pull extra power when they “kick in”. Your TV set is nothing in comparison - about 5 to 10 % the draw.
The best generator is the one you actually use. They can gum up ( especially the gasoline powered versions) if left to sit.
Happy camping!

[Julaeaton]

Originally Posted by uncle_bob

Hi

Ok, here's a quick run down:

1) An inverter is a gizmo that converts your battery DC to 120V AC. They come on various models and not on others. They let you run a coffee grinder or a TV when off grid.

2) Any generator you can easily buy puts out 120V ( or 240V) AC. Some play games internally generating this or that and putting out the finished product through an internal inverter. You can't buy that sort of generator without the built in inverter so don't worry about it.

What you *do* want is a quiet generator. Some are made for construction sites. Noise there is not an issue. At a campground noise is very much an issue. The quiet versions cost more money. Sorry about that.

Honda makes some very good generators. You can get an EU2200i with a propane conversion it. If your A/C has a soft start setup installed, it probably will run your A/C.

Champion is the king of the "bang for the buck" generator world. They make a 3400W dual fuel unit that will run most A/C units without a soft start installed.

Fun !!

Bob

Thank you for all the detail. The ones I’m looking at do have the inverter and create ‘ clean electricity’ and are quieter. I hadn’t considered the soft start on the ac. It’s 13,5000 BTUs. If I’m reading what you said correctly then I don’t need an inverter in the AS as the kind I’m looking at includes it but I do need a soft starter or a generator that has enough watts to get the AC started which would be considerable more than what I actually need to run it. I’m planning on going cross country in September. Wondering if I even need the hassle. Thanks again.

[Julaeaton]

Originally Posted by Hannibal01

I've sought the advice of those who own generators, and I've also studied various reviews and testing from Consumer Reports, for example. Many owners swear by their generators, but their experience may not be long term. Organizations such as Consumer Reports may offer surprising good ratings on Chinese made generators such as Predator, but they do not test these products for long term use and durability. Most of the less expensive generators are made in China and some compare surprisingly well to Honda and Yamaha but they do not have the same durability as Honda and Yamaha. If you plan on heavy usage, and expect long term durability, there are unfortunately no options except for the Japanese made brands....

Thank you!

[Julaeaton]

Originally Posted by GetawA-S

Juleaton,
Another consideration is weight and storage space. Getting something too big with stress to yourback and your suspension.
The key is determining how you will use your appliances in concert. A 2200 W Honda provide a bit more than half your 30 A shore power. A/C and heat generating appliances are power hogs. That size generator won’t run more than one at a time. Also, motors without a soft start pull extra power when they “kick in”. Your TV set is nothing in comparison - about 5 to 10 % the draw.
The best generator is the one you actually use. They can gum up ( especially the gasoline powered versions) if left to sit.
Happy camping!

Thank you!

[Julaeaton]

Originally Posted by Dennis C

Your Bambi and the new 23 footers only have a single air conditioner unit, so you don’t necessarily need a huge generator. A smaller unit will likely do well for you, especially if combined with a soft starter. How you use a generator is a very personal decision, and there are ongoing debates about what size is right, gasoline vs. propane, etc. I’m a fan of the Champion products. Great bang for the buck.

Thank you!

[uncle_bob]

Originally Posted by Julaeaton

Thank you for all the detail. The ones I’m looking at do have the inverter and create ‘ clean electricity’ and are quieter. I hadn’t considered the soft start on the ac. It’s 13,5000 BTUs. If I’m reading what you said correctly then I don’t need an inverter in the AS as the kind I’m looking at includes it but I do need a soft starter or a generator that has enough watts to get the AC started which would be considerable more than what I actually need to run it. I’m planning on going cross country in September. Wondering if I even need the hassle. Thanks again.

Hi

As noted above, a lot of generator reviews are targeted at folks who use them as emergency backup. A big storm comes through. The house lights go out and they use the generator for a couple days. It then gets put away and forgotten.

