A New Challenge-1963 Overlander rehab project

[utee94]

Many thanks to GreatPumpkin, who kindly sent me the cast head pieces that he retained from his old awning of the same brand, but different vintage. The measurements are the same as mine, and as soon as I retrieve Goliath from storage, I'll double-check to make sure that they fit. I have no doubt they will.

Thanks again!

[utee94]

I have done absolutely nothing for the trailer for the last month+, but that is all about to change. I'll be going camping for the final time this season next weekend, and upon our return, it will be time to tear into the back half of the trailer and begin some major projects. Here is the list of what I must do:

• Remove bathroom and bedroom furniture
• Remove top-flooring
• Remove lower interior panels for back 8' of trailer (or more if necessary)
• Cut out back 8' of sub-floor-- there is known floor rot at the back of the trailer
• Remove inside of belly-pan in this area.
• Evaluate frame condition-- I know of at least one rusted cross-piece at the back, there might be more
• Repair/replace frame members as necessary
• POR-15 the frame
• Install gray tank
• Install new subfloor for back 8' of trailer
• Install new top-floor covering from bathroom through bedroom
• Repair/refinish bathtub
• Repair/replace vanity and counter-top
• Complete renovation and redecoration of bathroom and shower stall including wall and ceiling surfaces
• Re-plumb freshwater system for supply (hot and cold) as well as drainage (to incorporate new gray tank)
• Make modifications to twins
• Make modifications to bedroom overheads
• Redecorate bedroom including wall and ceiling surfaces
• Button everything back up and get on the road!

Definitely aggressive. It will be a boat-load of work, and my pie-in-the-sky wishful thinking target for it is the Texas State Vintage Rally in very early February. Realistically, I'll be delighted if I can just finish the frame and floor work and have it buttoned up and road worthy by then.

My ultimate goal for having all of the systems working and the redecoration complete is the WDCU's Cherry Blossom Rally, where I have promised Frank and Steve and Rob and John I will meet them with a completed (back-half) trailer.

So, wish me luck, and all of your help and support will be very much appreciated (and needed! ).

-Marcus

[overlander63]

Marcus, it may be better, and you will be less likely to lose focus, if you tackle each part of the project separately. Not everybody can do a shell-off rebuild in a weekend, and starting and finishing part "A", then starting and finishing part "B", will give you more satisfaction than trying to do everything at once, and getting overwhelmed. I'd hate to see Goliath languish in the backyard because the project got too big.
Maybe get the bathroom (probably the most needy part) completed before doing the bedroom. Replace the plumbing in each section as you go.

[utee94]

Yes Terry, thanks for the input and that's definitely a good plan.

The mods in the bedroom will most likely be very limited. If I don't get to them, then I have no problem reinstalling all of the existing furniture as-is, until I have a chance to get to it. As you know, the current set-up in the bedroom is plenty functional and comfortable. My (admittedly limited) examination of the sub-flooring in the bedroom tells me that it's fine, so I most likely don't have any real structural work to do there.

As you know, the plumbing is all located under the SS twin, so it will be most efficient to do all of that at once, and it will be easiest if the beds are out at the time. I intend to run the new top-flooring wall-to-wall, with transitions (if necessary) at natural room boundaries. I anticipate one transition for sure at the boundary between the bedroom and the galley, but it might also make sense to put one between the bath and bedroom, although I'd prefer not to unless absolutely necessary.

I'll have a better feel for what I'll need once the furniture is out and the systems are routed a little more efficiently.

[byamcaravanner]

Marcus,

That is quite a list!

As far as how far to take things in one gulp... use the piece of floor that is between the wheel wells to determine the dividing point. This piece does not extend under the exterior walls and can be removed without lifting the shell.

