Toyota suspends sales...

[toastie]

Toyota vehicles, which have been linked to 19 deaths and several hundred complaints to federal regulators, reported in the Detroint Free Press.

Toyota recall woes continue | freep.com | Detroit Free Press

[holder310]

This is scary! We have 5 Toyotas... both of our 98 Camrys and the '02 Avalon all get "sticky" throttles and have to be sprayed every so often. It amounts to more gas being used...never thought this could be happen. We don't have any of the years affected, but curiously we have had sticky throttles. By "sticky" I mean you have to push the gas a little harder than normal to accelerate. It doesn't get stuck while accelerating. We started taking them to the dealership, but all they did was spray them and they were back to normal, so we bought a can of throttle body spray. 8.00 a can as opposed to 27.00 a car to do it!

Anybody else had this problem?

[aftermath]

I am a Toyota guy through and through and I am driving an '08 Tundra. When they spoke of the floor mats getting stuck I went out and inspected mine. I couldn't possibly imagine the gas pedal getting stuck in my truck. What bothers me the most is the fact that Toyota does not know what is causing this problem.

I sure hope they find out soon. Could you imagine seeing me going down the freeway with my Safari all doing about 100mph? Yikes. I will be shifting into neutral if it ever happens. The odds are in my favor though.

[Al - K4GLU]

The floor mat thing was a joke. When I bought my 2010 in Oct they had the floor mat tied down with a zip tie. I examined the thing close and couldn't imagine how the mats could cause the pedal to stick. Wonder if this only happens when you push the pedal all the way down - or can it happen any time?

[holder310]

o.k. after reading this:
Toyota knew of sticky-throttle problem late last year - USATODAY.com

it appears that we have been keeping a potentially deadly problem at bay. When we complain about the throttle body (gas pedal) sticking, my husband gets the spray out and fixes it. Apparently, the article says that the first step to major problems is a choppy, unsmooth accleration. The squeaky wheel does get the grease. You know how us women folk can nag. We have been complaining so loudly when it begins because we were noticing more gas being used....little did we know that we could have preventing an accident. For folks who have been noticing this and you don't have the vehicle recall year, I suggest taking your car to the nearest Toyota place and get them to spray it. 27.00 is not that much (cheaper than an oil change where I live) and if you did that twice a year couldn't hurt.

I am wondering how Toyota can explain it all away with the "floor mat" excuse. Doesn't make sense to me. Guess what hubby will be doing tomorrow? Spraying all of the vehicles with the throttle body spray.

[ROBERT CROSS]

Toyota recomendation.....encouraging?


What if you experience a sticking accelerator pedal while driving?
• Each circumstance may vary, and drivers must use their best judgment, but Toyota recommends taking one of following actions:
• If you need to stop immediately, the vehicle can be controlled by stepping on the brake pedal with both feet using firm and steady pressure. Do not pump the brake pedal as it will deplete the vacuum utilized for the power brake assist.
• Shift the transmission gear selector to the Neutral (N) position and use the brakes to make a controlled stop at the side of the road and turn off the engine.
• If unable to put the vehicle in Neutral, turn the engine OFF. This will not cause loss of steering or braking control, but the power assist to these systems will be lost.
o If the vehicle is equipped with an Engine Start/Stop button, firmly and steadily push the button for at least three seconds to turn off the engine. Do NOT tap the Engine Start/Stop button.
o If the vehicle is equipped with a conventional key-ignition, turn the ignition key to the ACC position to turn off the engine. Do NOT remove the key from the ignition as this will lock the steering wheel.



Parts suppliers in Japan had near death experiences when they opened their Nikkei [sub] this morning. Parts suppliers in China and the rest of the world suffered heart and respiratory problems when the news of Toyota’s latest plan hit the news-wires.

In search of money to save, Toyota plans to slash its parts procurement expenses by 30 percent over the next three years.

Toyota told parts manufacturers to cut prices for auto parts to be used in cars that will be released in and after 2013. The cuts affect more than 200 power train, body and chassis components.

