4Runner tow vehicle

[inflt]

Rented a pop up and took the family down the the Texas coast last weekend. We really liked camping however the pop up was not very impressive. Always admired the silver bullets so the time has come. Just started looking for a 2000 - 2003 19 footer and I'm wondering has anyone tried pulling a 19 ft bambi with a vehicle like the Toyota. We have a 1997 4Runner 4X4 V6 it's rated at 5000/500. We've towed our boat since the truck was new but it is only about 3000 lbs (and you knew it was back there) So that's why I'm wondering what an additional 1000 lbs or so would do to it. Toyota does make a supercharger for it which could be an option. Anyway just thought I would throw it out there and see if anyone has tried it.
Thanks, Alan

[j54mark]

Originally Posted by inflt

I'm wondering has anyone tried pulling a 19 ft bambi with a vehicle like the Toyota. Anyway just thought I would throw it out there and see if anyone has tried it.
Thanks, Alan

I think this has come up before. If I remember correctly someone posted who was using that exact combination. You might try a search using 4Runner as a keyword.

Mark

[Janets Husband]

Originally Posted by inflt

Rented a pop up and took the family down the the Texas coast last weekend. We really liked camping however the pop up was not very impressive. Always admired the silver bullets so the time has come. Just started looking for a 2000 - 2003 19 footer and I'm wondering has anyone tried pulling a 19 ft bambi with a vehicle like the Toyota. We have a 1997 4Runner 4X4 V6 it's rated at 5000/500. We've towed our boat since the truck was new but it is only about 3000 lbs (and you knew it was back there) So that's why I'm wondering what an additional 1000 lbs or so would do to it. Toyota does make a supercharger for it which could be an option. Anyway just thought I would throw it out there and see if anyone has tried it.
Thanks, Alan

5000/500 is plenty to pull many new and vintage Airstream trailers.
Bambi, Caravel, Safari, Tradewind just about anything under 22' should be light enough for your rig. We have a Minuet and it only weighs 2600lbs dry.
Lots of options, and Welcome.

[thenewkid64]

Alan,

Welcome to the forum!

I do not have experience in towing with that small of a TV (Tow vehicle) but based on the numbers you quoted I would be leery of towing at the max the truck is rated for. That being said, one way to do this without having to get a bigger TV is to go vintage. The older trailers weighed less than the comparable size new ones. Some of it is overall size. Older ones are a bit narrower, so less overall trailer. But also they were designed to be pulled by the family cars of the 60's. So the overall construction was done with an eye toward light weight. Today it is more a matter of interior volume because most people tow with a full sized truck or sport ute.

If you have the time and the skills you can also save a ton of money by going this route.

Keep looking, do your research, ask questions, your trailer will find you. I know it sounds weird, but it has happened to many of us that way.

[Mike Lewis]

Originally Posted by inflt

Rented a pop up and took the family down the the Texas coast last weekend. We really liked camping however the pop up was not very impressive. Always admired the silver bullets so the time has come. Just started looking for a 2000 - 2003 19 footer and I'm wondering has anyone tried pulling a 19 ft bambi with a vehicle like the Toyota. We have a 1997 4Runner 4X4 V6 it's rated at 5000/500. We've towed our boat since the truck was new but it is only about 3000 lbs (and you knew it was back there) So that's why I'm wondering what an additional 1000 lbs or so would do to it. Toyota does make a supercharger for it which could be an option. Anyway just thought I would throw it out there and see if anyone has tried it.
Thanks, Alan

infit----I own a 1997 4 runner in addition to a Titan we tow with. I can tell you from experience you won't be a happy camper towing with a one. While a great SUV, they are not a good tow vehicle for a number of reasons. Ist they are short on power. If towing anything above 2000 lbs you'll be full throttle and most any grade. 2nd and 3rd are the short wheel base and large balloon tires make for a very unstable TV. the slightest side wind will have you white knuckeled. A small Pop up is all I would concider towing with one.------
Pieman

[Buttercup]

We have a 4 Runner - 95 V6. 3.0. Yes it is a smaller engine.
We have a pop up 1700/300 lb and we feel it!
I would think it can be done but it might be better done with a larger engine. This especially comes into play when pulling up hill - if you know what I mean...

[overlander63]

You could look into a 16' CCD, if you can't upgrade the tow vehicle. Still not an ideal solution, but a 3' shorter trailer, that weighs less, may be a more doable thing.

[Silvertwinkie]

Any new Airstream over 19' has a GVWR of over 5000lbs. The next model up from the 19' is the 22' and I think that clocks in somewhere between 5300 and 5600 and these do not take into consideration the heavier axles on the new coaches (not sure which models) that will increase the NCC which in turn also has increased the GVWR.

In reality, IMHO, I would not go higher than 80% of listed capacity and I would make sure I had at least a 130" wheelbase for anything above 22'.

I agree, this has been covered many times, and if you do a search, you should find lots of threads on it.