Since you are ultimately doing a total renovation you will want to do the rear bulkhead when you do the bathroom. To do this you will need to remove the twins and the overheads. This leaves the question of whether to renovate the twins or just reinstall the originals. My guess is that you will find that the twins extend onto a piece of floor that will not be replaced until you do the front half of the trailer. For this reason, I would just reinstall the twins until you do the front. I doubt that is what you wanted to hear, but one consolation... you CAN redo the overheads... Just make sure the you allow for the BR/Galley bulkhead removal at a later date.

Good Luck!

A hint... as you get started, the integrity of the joints between the sub-floor pieces is VERY important. Don't just butt them over the cross-member.

[utee94]

Thanks Steve. Rather than butting over a x-member, what would you suggest? A vertical lap joint? Or keying them together somehow? Dovetail? Some other interlocking joints?

I'm open to all suggestions. If all goes well, I will be at this critical point in 3 weeks.

[utee94]

With respect to the rear bulkheads, they are formed by the rear tall wardrobes on each side. I believe those to be structurally sound though a bit worn. I have a couple of options-- either refinish as they currently are, or veneer over them. I will only rebuild them if I must, but right now I do not believe they need it.

One other item I've considered is installing pocket doors that recess into those bulkheads/wardrobes. If I decided to go THAT route, well, all bets are off. That is a considerable amount of additional work. I think it would look really cool, but I'm afraid I'll run out of time. It is imperative that I get the trailer back on the road in the early Spring so that my family and I can use it. Otherwise, my darling wife might lose interest in the project, and even worse, become angry with me!

[hampstead38]

Just a question, rather than 3/4" plywood with joints, why not create a subfloor out of two sheets of thinner material "glued and screwed," with all screws countersunk. Two layers would allow a substantive overlap (two or three feet?") and eliminate any of the normal joints. This would effectively make the floor into one giant sheet of plywood. Any thoughts?

[overlander63]

You could use a short piece of plywood screwed under one part of the floor, then lay the next piece of plywood against the first piece, the edge resting on the piece that is under the first piece. Screw the second piece to the piece underneath. That will reduce flexing.
As for the divider door, you could shorten the two twin beds about an inch and a half, install a roller on top and a guide on the bottom, and mount a split door between the bedroom and bathroom. Each half would roll over to the wall out of the way, and you could roll them together for moments of needed privacy in the 'loo.

[byamcaravanner]

Originally Posted by hampstead38

Just a question, rather than 3/4" plywood with joints, why not create a subfloor out of two sheets of thinner material "glued and screwed," ... Any thoughts?

Your '67 features depressed cross-members at the floor joints. This allows a 6"+/- spline that doubles the floor thickness at the joints.

For the floor in my '67, I added gorilla glue and biscuits in addition to the factory spline to provide a very strong joint.



Biscuits (or as Frank calls the "Lamellos")

[utee94]

Good ideas everyone, keep them coming.

So here's what probably sounds like a bone-headed question-- how do you cut the floor out without tagging your blade on the frame and x-pieces below? I'm planning on using my circular saw, so do you set the blade depth slightly shallower than the floor depth and just cut away? Then sort-of "break-up" the pieces as you pull them out (obviously elevator bolts and screws need to be removed first...)?

It is important to note that my floor replacement will be performed shell-on. I do not have the room to take the shell off.

[TwinkytheKid]

Originally Posted by utee94

Good ideas everyone, keep them coming.

So here's what probably sounds like a bone-headed question-- how do you cut the floor out without tagging your blade on the frame and x-pieces below? I'm planning on using my circular saw, so do you set the blade depth slightly shallower than the floor depth and just cut away? Then sort-of "break-up" the pieces as you pull them out (obviously elevator bolts and screws need to be removed first...)?

It is important to note that my floor replacement will be performed shell-on. I do not have the room to take the shell off.

Most circular saws have a depth adjustment so the blade won't go too deep. Just loosen the wing nut at the back of the table, move the table, and tighten the wing nut.

[utee94]

Yes indeed, my circular saw has this adjustment. Just checking to see if that is the "preferred method" according to the Laws Of The Forums.