This is easier said than done. Parts sold to OEMs are typically made at razor-thin margins. There is only one way to come close to the cost reductions planned: Make the parts from less expensive materials, and dispense with the really expensive parts,

In that vein, Toyota spokesman Takanori Yokoi said the automaker had made “various suggestions including cost reductions” to suppliers, says Reuters. Toyota plans to overhaul its car designs to help cut costs.

This can only mean one thing: The previously vaunted Toyota reliability, which already started to suffer a while ago, will go further down the drain. The reliability problems were one of the results of a cost-cutting campaign by Toyota that started in 2006.

The news was received with “Hurrah!” on the top floor of the Volkswagen-Hochhaus in Wolfsburg. VW wants to dethrone Toyota by 2018. The cuts in quality will play right into the hands of Volkswagen. They had to contend with their own quality problems ,and had stomach convulsions whenever a German J.D. Power study came out with Toyota on top, and VW down below mediocre.

Posted in Japan, News Blog
Tagged as Bertel Schmitt, Japan, Quality, Toyota

[janetb]

Drat! I love our Tundra! (But not nearly as much as I love our 11 yr. old Audi.)
Very scary news. Thanks for the post.

[toastie]

Originally Posted by aftermath

I am a Toyota guy through and through and I am driving an '08 Tundra. When they spoke of the floor mats getting stuck I went out and inspected mine. I couldn't possibly imagine the gas pedal getting stuck in my truck. What bothers me the most is the fact that Toyota does not know what is causing this problem.

My guess is that they know what the root cause is and thats why they are shutting down production.........bad parts

[barts]

Are these cars equipped w/ drive-by-wire systems or mechanical throttles?

I wondering if this might be a software issue rather than a mechanical problem....

- Bart

[RoadKingMoe]

Originally Posted by barts

Are these cars equipped w/ drive-by-wire systems or mechanical throttles?

I wondering if this might be a software issue rather than a mechanical problem....

- Bart

I'd guess that most cars with some kind of vehicle stability control have drive-by-wire throttles--and I've wondered the same thing.

[RedSHED]

There is something going on. Toyota seems to be focused on one supplier. I don't know if they supply Europe as well, but Toyota appears to be considering expanding the recall: Bloomberg article

There's been talk of corrosion, but the off duty officer was in southern California and that's a puzzler.

I've also read that in the Lexus there's a manual shift gate that is not terribly well marked, and could be mistaken for "N." Additionally, the ignition is keyless, and won't shut off unless you hold the button for three solid seconds IIRC. I might have the details wrong, but that's what I got from the police officer accident story.

I don't particularly like Toyota, but nobody would really wish this on them.

[dkottum]

Airplanes are routinely grounded for safety issues. Good for Toyota. We have had two trouble-free trucks. Also had Audi's after the sudden-acceleration hoax. Our '88 80 Quattro was the best car we ever owned. Sold it with 350k miles twelve years ago and it's still on the road, as is my son's '89 100. Later VW/Audi's have been electrical/electronic nightmares, for us. Thus our Toyotas.

[ROBERTSUNRUS]

Hi, the person who was driving the Toyota that crashed and killed everyone [including the passenger on the phone] was a CHP officer. [California Highway Patrol] And in my opinion had poor driving skills, especially for one in his job title. 911 "We're going over one hundred miles per hour and can't stop this car, help us"

I'm sorry for them, but..................PUT THE DAMN TRANS IN NEUTRAL AND IF THE ENGINE BLOWS UP, WHO CARES. TURN THE IGNITION KEY OFF, HOLD THE STEERING WHEEL WITH BOTH HANDS, AND USE BOTH FEET ON THE BRAKE PEDAL AND PRESS REAL HARD AND DO NOT PUMP THE BRAKES. I'm yelling for a purpose, use some common sense.

