1962 Ambassador Restoration – One Bite at a Time

[LM782]

Quite a transformation, and, in mere two years no less. I’ve not made anywhere close to the same progress… At least I could help peer in the rabbit hole of espresso.

Luis

[steinVT]

About time to start posting progress to the forums. After a busy summer of camping, going to vintage rallies and "working" (not yet retired), I finally got back to the Ambassador. My plan is to install the solar panels, install the mini-split so I have heat as it gets cold in Vermont, finish the rough wiring and install the interior wall skins. That accomplished, I can take measurements and work on the furniture in my basement shop over the winter.

First order of business; install the solar panels. I choose Renolgy panels mainly because of their dimensions. I am packing as many on the roof as I possibly can, but I also want to try not to destroy the classic lines of the Airstream. The Renolgy panels were narrower than most, so it allowed me to put on three rows of four panels each. This will also kept the panels closer to the roof. The ultimate would have been installing flexible panels, but they still don't seem to last more than a couple of years. Too much time and money invested to have to replace them in a couple of years.

To get that many panels on required some modifications to the roof vents. First the middle vent had to go. I pulled it off and then buck riveted on a al-clad patch. Next I had to remove the large Astrodome in the front. I liked the look of it but the panels overhung it by about 6 inches, it was a big thermal leak and it didn't add substantially to the ventilation. I added a patch to the back of the hole and then installed a powered fan vent. I also replaced the rear vent with a powered vent. As I said in a previous post, I like the Fantastic fans sold by VTC, but they haven't been available forever. I met Steve, the owner of VTC, at the International rally this year and he said he has no idea when they will become available. So I bought some fans off of Amazon at about half the price. They look great and seem to run smooth and quiet. We'll see how long they last.

This is a photo of the forward vent patch.


So here is a picture of what the sealing compound looked like under the rear vent. Any wonder it was leaking?


To position the panels close to the trailer and make sure they wouldn't fly off, I decided to fabricate my own brackets. I made brackets from 1/8" AL stock that I riveted directly onto each solar panel. Each corner bracket is secured with four 1/8" pop rivets. Decided against buck riveting because of the glass on the panel. Then I bent up L-brackets to be buck riveted to the trailer roof. For final assembly, the panels are bolted together with SS bolts and ny-loc nuts. I really have zero fear of a panel coming loose on the road.

Here is a picture of an outside joint.


And here a picture of a joint between the middle row and outside row.


Hard to get a picture of all the panels, guess I need a drone.


Added two feed-throughs to the center patch to get the power from the panels inside. Decided to set up the panels as two independent arrays in a 3P2S configuration. That means there two 6 panels arrays, each with three sets of two panels in series. That results with an open circuit voltage of 44v and short circuit current of 17.6 amps.

Pretty happy with the final look of 1.2kw of solar. - Mark

[57Vintage]

Nice job with the solar install. How many aH are you thinking of for batteries?

[dbj216]

It looks great steinVT; The narrow solar panels certainly conform well to the shape of the Ambassador, and your mounting bracket design looks very robust.
When done, you will be able to boondock for many, many nights off grid until the water fills your tanks.

I painted the roof of the wife's Limited last summer with Henry Tropi Cool silicone white roof paint. It seems like a good product and will certainly seal up any cracks as it is quite thick, and quite rubbery feeling. I hope it will reflect some of the hot Colorado sun that cooks our trailer. I haven't had a good test yet, but folks say it can reduce interior temps by 10 degrees. That is the sum of my solar energy project.

David

[steinVT]

Originally Posted by 57Vintage

Nice job with the solar install. How many aH are you thinking of for batteries?

Thanks. The longer I wait to order the batteries, the bigger they seem to get. My first design was 10 kwh. For reference a Tesla power wall is about 13.5kwh. My latest design is for 15kwh. Basically three 5kwh 24v server rack batteries.

Load calculations show that would provide about a day and a half of use. I don't put much faith in those types of calculations as they don't take into account changing behavior. When there is no sun and the batteries are getting low, you probably won't use the microwave or run the mini-split 24 hours a day. I think that 15kwh should provide a nice reserve for long term boondocking. - Mark

[57Vintage]

Don't make the same mistake I did and underestimate the final weight, loaded and full of FW. Had to change out axle and springs last year to upgrade.

