Corrosion problems with new Airstreams

[Gene]

Excellent analysis, 2air. Even using tap water to wash with has some salt in it. The chlorine bonds with sodium in the water, a guess what? Table salt, NaCl. They just about flood the roads with Mag Chloride in Colorado. Besides killing roadside vegetation and runoff into streams, I suspect once it dries, dried salt is coating vehicles all year. There's no escape. Maybe we should wash with distilled water.

[Silvertwinkie]

Joe, it is true, GM replaced my rims due to corroision on them. Keep in mind a few things.

First, the Suburban has been exposed to salts of all kinds here in the rust belt since the 2004 winter when I got it. It becomes the daily driver when there is more than 2" of snow, so it does see a significant amount of road salts and various chorides. It has stayed outside for weeks at a time, though it does mostly stay in the garage. Still the corrosion on my Suburban rims was totally pale in comparison to what happened on the my first set of rims on the Safari and on the second set, let alone my 2nd set of tail lights and the body. The Airstream has never been in any snow since I took delivery, no salt or chorides of any kind. When I got it, I washed and waxed it right away and has been on the wash and wax routine since new. Rims, tail lights and entry access door trim as well. My corrosion on the Safari is on the sheetmetal under the rivets, the cuts, rivets on the general body (not near the rivet line), rivet line corrosion at the cuts, door trims, tail lights, rims and on and on.

None of my rivets appear to be corroding in any way, but the sheetmetal around it is.

As for a gouge in the sheetmetal from the awning....man, me too, just this past weekend too. I was beyond upset, but I too waxed the heck out of it and will continue to do so.

By the way, the observation of the CCD/SE interior was to point out that it isn't a dissimilar metal thing as some may have thought way, way back. If it were, the inside skins would show this too, but it is interesting to note that the interiors do get humidity, yet no ill effects reported. My inside backsplash in the kitchen area, right as rain, of course, like the outside, has seen little to no environmental exposure to most anything, yet has the issue all over the outside.....

[Tim A.]

2air has raised some very good points and one factor with the various salts applied to roads in the winter is that they do not necessarily disappear during good weather. With rain, melting snow, etc. they dissolve and that solution flows into the abundant pore spaces in the road surface and road shoulders where it dries and the salts precipitate as very fine (dustlike) crystals. That crystalline material surely comes loose as dust any time of the year that the roads are dry and can collect on the surface of our Airstreams. Wash the Airstream, the dustlike crystals dissolve and that solution enters surface cracks or the spaces around rivets, etc.

As for the lack of corrosion on rivets themselves, it will be much less obvious than the filiform corrosion of the clearcoated skin. There, the corrosion is localized and under the clearcoat so that none of the powdery oxide can be rubbed off.

[clancy_boy]

I have no dog in this fight so I only post for informational purposes only. I have not read the whole thread but have from time to time kept up with your corrosion issues Silvertwinkie.

If you feel salt is the root cause then there are salt removal chemicals that would be Airstream safe. We use these on our AUV's operated in marine environments. The salt that dries on the internal frameworks is stagering. We have had great success with this product in removing all traces of salt buildup and contamination.

Salt Elim Salt Removal Chemical

[lewster]

I guess I'll just take my bet and ball and go home!

If anyone else is interested in the results that I get on my CCD, you can PM me as I won't post to this thread again. Experimentation is great, but my results differ in the real world.......yours may also.

Thanks!

[5cats]

Originally Posted by lewster

If anyone else is interested in the results that I get on my CCD, you can PM me as I won't post to this thread again.

That's a shame, as I always find your posts informative and helpful. Plus I'm affected .
I'll continue to look forward to your insights elsewhere.

Cheers,
-jd.