[wkerfoot]

Originally Posted by Silvertwinkie

...In reality, IMHO, I would not go higher than 80% of listed capacity and I would make sure I had at least a 130" wheelbase for anything above 22'.

I agree, this has been covered many times, and if you do a search, you should find lots of threads on it.

Silvertwinkie,

So I am under tow vehicled with a 1977 Lincoln Continental 127" WB, 460CI 4V, towing capacity 6000 lbs and the 1973 Dodge W200 Power Wagon 131" WB, 360CI 2V, towing capacity 6000 lbs with the 1979 23' Safari, gross weight 5800 lbs and the soon to be 1954 30' Double Door Liner, dry weight 4050 lbs, gross weight to be determined?

Bill

[Silvertwinkie]

Bill I was referring to the Toyota, clearly the heavier cars of yesteryear are a bit different beast, though I will say that we had a '77 LTD wagon with a 400ci that had a good wheelbase and it really didn't tow the 24' Jayco as well as the '85 Suburban with a 454. I also recall the Fords of the mid to late 70s, let alone the 80's having not very stout brakes, but that's a whole nuther conversation.

I have a 1996 Impala SS with a 5.7L 350, same that was found in the 1500 truck line and some of the 2500s back then too. The answer is that clearly it moved and stopped the Bambi very well. However, the Safari, it did move and stop good, but it was beyond where it should have been. So I'm not just talking from a thought, I'm talking from direct exp. Now the Suburban with a 6.0L is a night an day difference towing, even though horsepower and torque on the Impala SS were equal or greater than that of my '04 2500 Suburban.

As for the wheelbase, it's my understanding that depends on the length of the coach. In your one example, clearly you have good wheelbase for the length of the coach, but if your vintage tow vehicle is rated at 6000lbs towing capacity and you are at 5800 which does not include weights of passengers in the car and/or fuel and cargo in the car, I would have to say yes, you have either exceeded what it *should* tow or are pretty darn close. I'm coming from the camp that knows it CAN do it, but more of the question of SHOULD it tow it. I myself have seen lots of things that can move and stop things, but have no business towing...for example an Intrepid towing a 34' Classic. Now I admit, your not near the Intrepid camp, but I think you get the essence of my comments.

[inflt]

Great advice! Will go forward on finding the trailer the wife will just have to come to terms on giving up her very much loved 4Runner.
Thanks again, Alan

[wkerfoot]

Originally Posted by Silvertwinkie

...In your one example, clearly you have good wheelbase for the length of the coach, but if your vintage tow vehicle is rated at 6000lbs towing capacity and you are at 5800 which does not include weights of passengers in the car and/or fuel and cargo in the car, I would have to say yes, you have either exceeded what it *should* tow or are pretty darn close. I'm coming from the camp that knows it CAN do it, but more of the question of SHOULD it tow it. I myself have seen lots of things that can move and stop things, but have no business towing...for example an Intrepid towing a 34' Classic. Now I admit, your not near the Intrepid camp, but I think you get the essence of my comments.

Silvertwinkie,

How about a 300C instead of the Intreped, the hemi is a killer?

Seriously, the tow rating does not include the vehicle cargo capacity. On the PowerWagon it is 8000 GVW with a wet weight of about 5500. With the Lincoln it is a 6463 with a wet weight of about 5000. Now saying that, I would not want to load the PowerWagon up to 8000 and then tow 6000, not with the 360 2V, perhaps with a 440 4V. The Lincoln would not be a problem going up to a GCVW of 12,000 with the 460 4V.

Bill

[Silvertwinkie]

That unibody 300C ought to be a great choice!

I may be misreading what you saying, but isn't gvwr different that tow ratings? Even if say the car weighed 6400 it doesn't make it any safter to tow 5800lbs with a 6000lb tow rating even though the car/truck weighs 6400lbs. I mean I know it can do it, but should it? That's a personal call.

What is hard to believe it that a Lincoln with a 460 has a tow rating of 6000lbs. Is it the gearing? I mean my 5.7 350 was rated a 5000 with 2.93s. When I went to 3.73s, it did tow better, but it still wasn't safe IMHO, thus the truck. I guess with a 460 there must be a weak link somewhere...tranny, gears, driveshaft, something, cause I'd think a 460 itself should be able to tow at least up to it's own gvwr or close or maybe even a bit more......

[wkerfoot]

Originally Posted by Silvertwinkie

That unibody 300C ought to be a great choice!

I may be misreading what you saying, but isn't gvwr different that tow ratings? Even if say the car weighed 6400 it doesn't make it any safter to tow 5800lbs with a 6000lb tow rating even though the car/truck weighs 6400lbs. I mean I know it can do it, but should it? That's a personal call.

What is hard to believe it that a Lincoln with a 460 has a tow rating of 6000lbs. Is it the gearing? I mean my 5.7 350 was rated a 5000 with 2.93s. When I went to 3.73s, it did tow better, but it still wasn't safe IMHO, thus the truck. I guess with a 460 there must be a weak link somewhere...tranny, gears, driveshaft, something, cause I'd think a 460 itself should be able to tow at least up to it's own gvwr or close or maybe even a bit more......