I consoled myself with the fact that allowed an upgrade of the brakes from 12" solid rotors to 13" vented rotors and larger calipers, but also required 8 lug wheels. As always, learning more from mistakes than successes.

[steinVT]

I didn't know you had to do that. That is a lot of work and expense. What were the big hitters for that weight gain?

Up until now I have been mainly focused on ball weight and left/right bias. The following screen capture is from my CG spreadsheet. The total weight of all the items is 1300#. That includes 1/2 full tanks. What I haven't calculated is the weight of all of the items I have removed. The original refrigerator alone had to be 150#. Add to that the steel freshwater tank, furnace, stove, water heater, air conditioner and propane tanks and I bet I am more than half of that number.

Low weight is one of the main reasons I love vintage. Thanks for reminding me of that. - Mark

Anyone wants a copy of the sheet, send me a PM.

[57Vintage]

Mine was a combination of the changes:

I replaced crossmembers (from the axle back) with 2X4 tubing to get more surface area on the bottom for bolting on tank covers.

The tank covers are 1/4" aluminum plate to support a full tank. (I got a bargain when a guy closed his business to move and sold me three 4X8 sheets for $200.) Probably overkill

Adding the perimeter frame (1.5X1.5X.125 square tubing) to mount the channel and shell on.

Five tanks (2 FW, 2 GW, 1 BW) to get more capacity. Although I rarely have to travel with grey or black tanks full. The weight of the tanks add up.

Replaced the shower pan with a tub, which I heavily reinforced to make the bottom and aisle side less flexible.

A/C on the roof.

I guessed I would add about 1500#, but just didn't track the actual amount. I'm now at 5200# on the axle when hooked up and WD on.

I replaced the original axle with a 5200# dexter and had the original springs rebuilt and rearched. Now I have a 7000# axle and the new springs are rated for 6800#.

[Scott S]

A word of warning about adding weight to vintage Airstreams. The trailers were designed be lightweight. This includes the frames. They were designed to only support a certain amount of weight. About 15 or 20 years ago a friend and former Vintage Club president did not think about this when he added weight to his beautiful (mid?) 50's Airstream trailer. A few years later the frame failed...cracked in half from how he described it. It was not a rust issue, but a fatigue issue from being required to hold too much.

[steinVT]

Originally Posted by Scott S

A word of warning about adding weight to vintage Airstreams. The trailers were designed be lightweight. This includes the frames. They were designed to only support a certain amount of weight. About 15 or 20 years ago a friend and former Vintage Club president did not think about this when he added weight to his beautiful (mid?) 50's Airstream trailer. A few years later the frame failed...cracked in half from how he described it. It was not a rust issue, but a fatigue issue from being required to hold too much.

Interesting. I wonder how much weight he added? The frame in my Safari was buckled and it was original, no added weight. Parts of the frame were badly rusted, but the section that failed didn't look to bad from the outside. I believe there was internal rust involved. - Mark

[dbj216]

As the late Inland Andy used to describe Airstream construction: they are designed to flex, the frame holds the body up, and the body holds the frame up. And certainly the subfloor adds strength to both frame and body.

Many of us know the 70s Airstreams were built differently. The rear body seal was woefully inadequate, and allowed rain water to penetrate under the subfloor and rot out the body mounting bolts to the frame. Then comes the rear end separation, which means the frame rails flex over every bump. My trailer had about 2" of frame rail sag axle plate to the rear. My friends Sovereign had about 4".

So yep, Airstream trailers aren't designed for hauling heavy objects. I think the gross vehicle weight rating on the nameplate on the body is the designed limit. Plan accordingly and no need to install a piano in the Airstream.

David

[steinVT]

It really is incredible just how many steps there are in putting one of these old trailers back together. Here are a couple more bites of the elephant.

Since there is no propane, no need for the exhaust stacks for the furnace and water heater. I used 0.040" ALCLAD, a bit stiffer than the standard 0.032". Looks more like a door than a patch. Before and after.


Originally the Ambassador had an electrical cord that stashed in a door in the belly pan. Not a fan of that setup, I ended up using the same connector I used on the Safari.


I used my father's drone to finally get a good picture of the solar array. I am thinking the panels might actually help keep the trailer cooler as it is essentially shading the roof.