[2airishuman]

Originally Posted by lewster

...If anyone else is interested in the results that I get on my CCD, you can PM me as I won't post to this thread again. Experimentation is great, but my results differ in the real world...

that's too bad, you should post YOUR results here too.

we are ALL just trying to find a way/s of dealing with this issue effectively.

i haven't used acf-50 but like t-9, it leaves a waxy residue which should be a good thing.

acf-50 only seems to be available from aviation supply shops...

your trial reads like an experiment too, so have at it...

the issue for me is that simply applying the product and not seeing filliform develop doesn't mean it worked.

and the previous filliform may have been arrested by washing OUT the chlorine from the tracts...

the product claims to "stop rust and corrosion on any metal" so that's how i tested it.

it's simple enough, IF it doesn't stop/alter basic rust formation (on iron) which can happen quickly, how effective can it be long term ?

and i'm not suggesting my trial was perfect... but the 5 week trip was a lot of fun!

i also sprayed the drive shaft on the truck with wd-40 and c-x and t-9 and 2 other spray penetrants...

only the t-9 area had any product left after a month of driving and rain....

so how is my foolin' around any less 'real world' than yours?

to quote albert einstein...

"if we knew what we were doing, it would not be called research"

so i'd encourage everyone to put up there trials for public scrutiny, don't b a ...

my concern was that a brand new owner was considering 'coating' a new trailer with this stuff....

so lewster, do you wanna stake your reputation on recommending that?

acf-50 and t-9 both claim to be 'safe on plastics, rubber and gaskets'

c-x make NO mention of this, but DOES claim to "penetrate...to the base metal to allow quick easy dismantling of...components"

that isn't what i want to do to the a/s, my hitch and truck and over-inflated lumpy marathons do that just fine!

cheers
2air'

the salt eliminating wash looks promising too....

now 4 the experiments! haaaaaaahaaaaaaaaahaaaaaaaa (wicked scientist laughter)

[5cats]

Originally Posted by 2airishuman

i haven't used acf-50 but like t-9, it leaves a waxy residue which should be a good thing.

acf-50 only seems to be available from aviation supply shops...

I think there are some detailed posting on ACF-50 earlier in this thread, and my experience is that it's a "super-lubricant", much like your description of Corrosion-X, which doesn't seem to "dry up" much over several days. Which reminds me: I owe everyone here a six-months-later follow-up on my own treatment results (pending)... Here's the procedure I performed:

1. apply ACF-50 and leave it in place a good while (4+ days in my case);
2. wipe down excess ACF-50;
3. apply Boeshield T-9 and leave in place to dry;
4. buff residual T-9, leaving a protective "wax-like" covering.

Since then, I've only washed/waxed.

I ordered the ACF-50 & Boeshield from http://www.aircraftspruce.com/ (link):

• 09-00364 ACF-50, 32 OZ BOTTLE $30.70
• 09-00378 BOESHIELD,4 OZ. DRIP BOTTLE $6.90
• TOTAL ORDER $37.60, PLUS APPLICABLE SALES TAX AND SHIPPING CHARGES

Cheers,
-jd.

[Tim A.]

Originally Posted by lewster

I guess I'll just take my bet and ball and go home!

If anyone else is interested in the results that I get on my CCD, you can PM me as I won't post to this thread again. Experimentation is great, but my results differ in the real world.......yours may also.

Thanks!

Lewster,

You can have your ball, but please do post the results. I think the difference is that you have applied Corrosion-X to the "upsteam" end of filiform corrosion and it appears to have penetrated along the corroded track which is underneath the clearcoat. In other words, the overlying clearcoat may well keep the Corrosion-X from being washed off so it can offer longterm protection quite different from 2air's tests.

Tim

[3DogNight]

Twink, I am so happy to have found this post, not sure how I missed it with all of the response. I thought I was all alone out here. Out 2007 20' Safari [9 months old] has corrosion at the belt line around rivets as well as on the skin edge,taillight bezels,door handles, wheel rims, bumper and areas of the rear aluminum skin I took it to the dealer in Utah I bought it from. They had not seen this previously. They photographed it, wrote a report, and emailed it back to AS for warranty work. AS replied that corrosion was not covered under warranty. Upon my return from vacation to San Diego I spoke to AS directly. At that phone call I was told it was a big misunderstanding and that they would add some belt trim to cover the problem after treating with ACF-50 and review the other problems mentioned. Work to be done at a shop near Los Angles. [Just up the street and around the corner from San Diego.]
Having owned a vintage Streamline trailer for 10 years previous to my new AS baby plus a number of boats used in salt water I have some experience with corrosion. This is not normal. My guess is an inferior alloy is now being used by AS at our expense. I am willing to let AS have the benefit of the doubt and see how well they handle it. I would hope we don't need to do a class action suit
But we gotta do what we gotta do. 3DogNight

[DreamStreamr]

When we inspected our 2005 before accepting delivery from dealer (Ewald in Milwaukee) we requested the two wheels with filliform be replaced. Dealer did so without argument.

