454 to Cummins

[triplenickel]

Anyone have updates on removing the Chevy 454CI and replacing with the Izuzu or Cummins diesel ...Is there a vendor out there that is doing these conversions...one in FL would be great....ready to take the $$$$plunge....
K

[mtlagger]

I too have a 6BT and an Allison 6 speed loaded and cocked for the swap into my 93 Classic 360. Just trying to figure out how long I can put up without it.

[tevake]

Triplenickel, have you forgotten about your post asking for help driving your coach to Fla?
A number of us have responded to it, and sent you PMs and emails.
Just to be left hanging with no replys from you.

What up, is it in fla now? Or?

Sorry about the high jack Mel.

Cheers Richard

[choctawmel]

Originally Posted by triplenickel

Anyone have updates on removing the Chevy 454CI and replacing with the Izuzu or Cummins diesel ...Is there a vendor out there that is doing these conversions...one in FL would be great....ready to take the $$$$plunge....
K

Used to be a guy in Shawnee, OK was putting Cummins in Suburbans. Then one day his shop was empty.

[choctawmel]

Originally Posted by tevake

Triplenickel, have you forgotten about your post asking for help driving your coach to Fla?
A number of us have responded to it, and sent you PMs and emails.
Just to be left hanging with no replys from you.

What up, is it in fla now? Or?

Sorry about the high jack Mel.

Cheers Richard

No need to be sorry.
Merry Christmas
I hope I get my captions chairs back tomorrow. Thought it'd take a couple weeks and it's working on a couple months to get them redone.
I don't usually winterize it as it stays in my insulated heated/cooled barn, but need to to give it another test run in the cold to check EGT.
I've been looking into a different turbo, but from want I've seen the stock one works the best at 1500-2000 rpm which is where I'm running. The 'others' don't start showing improved pressure till 2500 rpm and up.
Next step maybe water injection. But then where to put the 15-20 gallon water tank where I can get to it to fill it????

[Keyair]

Mel,
Merry Christmas to you!

I just sat with a cold beer... or 4, and re-read this whole thread...

It just blows me away what you have been through, and learned in the process.
For me, the takeaway has been huge. My conversion is a long way off, but I just learned a ton!

Its a small thing, to say THANK YOU, but I mean it.

I went through each page, and made notes, and saved your pictures.
A few observations I made for myself, and others following on with a Cummins install should note...

1/ The Exhaust manifold needs to be the horizontal type, not the 45deg type, like the motor came with. The original one pushes the whole turbo outboard and does not clear the floor tubing. Comparing the 4 known Cummins conversions, this is the common manifold. There are differences tho... Your's, and the GWBaker conversion, mount the Turbo underslung, and are Intercooled, and the the OEM Airstream Cummins, and Wayne Olson's the Turbo is top mounted and not intercooled, but have a JWAC (Jacket Water After Cooler) on the intake.

2/ Your motor and mine, have the low mounted, Right side AC compressor, as standard. This cannot stay as it fouls the RH chassis rail. It looks like you have yours moved to the Mid, RH position.

3/ On the OEM, and Olson's Cummins, the AC Compressor is mounted High, and LH on the engine.

4/ Both OEM, and Olson's Cummins are Bosch VE Injection pump models, and Non-Intercooled. JWBaker's is also VE Pump, but is Intercooled, but upon reviewing all his pictures, I cannot see an AC Compressor mounted.

5/ This might seem a small detail, but here is what I think is a big deal... When you look at VE-Pump and the later P-Pump, the P-Pump is HUGE in comparison... and I bet/believe that the LH High mount AC Compressor will not fit on P-Pump models.... which is fine because that is about where the Intercooler pipe feeding the intake will be going if you are P-Pumped or Intercooled.

For those not familiar with the Cummins road motors... Motors made between 1989 and 1991.5 were 12 valve, VE Pump injected and not Intercooled. 1991.5 to 1993 were VE-Pump and Intercooled. After 1993, and up to the arrival of the 24V engine, the engine was P-Pump Injected, and Intercooled. VE pump is simpler, but limited to about 100hp/200tq by tuning, but the P-Pump is a monster, and sky is the limit, and doubling the stock motor output is quite easy.

[Tater]

Originally Posted by triplenickel

Anyone have updates on removing the Chevy 454CI and replacing with the Izuzu or Cummins diesel ...Is there a vendor out there that is doing these conversions...one in FL would be great....ready to take the $$$$plunge....
K

Duraburb, Inc. In Apopka, FL can probably help you or tell you who can.

[Keyair]

Or...
http://cumminsdieselrepowers.com/

There is also really good info and conversion kits here...
https://www.dieselconversion.com/blo...e-Information/

[choctawmel]

Originally Posted by Keyair

Mel,
Merry Christmas to you!

I just sat with a cold beer... or 4, and re-read this whole thread...

It just blows me away what you have been through, and learned in the process.
For me, the takeaway has been huge. My conversion is a long way off, but I just learned a ton!

Its a small thing, to say THANK YOU, but I mean it.

I went through each page, and made notes, and saved your pictures.
A few observations I made for myself, and others following on with a Cummins install should note...

1/ The Exhaust manifold needs to be the horizontal type, not the 45deg type, like the motor came with. The original one pushes the whole turbo outboard and does not clear the floor tubing. Comparing the 4 known Cummins conversions, this is the common manifold. There are differences tho... Your's, and the GWBaker conversion, mount the Turbo underslung, and are Intercooled, and the the OEM Airstream Cummins, and Wayne Olson's the Turbo is top mounted and not intercooled, but have a JWAC (Jacket Water After Cooler) on the intake.