After a number of very involved designs to install the mini-split compressor on the front A-frame, in the end all it took was about 14" of 1 1/2" angle iron and a couple of welding rods. It is very secure. Eventually I will have to build a travel cover as I don't want to expose it to travel grit and grime.


My plan is to get all of the outside stuff done and the mini-split installed before the weather turns. This winter most of my time will be in my basement wood shop, but at least I will have heat in the trailer if I have to be there. - Mark

[Bubba L]

Mark, the isolators look great. When you design your shroud, will it just rest on the tongue? That’s a good idea to get the mini installed before the winter freezes set in. The heat pump works really well when needed.

[steinVT]

Originally Posted by Bubba L

When you design your shroud, will it just rest on the tongue?

The plan is to build a box of aluminum with a base of 90 degree angle that will rest on the tongue. Hopefully I can get it to look as good as yours.

What do you use to lock it on? I was thinking about using dzus fasteners into some more welded on brackets. Something like these. - Mark

[Bubba L]

Mark, the fasteners you show to hold down the condenser shroud should work. I used rivets to fasten spring handles to the sides of the shroud to make it easier to lift it off the condenser. I had welded a chain link directly below the handle center on the frame (post
#498). I just use a strap and buckle through the link and handle to hold the shroud down. I just wanted to make sure nothing ever came loose with the bouncing of the tongue while towing.

[steinVT]

With the compressor firmly mounted on the trailer tongue, I next turned my attention to how to mount the air handler. In my mind I had envisioned mounting it above the front window so it could blow it's lovely warmth (and coolness) down the length of the trailer. So that's what I did.

Here is the mounting system I came up with. It's built out of 20-20 extruded aluminum channel. I rivetted short sections of 1" aluminum U-channel to the end cap with 3/16" rivets. I was able to hang from it, although it deformed the roof some, so the 30# air handler should be fine.


It looked ok when installed, although lower than I would have liked.


When building the 3D model of the trailer, I skipped making an accurate model of the end caps. The air handler fit fine in the model. Notice the length of the bottom arm. That was required because of the curvature of the end cap. It really made the unit stick into the room.


After bumping my head for the forth time, I decided it just isn't going to work. The new plan is to install it under the front window, behind a couch that will reside there. I am thinking that I might get away with ducting only to get the heat out at floor level under the couch. However for cooling, I will add an axial fan or two and ductwork to blow the cold air out of registers in the above window locker.


I think it should work out fine, although people might wonder what those 8 extra rivets are for in the front cap. - Mark

[Bubba L]

Mark, we ran into the same issue with the air handler placement. The curvature of the walls near the ceiling makes placing the blower there an almost impossible challenge. I’ve seen it done, but it’s a head knocker. You could drop the AH down near the floor with a transfer duct at the front of the unit. Off the transfer duct you can do like you mentioned and run your heat down low and duct the cold high. Will you have a built in couch assembly with foot locker storage or a click clack type of couch?

[steinVT]

Hi Bubba, our plan now is a click-clack (jack knife?) couch attached to bottom drawer slides with latches. I will build a pedestal with drawers. We already bought a couch, which is really comfortable to sleep on, but would certainly fit better in an eight foot wide body. Just getting the interior walls in now and will do a test fit soon.

What cfm blower did you end up using and would you do anything different if you were to do it again? - Mark

[Bubba L]

Mark, I believe we used a 6” in-line duct fan that is about 240 cfm. Take a look at Post #515 on our build thread, it explains. We added a switch for the fan so we could turn it on if need be. If you have a transition duct on the front of the air handler that has sides that sweep to the round duct, you may not need a fan. The blower in the ah is pretty strong. Wish you could run a 4” duct on the street side hidden at the floor/wall corner to the back. Maybe take the duct up inside a wardrobe with a register. The hardest part for me was balancing air while dealing with the curvature of the inside walls/ceiling.

[coloradoup]

Mark, for my mini split install I am going to build a 10-12-inch-deep wall, that is the forward wall of the mid bath, that will hold the head unit which I will install just below the upper cabinet level. That wall will also have most of my electronics in it and be accessible from doors and under the forward base cabinet. It will blow towards the front of the trailer but I will install one of those 12 volt fans to help move the air around the trailer. I will probably be able to have a door that covers the thing when not in use. It also happens to be right where I need the grey tank vent so that's another reason for the fat wall. I may even be able to have a little upper cabinet space left over.