When we were having warranty work done at JC two months ago we requested tail light bezels be replaced due to filliform. The factory service replaced the bezels without comment. We, unfortunately, are pretty confident it will return. The two other wheels (the ones not already replaced) are showing the corrosion. The grab handle by the door, like Lewsters, is showing it.

None evident inside -- is it because I don't wash and wax the interior, and the rain doesn't sit and seep on the inside surfaces? Doesn't really matter why, what matters, as the originator of this lengthy thread stated, is it shouldn't be occurring these several years later after A/S knew about it. They must be frantically working on our behalf to develop the solution, right?

I wish it were so. Reminds me of a company I worked for fifteen years ago -- sterling reputation, great financials, wonderful values, history of planning for succession. All the right stuff, it looked like from outside. But it was rotting on the inside and collapsed eight years ago. They just weren't taking care of what mattered, it seems. Who knows?

[SilverCabin]

Earlier in this thread I reported that I had corrosion on the rear endcaps at the beltline on my 2007 Safari SE. I discovered this in my first wash and Walbernizng in January, 2007. Below are two shots of those endcaps and four close ups of the worst areas.

I reported this to Airstream in the spring. They sent me a small bottle of ACF-50 to apply to these areas, and set-up an appointment (October 1, 2007 a date of my choosing) to have this corrected under warranty at the factory service center.

The ACF-50 was supposed to stop the corrosion from spreading, and it seemed to have done that as I didn't notice any of the spots changing over the summer. At the factory, they ground off the corrosion, sealed the area, and applied the Classic Beltline Trim (see last two photos).

I did get a look at the area after the corrosion was cleaned off. It was down to the shiny bare aluminum. The service technician said that someone from the factory comes over with the sealant, when he notifies them that he is ready for it. He didn't know what it was that was being used, and I missed that process both times it happened over the two days we were there. After the sealant is applied, the trim is added, and is caulked in place to prevent any moisture from getting underneath.

I am satisfied with the way it looks now, and with the warranty service provided to me by Airstream. Will something crawl out from under the trim? Let's hope not. I still have some of the ACF-50 left, and will use it on any spot that comes up. Daisy is kept in an inside storage facility, eight miles from the ocean here in Florida. And now that I know what to look for, I'll be giving Daisy a closer look each time I give her a bath.

I also haven't noticed any problems on my inside aluminum SE upgrade skin. I still occasionally find some plastic reminant under an inside rivet, so it seems they do remove the covering after it is riveted in-place on the inside.

And Lewster, stay with us. Your results may vary, but their your results and I appreciate your input on this and all things concerning maintenance and repairs of our Airstreams.

Randy

[SafariSS]

I noticed you got your unit from Bates in Tampa. I bought a new 05 Safari 30 from them as well and had extensive filiform corrosion. Here in Texas I had the same beltline trim installed, but I cannot help but wonder if the lot in Tampa contributed to the corrosion. Mine sat on the lot for almost a year before I found it.

[SilverCabin]

Yes we did buy from Bates. Ours was built in June, 2006. I don't know when it arrived at Bates, but it was on their storage lot near Venice, FL when we found it on the Internet. I don't know anything about their Venice location, as I have only been to their sales lot off I-4. We brought it home in December, 2006.

The corrosion was only on the two endcap panels. I would think it would be more extensive if it was an environmental problem at it's parking place. I'll keep my fingers crossed and watch it closely for any other problems.

Randy

[Frody]

Originally Posted by Silvertwinkie

Ok, so we have 4 possibly 5 so far. I know Dmac has the issue too, so we then have 5, possibly 6. Anyone else, please add your name to the list.

WE have a 05 Safari 25 ft. has corrossion on tail lights and door hinge. Count us in.