2/ Your motor and mine, have the low mounted, Right side AC compressor, as standard. This cannot stay as it fouls the RH chassis rail. It looks like you have yours moved to the Mid, RH position.

3/ On the OEM, and Olson's Cummins, the AC Compressor is mounted High, and LH on the engine.

4/ Both OEM, and Olson's Cummins are Bosch VE Injection pump models, and Non-Intercooled. JWBaker's is also VE Pump, but is Intercooled, but upon reviewing all his pictures, I cannot see an AC Compressor mounted.

5/ This might seem a small detail, but here is what I think is a big deal... When you look at VE-Pump and the later P-Pump, the P-Pump is HUGE in comparison... and I bet/believe that the LH High mount AC Compressor will not fit on P-Pump models.... which is fine because that is about where the Intercooler pipe feeding the intake will be going if you are P-Pumped or Intercooled.

For those not familiar with the Cummins road motors... Motors made between 1989 and 1991.5 were 12 valve, VE Pump injected and not Intercooled. 1991.5 to 1993 were VE-Pump and Intercooled. After 1993, and up to the arrival of the 24V engine, the engine was P-Pump Injected, and Intercooled. VE pump is simpler, but limited to about 100hp/200tq by tuning, but the P-Pump is a monster, and sky is the limit, and doubling the stock motor output is quite easy.

Yes the P pump almost made it a no go. No room for the shutdown solenoid, the air inlet tube or the wiring harness. Why I use the water/air intercooler on top of the radiator, choke cable for the shutoff and wrapped all the fuel tubes coming off the P pump.
Not sure I'd say the power in unlimited with the P pump because this is a work engine not a race engine.
I know someone working on putting the P pump on a 24V cummins. Now that's a monster iin the making.

[Keyair]

Interesting.
My conversion is way off, but I see your footprints in the sand ahead of me!

My point was the P-Pump is basically a little piston engine... you can port and polish, bore and stroke it to make whatever you want... I see 1000hp and 2000tq everywhere.... but those are not for what we want. I doubt these motors can sustain those numbers for more than a few seconds.

If ya put such a motor in our MH, and subject it to a long hard climb up a grade, it would either melt down/blow up, or catapult you over the crest!

We need a motor that at least matches the 454 in power on an incline, but exceeds it in reliability, longevity , and MPG.
I just posted a dyno test of a stock 454 from a motorhome, in my thread and the results are surprising!

[choctawmel]

I took the injectors out and took them to be tested: They are all worn, leaking, not sealing, bad spray pattern. The shop said that it would be giving me low power, high EGT and smoke. These are stock 30hp injectors. So, new 40hp injectors are on order.

[GCinSC2]

Next the smoke will be coming from the tires.

[choctawmel]

Originally Posted by GCinSC2

Next the smoke will be coming from the tires.

With the price of tires being what they are..... I hope not.
But then they wouldn't just weather to death.

[Isuzusweet]

Originally Posted by choctawmel

I took the injectors out and took them to be tested: They are all worn, leaking, not sealing, bad spray pattern. The shop said that it would be giving me low power, high EGT and smoke. These are stock 30hp injectors. So, new 40hp injectors are on order.

Just remember people that swapping injectors for higher fuel rate ones got Vycan in trouble with blown head gaskets and cost him huge money and time. The weak link is that the head is OEM bolted onto the block. If you're thinking of using higher flow injectors, possibly resulting in higher fuel flow and increased cylinder pressures, may I suggest you swap out the head bolts for ARP studs.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EuY1-T0kybk

Cheers
Tony

[choctawmel]

Originally Posted by Isuzusweet

Just remember people that swapping injectors for higher fuel rate ones got Vycan in trouble with blown head gaskets and cost him huge money and time. The weak link is that the head is OEM bolted onto the block. If you're thinking of using higher flow injectors, possibly resulting in higher fuel flow and increased cylinder pressures, may I suggest you swap out the head bolts for ARP studs.

Cheers
Tony

Thanks for the advice, but I think I'm safe.
These new injectors are the same as would be in an engine in front of a standard transmission. The engines that are in automatic transmissions (mine)are tuned back because of the weak Dodge automatics.
I should of do a lot of things before I installed it: head studs, killer pin, oil pump.....

[GCinSC2]

Killer dowel pin is unknown status?

That's a must do.

I know of two approaches, remove gear case cover, tap in and install tab to keep it in place. Not terrible in a truck might be massive pita in mh.

Second pretty sure a drill jig exists that died the fix w/o removing case cover. Iirc it drills a hole, you tap threads and this gets a bolt in it that keeps pin in position.

Review this https://www.turbodieselregister.com/...-Pin-are-ready

[Keyair]

ARP head stud kit is on my list from the get go, but it’s a crazy $400 and also you need to remove the rocker pedestals and machine 1/4” off them to allow the new bolts to clear the valve covers.
My KDP already escaped like a NK defector, taking a chunk of timing case with him! Based on my analysis this happed long ago based on evidence of what looks like epoxy on the timing cover chunk.

[GCinSC2]

I bought a '97 3500 5.9L that suffered a broken case from KDP escape. It took ME 5 weekends of absolute dirty work to bring it back. Not bragging or complaining about the 5 weeks, that's just how it was.

[choctawmel]

Only way I can see to get to the timing cover is from the front..... Remove grill, A/C condenser, radiator, intercooler. I'm hoping it can wait till next fall.

By then maybe I'll have a new knee or two. About killed me getting on my knees r&r the injectors.

[GCinSC2]

Mel,

Exactly why you should look into the drill fixture technique. Its all external, cover stays on.

Gary