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Old 12-30-2022, 02:17 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by dznf0g View Post
I am having trouble deciding if that is a 6.5' bed or an 8 foot.
The easy way to tell a short bed from a long bed is to compare the panel in front of the wheel to one of the cab doors, if it looks as big or bigger than the door it is a long bed. A short bed is much shorter in front of the wheel and it is obvious by how much bigger the door looks than that section.
The truck in question is a long bed.
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Old 12-30-2022, 02:23 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by ITSNO60 View Post
The easy way to tell a short bed from a long bed is to compare the panel in front of the wheel to one of the cab doors, if it looks as big or bigger than the door it is a long bed. A short bed is much shorter in front of the wheel and it is obvious by how much bigger the door looks than that section.
The truck in question is a long bed.
That's what I thought, but one of the comments below the article as well as someone here implied it was a regular bed. I always compare the position of the gas door relative to the wheel well. I thought I was seeing a long bed.
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Old 12-30-2022, 06:00 PM   #23
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A buddy of mine has a Ram2500HD. When he engages his WD to tow his 25FB, the top edge of his topper touches the back edge of his cab. Shows you how much these frames flex under stress.
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Old 12-30-2022, 06:21 PM   #24
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A buddy of mine has a Ram2500HD. When he engages his WD to tow his 25FB, the top edge of his topper touches the back edge of his cab. Shows you how much these frames flex under stress.
Really? That doesn't seem right at all. How much wd does he have dialed in? How much clearance when not hooked up?

Edit: I just googled ram 2500 frame cracking, and there is quite a bit out there. If I were your buddy, I'd inspect the frame,.especially in the area shown above for cracking. WD alone shouldn't flex the frame much at all.
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Old 12-30-2022, 07:04 PM   #25
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3/16ish with 1k bars. Next time you hook up, measure the distance from the top edge of your box to the back of the cab. Dial in your weight distribution and see how much it moves. It won't be as exaggerated as with the height of the topper, but it will move showing how much the frame bends.
What I find interesting is my 2022 Expedition has leather, 3 rows of seats, more windows, a power liftgate, panoramic glass roof, and 1,770 lbs payload. My 2021 f150 had cloth seats and no sunroof and a payload of 1,778. My 2019 F150 limited with similar features to my expedition had 1,170 lbs payload. I wonder if it's the stiffness of the expeditions full body structure that allows for more payload when compared to an F150 with similar features.

Expedition Max XLT, 4x4, 8 seats, 502A
F150 XLT Crew 4x4, 202A

The solid axle leaf spring suspension of the F150 is a superior choice for hauling when compared to the independent suspension in the Expy. It makes me wonder what's limiting the pick up.
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Old 12-30-2022, 07:17 PM   #26
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I have a soft topper so I can measure at the roof. 3/16" is a pretty close tolerance for a topper. Is it maybe a bit too far forward ?
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Old 12-30-2022, 07:33 PM   #27
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I have a soft topper so I can measure at the roof. 3/16" is a pretty close tolerance for a topper. Is it maybe a bit too far forward ?
I could be wrong with the 3/16, it was definitely close. I was just surprised how the gap closed with he WD.
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Old 12-30-2022, 08:52 PM   #28
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A friend of mine used to run a salvage car business across the street from my wood shop, and he used older F150 and F250 as "tow" vehicles when he went to pick up the junker cars from customers. He had an old sling-style wrecker arm he'd mount in the bed of these pickups.

It was very common for him to only get a few months service out of one of these old pickups before the frame started to bend in the middle, always in the same spot, similar to the truck in the article above. He didn't care since the trucks he was using were repaired salvage trucks destined for the junkyard themselves.

What was clear from talking with him and watching this happen over and over again that the problem wasn't how much weight he was carrying with the trucks, the problem was where he was carrying it which was way too far back. All that weight carried so far back behind the rear axle created a huge lever effect, and the frames all snapped at the point in the middle which had the least reinforcement. My guess is that most situations where this happens (with Ford, Ram, and Chevy) are due to improper or overloaded trucks and not any particular defect in the manufacturing. Pretty sure there are instructions in the owners manuals for pick up trucks about proper load placement, and two to three feet behind the rear bumper is not the proper place.