The passengers and some of the cargo does not affect the towing capacity as they are carried in the vehicle. You need to be sure you do not exceed the GVW or the Tow Rating and the GCVW. The pounds can be spread around the tow vehicle and the trailer.

Regarding the Lincoln it has a 2.75 axle and the tow rating is for a 3.0, I don't think that the engine, C6 trans or 9" rear end are a weak spot. The 460 was used in trucks for several years into the 1980's. I don't understand the relationship of towing capacity to vehicle weight either. Modern trucks have tow ratings exceeding their gross weight. I can't believe that the parts are any stronger than either of my vehicles, except the 4 wheel drum brakes on the PowerWagon. I am going to a PowerWagon Rally this weekend, perhaps some of the truck guys can explain it to me, if so I will pass along their wisdom.

Bill

[Silvertwinkie]

Originally Posted by wkerfoot

The passengers and some of the cargo does not affect the towing capacity as they are carried in the vehicle. Bill

Well that clearly goes against most of what I've read here. Not saying you are wrong, but several threads here have clearly said that any weight you add to the tow vehicle subracts from the tow rating....I also seem to recall seeing that on a few manufac website too, but I'd have to find them to be certain.....

[Silvertwinkie]

I found it. Here is the link and what's on the bottom of the page:

http://www.chevrolet.com/suburban/specifications/

"Maximum trailer weight ratings are calculated assuming a base vehicle, except for any option(s) necessary to achieve the rating, plus driver. The weight of other optional equipment, passengers and cargo will reduce the maximum trailer weight your vehicle can tow. See your Chevy dealer for additional details."

[overlander63]

Originally Posted by Silvertwinkie

I found it. Here is the link and what's on the bottom of the page:

http://www.chevrolet.com/suburban/specifications/

"Maximum trailer weight ratings are calculated assuming a base vehicle, except for any option(s) necessary to achieve the rating, plus driver. The weight of other optional equipment, passengers and cargo will reduce the maximum trailer weight your vehicle can tow. See your Chevy dealer for additional details."

GCVW= tow vehicle weight+trailer weight+cargo+passengers.
If your Suburban weighs 6,000 lb empty, and your GCVWR is 12,000lb, does not mean you can get a 6,000 lb trailer. You have to allow for weight of cargo of both truck and trailer, as well as passengers, fuel, water in the trailer tanks, etc.
My conversion van has a towing capacity of 6,000 lb, but that figure is reduced by the amount of stuff the conversion van company installed in my van. Several hundred pounds of it. So, maybe I can tow 5300 pounds, after allowing for the additional weight of the installed stuff, and subtracting the empty weight of my trailer, 4200 pounds, means I can carry 1100 pounds of gear, passengers, and fuel. Average adults weigh around 175-200 pounds, two people weigh 400, so I am down to 700. Gas weighs just under 8 pounds per galon, times 40 gallons, or 320 pounds. That leaves me with 380 pounds of stuff I can take with me. Two bicycles at 25 pounds each, or 330 pounds of stuff I can carry. 20 pounds of propane in each of their cylinders, plus 15 pounds of empty weight for the cylinders, leaves 260 pounds for food, water, clothing, pots, pans, etc. And that maxes the van out. Most folks will tell you to allow 20% under towing cpacity is what you should shoot for.
I don't know if this will help you with a tow vehicle / trailer choice, but I have tried to show you how to figure out what you need.

[Mike Lewis]

Originally Posted by inflt

Rented a pop up and took the family down the the Texas coast last weekend. We really liked camping however the pop up was not very impressive. Always admired the silver bullets so the time has come. Just started looking for a 2000 - 2003 19 footer and I'm wondering has anyone tried pulling a 19 ft bambi with a vehicle like the Toyota. We have a 1997 4Runner 4X4 V6 it's rated at 5000/500. We've towed our boat since the truck was new but it is only about 3000 lbs (and you knew it was back there) So that's why I'm wondering what an additional 1000 lbs or so would do to it. Toyota does make a supercharger for it which could be an option. Anyway just thought I would throw it out there and see if anyone has tried it.
Thanks, Alan

How did this get twisted into a discussion on what a Lincoln or a Dodge will tow.
inflt askes a simple question about their Toyota and someone gets bent out of shape over their unrelated vehicles?????????????It's like a Troll under the bridge waiting for someone to come along to jump on.---Pieman

[Silvertwinkie]

Not sure I agree Mike. I mean we were using these as examples of tow ratings and such...or at least that was how I took it. I didn't take it that it was a hijack or a troll senario.

[Mike Lewis]

Originally Posted by Silvertwinkie

Not sure I agree Mike. I mean we were using these as examples of tow ratings and such...or at least that was how I took it. I didn't take it that it was a hijack or a troll senario.

Silvertwinkie---i didn't mean to incinuate that "you" were the one doing the hijacking------pieman