-Marcus

[byamcaravanner]

Originally Posted by utee94

I've considered is installing pocket doors that recess into those bulkheads/wardrobes.

Having a pocket door in my '67 and an accordion door in my '67, I can say that the pocket door is overrated. I'll offer the following reasons to stay with the factory door.

- The bathrooms in these trailers are rather small and the flexibility of the factory door will provide some extra "butt-room" especially while helping with one of the kids.

- Because of the curvature of the trailer sides you would not be able to achieve the same wide open passage that is in the stock trailer set-up.

- The pocket door system would add significant weight compared to the feather light accordion door.

- Having disassembled the pocket door in my '67... you may not realize how much you will loose in closet space.

...what was the reason you wanted pocket doors?

[utee94]

Originally Posted by byamcaravanner

Having a pocket door in my '67 and an accordion door in my '67, I can say that the pocket door is overrated. I'll offer the following reasons to stay with the factory door.

- The bathrooms in these trailers are rather small and the flexibility of the factory door will provide some extra "butt-room" especially while helping with one of the kids.

- Because of the curvature of the trailer sides you would not be able to achieve the same wide open passage that is in the stock trailer set-up.

- The pocket door system would add significant weight compared to the feather light accordion door.

- Having disassembled the pocket door in my '67... you may not realize how much you will loose in closet space.

...what was the reason you wanted pocket doors?

Excellent points Steve. I was looking for a reason not to do it. Now I have it.

No changes, only improvements. Words to live by!

[byamcaravanner]

Originally Posted by utee94

Just checking to see if that is the "preferred method" according to the Laws Of The Forums.

Make a longitudinal cut in the center of the sub floor to be removed. This will allow you to pull it up and out.

[Alumanutz]

Marcus, I will be posting pictures of my floor repair tonight. Actually right after I post this. You will find that a "Sawzall" will be a wonderful tool to have during these repairs. If you have rot, you had/have water on the floor. That means that the bolts are rusted. Not necessarily rusted enough to break off but rusted enough that you can't remove the nut. A Sawzall will cut them off. Also you can use it to cut the floor where the circular saw won't go. I will be looking forward to following your blog soon.

NUTZ

[vhord]

Originally Posted by utee94

how do you cut the floor out without tagging your blade on the frame and x-pieces below? I'm planning on using my circular saw, so do you set the blade depth slightly shallower than the floor depth and just cut away?

Marcus,

Yes, just set the depth of your circular saw slightly shallower than the floor thickness and cut away. If you want to protect your blade be careful as you approach the splices. There are some ugly corrugated fasteners there that will not do your blade any good. I think they were installed from under the floor so they may not be visible from the top. But if you ruin a blade you can just go to the hardware store and buy another one. They could really use the business.

Good luck and get busy. (maybe that last statement was meant for me.)

[slowmover]

Originally Posted by utee94

Thanks Terry, I almost PM'd this question to you, but I decided your answer should become part of the thread's history.

As to year of production plates: Texas allows such -- with restrictions -- on old cars.

For trailers I am not aware of being able to do the same, I went through the DPS site and the question is not answered directly (it may not have been asked, either). Were I to do so on my 1983 trailer (now 25-yrs old, the key number) I would write a certified letter to the DPS.

BUT, the DPS does offer a Texas Classic Trailer license plate with the option of custom lettering. That will be my choice. About $15 for just the plate, and $55 or so for the options.

[vhord]

Originally Posted by REDNAX

As to year of production plates: Texas allows such -- with restrictions -- on old cars.

For trailers I am not aware of being able to do the same.........

It is allowed in Texas. I was almost able to get mine approved (see my avatar) until they realized that they were "Trailer" plates and did not state "Travel Trailer". I am not even sure if Texas had Travel Trailer plates in that year. I am still looking. Maybe someone on the Forum knows the history and can put me out of my misery.