[ROBERTSUNRUS]

Hi, in the late 60's and early 70's Chevrolets also had run away cars. The problem was the left motor mount would break, and on hard accelleration, the engine would lift up and bind the mechanical throttle linkage at full throttle. Your brakes cannot over power your engine, you have to turn it off.

Because of this, all companies started making unbreakable motor mounts; Yes the rubber still breaks but the mount can not come apart.

Ford used their brake light switch to cancel the cruise control. When the brake light switch failed, [with cruise control engaged] the harder you pressed on the brake pedal, the harder the engine accellerated trying to maintain it's pre-set speed. Turn the engine off.

Because of this, newer cars have a secondary switch or a vacuum dump valve. We learn the hard way some times.

[RoadKingMoe]

Originally Posted by ROBERTSUNRUS

Hi, in the late 60's and early 70's Chevrolets also had run away cars. The problem was the left motor mount would break, and on hard accelleration, the engine would lift up and bind the mechanical throttle linkage at full throttle. Your brakes cannot over power your engine, you have to turn it off.

I had one of those--1970 Nova. It was even scarier because not only was the cooling fan chewing away on the shroud, but one of the header pipes burned through a power steering pump hose, spraying burning power steering fluid from beneath the car. By the time I got it stopped and the hood open, the fire was out.

[Beginner]

I was wondering the same thing about the "fly by wire throttle. One manufacturer that I know of uses that setup. It allows the computer to position the engine RPM at the most economical position for the gas pedal position (power required), thus there is no direct link between the gas pedal and the throttle.
Is Toyota using this system?
Is any body else?
Now Detroit wants to make steering fly by wire.
Yes aircraft control surfaces (alerons, flaps, slats, rudders, elevators, stabilators and spoilers) are fly by wire but considering the amount of maintenance required by regulations usually these failures are caught prior to becoming real problems unless the airlines are not following procedures or are taking shortcuts.
Makes you go hmmmmm dosent it
Beginner

[ROBERT CROSS]

Originally Posted by dkottum

Also had Audi's after the sudden-acceleration hoax.

Don't talk about a hoax you know nothing about, is it a hoax that one of your vaunted Audi's ended up against our shop wall?, it was NOT a phantom concern, whatever the cause.

"The Audi 5000's sudden acceleration occurs more frequently than any auto defect ever investigated by the U.S. government. By 1987, one out of every 170 Audi 5000s had had a sudden acceleration accident, according to the Center For Auto Safety (CAS), a national consumer organization. By comparison, the infamous Firestone 500 tires were recalled with an accident rate of 1-in15,000"

Oh I get it...it was a conspiricy hoax, NTSB was responsible.

[mutcth]

Originally Posted by Beginner

I was wondering the same thing about the "fly by wire throttle. One manufacturer that I know of uses that setup. It allows the computer to position the engine RPM at the most economical position for the gas pedal position (power required), thus there is no direct link between the gas pedal and the throttle.
Is Toyota using this system?
Is any body else?

Almost every manufacturer is using it. I did some work on (a very small part of developing) it back at GM in 1991, evaluating it on some Camaros and developing some test fixtures. That was a fun project...

What wasn't fun was figuring out a problem with an engine speed governor on medium-duty trucks - a similar sort of rare-but-happens issue to this sudden acceleration problem.

Given all of the issues that can crop up with linkages and cables, a electronic throttle control set up can eliminate lots of potential problems. Of course, that assumes other failsafes are in place.

Tom

[crispyboy]

Toyota fans - Sorry to hear about your luck - stay safe out there.
I have drive by wire on my 97 VW Jetta TDI - I was worried about this in the beginning but have owned the car for 9 years now and it has not been a problem.
My friend with a late 90's f250 diesel had a drive by wire problem. Luckily his was only a flat spot on acceleration. Only $700 for the part.

[RoadKingMoe]

Our 2002 Ford 7.3L Powerstroke diesel had its fly-by-wire throttle pedal replaced under recall. That said, fly-by-wire throttle is a lot easier to implement on a diesel, since there's no throttle plate.