If you really *are* going to run the A/C on generator, that's a lot of hours of usage. It's not just time on the engine, you also will haul a lot of fuel.

So, with a September date:

1) Buy a (big / heavy) Champion 3400. I have one sitting in the garage. At right around 100 pounds it's more than I want to lift on a regular basis. It will do what you need to do with no mods to your A/C. I would not mess with anything else, just get the Champion if this is what you are going to do.

2) Find a shop somewhere that isn't booked out through next March and get a soft start of some sort put on your A/C. You then could run a Honda 2200i that weighs half what the Champion does.

3) Get a pair of Honda's and a parallel cable. This (obviously) is not the low cost approach. It gives you enough power to run the A/C without modification. You have two light(er) weight gizmos to haul. If you later need less power, you just bring one of them along.

The advantage of number 2 is that your A/C probably would run OK on a wider range of power sources. If you pull up and park in somebodies driveway, you have better odds of being able to plug in there.

With any generator based approach, you also need fuel containers. With a propane setup, that usually is a couple of very normal "back yard bbq" tanks. They are nice because you can swap them out at a lot of places. Some sort of bin to keep it from rolling it s really good idea.

With a gas powered setup, you would probably want a pair of 5 gallon fuel cans. I would get the *good* metal ones:

https://www.amazon.com/Wavian-Gallon...8516945&sr=8-2

I would not trust plastic in this application .... At the very least, strap them down. Better yet, get a proper mounting frame for them.

If your TV also uses gas, there is an advantage to "dual use" for the spare fuel. If you drive a diesel, that's not a consideration. ( hand carry diesel generators are tough to find ..).

Fun !!!!

Bob

[Fungus]

Not much to add...

If you buy the Champion (and maybe others), sometimes the very first time you start it the oil sensor might be stuck, which will shut down the engine immediately because it thinks the oil level is low. It is easy to disconnect the sensor so that the engine will run. After it runs once, you won't have a problem. Just remember to reconnect the sensor.

The 15K BTU AC on my 25-footer required the Micro Air Easy Start mod so that the Champion 2400 dual fuel generator could run it. The generator is an easy lift at just 40#. Honda and Yamaha have great reputations.

The Easy Start is simple to install if you are moderately handy with electrical work. Most difficult part for me was figuring out how to safely get on the roof without denting the shell. After the first climb to the top, it was easy the remaining round trips. But if you are uncomfortable with the climb and the electrical work, definitely outsource it.

[uncle_bob]

Hi

Pretty much *all* generators will have an oil fill / oil change process involved with them when new and at regular intervals past that. Some will have a required "run in" process before you can use them at full power. Best to read the manual *very* carefully.

Lots of fun !!!

Bob

[Dennis C]

My Champion generator required a 5-hour run in process, followed by an oil change.

[Fungus]

Originally Posted by uncle_bob

Hi

Pretty much *all* generators will have an oil fill / oil change process involved with them when new and at regular intervals past that. Some will have a required "run in" process before you can use them at full power. Best to read the manual *very* carefully.

Lots of fun !!!

Bob

That’s true. Unfortunately, the manual doesn’t mention that the only way to run the generator with a stuck sensor is to disconnect the wire to the sensor. It doesn’t happen to all of them. I wonder how many get returned because they won’t run. A quick web search found the answer.

I let it run until the break-in period ended then reconnected the sensor.

[rmkrum]

I installed a two-way level on top of my champion dual fuel. It’s an easy way to get it dead level so it will start easily. I have data on this…



It’s not real visible in the photo, but believe me it’s vital.

[uncle_bob]

Originally Posted by rmkrum

I installed a two-way level on top of my champion dual fuel. It’s an easy way to get it dead level so it will start easily. I have data on this…

Attachment 401545

It’s not real visible in the photo, but believe me it’s vital.

Hi

Yet another piece of "fun" if trying to run the generator in the bed of your truck ... ( sitting here looking at the angle on the bed of the truck at this campsite ...).

Bob