[Gene]

Tim A. took my thought that salt gets imbedded in the road surface and attacks all year a depressing step further—when we wash the Airstream the salt goes into solution and enters the spaces between panels and objects on the outer skin. Maybe it's better not to ever wash it?

I don't want to set the power washer at maximum, though I use it that way on our trucks without any damage, but a thorough flushing ought to wash out just about anything without having to use a special marine salt wash—there may be lots of salt on the roads, but it isn't the ocean, yet?

Gene

[BigAl]

Eric,
I suspect that the plain rivets don't show filiform corrosion because there is no plastic layer to trap moisture against the surface of the aluminum. Trapped moisture continues to corrode the aluminum and since the coating is clear you see it instantly.
Al

[wagnerda]

Hi all,

A while back somebody asked if anyone has a newer trailer without any problems. I guess I am one of the lucky ones because I have gone over my 19' Bambi SE, produced Feb 2006, and cannot find a single, solitary indication of any aluminum corrosion like others have shown in their pictures. Mine looks more or less exactly the same as when I got it. All the joints and seams along the sides, front, back, look just fine. Being an SE 75th ed model the inside is also aluminum sheets, and they are also shiny as new.

The only item that I have had any corrosion on was the shiny little cover over the rear license plate lite. There was about 1 inch x 1/4 inch of rust along the edge of it when I took the trailer into JC for service last month and they simply installed a new one (for free). I also had 2 rivets that had popped off inside which they also replaced and I cannot tell even which ones they were.

Whether or not I did anything to help keep the exterior from getting corrosion I don't know. I live in Maryland so the trailer gets all 4 seasons, it has always been 100% outside, it has about 15,000 road miles on it, and when not on the road it is parked under big trees. The only thing I have done to the exterior in nearly 2 years is I have washed it a grand total of exactly once.

Not that I am lazy or anything, but somewhere along the way somebody had once told me that "you don't do nothing to Airstreams, they are designed to be outside so leave them alone"... But this spring there was so much pollen out here under the trees that the Airstream was almost "furry" so I sprayed it off with a hose and a little dish soap/water.

I will undoubtedly do that (wash) again this coming spring, but after reading this whole thread I am hesitant to do much else. I will probably put on a coat of regular car wax, but that would be it.

At any rate, I really feel for those of you who have the corrosion problems as that would just make me sick, so I will be on the lookout for it. But at least for now the Aluminum gods are still shining on me... Also, I got my AS from a large volume dealer in New Jersey...

The attached shows my normal parking spot under the trees. This area averages around 32 inches rain per year with maybe a foot or 2 of snow during the winter.

best regards, Dave

[TBRich]

Dave...as you know, our 2006 19' Bambi Safari SE is exactly like yours, and we, too, have been blessed with no sign of corrosion that I can find... I am keeping a close eye on it, however. Our climate is to our advantage, I am sure...we do wash it before we go out almost every time, as it gets dusty as heck here. We plan to Walberize it a couple of times a year once the weather cools, just to keep is "treated" and sealed as best we can...

Let's keep all our fingers and toes crossed that they both remain corrosion free!

TB

[SmokelessJoe]

Two thoughts to contribute:

1. Pretty well every NEW Airstream I’ve seen on a DEALER’S LOT already has a rusting licence plate holder.



Lack of attention to small details like this may be a harbinger for less obvious problems.

2. After 75 years it may be time for management to climb out of the box and ADD a line of PAINTED Airstreams to the stable.

I mean trailers not just in Silver but Butter Cup Yellow, Green, Blue, Cloud White, whatever.

Painted Trailers are far less likely to corrode.

I can’t understand why this hasn’t been done and I’ve said so from my first post to the Forum.

For traditionalist Airstream makers and owners: airplanes were bare aluminum 75 years ago too. Now, they are mostly painted.

And big, excellence driven outfits like UPS and FedEx also PAINT all their ALUMINUM route vans, not just their planes.

The guy that pulls this off at Airstream will eventually be perceived as a marketing genius.

To paraphrase Bill Clinton, “It’s the SHAPE, not the colour, dummy".



Sergei