My guess is that with that much weight on the rear of the truck - enough to cause the frame to crack/snap - that the driver experienced problems controlling the truck due to a light front end and lack of weight on the steer axle.
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Old 12-30-2022, 09:07 PM   #29
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"My guess is that most situations where this happens (with Ford, Ram, and Chevy) are due to improper or overloaded trucks and not any particular defect in the manufacturing."

Most is the operative word here. There have been some glaring exceptions throughout the industry during my tenure. Mis engineered design and materials as well as premature corrosion. Foreign and domestic.
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Old 12-31-2022, 07:23 AM   #30
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Archimedes said, "If I had but a long enough lever I could move the world". Unless the lever snaps under the strain. A Cummins diesel at one end, and a lever extended about 4 to 5 feet off the back bumper? There's no real mystery here.
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Old 12-31-2022, 08:13 AM   #31
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Talking with the guys at coffee this morning about the original post and pictures, and one of the guys said that this was on the internet quite awhile ago. He said that the end result was that the owner had welded the front camper mounts to the frame, instead of drilling and bolting. The frame had cracked at the weld point. Warranty was denied because of the welding. I "assume" that it was a poor weld job that weakened the frame.
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Old 12-31-2022, 08:31 AM   #32
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Talking with the guys at coffee this morning about the original post and pictures, and one of the guys said that this was on the internet quite awhile ago. He said that the end result was that the owner had welded the front camper mounts to the frame, instead of drilling and bolting. The frame had cracked at the weld point. Warranty was denied because of the welding. I "assume" that it was a poor weld job that weakened the frame.
That's very possible. I do believe this camper is too much for a 3500 though (overloaded).

If I were to get this setup, I would first very carefully get weights and dimensions to understand the loads (spreadsheet) for a final estimated distribution (including any and all gear. I am pretty certain that would lead to a 4500, at a minimum.

I would not drill and mount the hold down bars.

I worked with a number of qualified medium duty upfitters who were certified by GM (among other certifications) to do major frame modifications, including cutting and stretching frames (lengthen wheelbase). They have their own engineers for this. I learned a lot from them.

I would have at least 2 feet of fish plating welded to the frame at each mounting point and have the bars welded to the plates. Again, someone who specializes in frame mods and welding techniques is critical.
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Old 12-31-2022, 09:05 AM   #33
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The frame isn’t heat treated, so it can be welded, but with caution.

The frame has existing hold down holes drilled. I wouldn’t drill any more.

When welding, the web is different than the flanges. Horizontal welds are better than vertical. Fish plates can be oval to avoid corners and stress risers. And the centre of the frame, between the axles, is the worst place to weld.

All of this likely pales beside gross overloading, aggravated by excessive weight hung off the back. Add in rough roads and the noted 60 mph travel speed on those roads, and it becomes a case of everything reducing the margins slightly, and the cumulative effect shows in the result.

And typical of these situations, the owner then claims warranty for a defective frame.
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Old 12-31-2022, 09:38 AM   #34
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Claims warranty but is unlikely to be successful, I think.
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Old 12-31-2022, 10:19 AM   #35
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Claims warranty but is unlikely to be successful, I think.
The warranty claim was denied by the manufacturer. The frame wasn’t defective, the operator was.
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Old 12-31-2022, 02:23 PM   #36
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The warranty claim was denied by the manufacturer. The frame wasn’t defective, the operator was.

Exactly.

The truck was overloaded.

The owner defends it by saying it had been fine up to that point.

I see a lot of guys on here and elsewhere, claiming the same thing, that their overloaded rigs are fine because they haven’t had a problem yet.

SMH.
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Old 12-31-2022, 03:33 PM   #37
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Well it looks like he will find out how good his insurance company will be.
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Old 01-01-2023, 08:36 AM   #38
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Any comments about this one?


https://www.youtube.com/shorts/qOiuNWdTOV8

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Old 01-01-2023, 08:45 AM   #39
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Is it just me, or is it sitting high in the front end, even with the 550 chassis?
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Old 01-01-2023, 09:00 AM   #40
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Nah, it's the eBike on the back that did it.
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