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-   -   Fake numbers and rondel, opinion? (http://www.airforums.com/forums/f286/fake-numbers-and-rondel-opinion-141679.html)

AWCHIEF 09-26-2015 03:43 PM

Fake numbers and rondel, opinion?
 
On Facebook there is a poser that is very proud of his poorly painted on fake numbers and copied club rondel. No such number exist and he is claiming because he made the rondel 1/2 inch smaller that there is no copy right violation. He mentioned that the club dues are set too high and he is not paying them. I think this if nothing else is an ethical issue and possibly even does violate copy rights. Opinions from ACTUAL club members are welcome.

markdoane 09-26-2015 04:49 PM

I don't think you have any grounds for a lawsuit. He could claim it is a parody. And it probably is.

Protagonist 09-26-2015 06:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AWCHIEF (Post 1689293)
On Facebook there is a poser that is very proud of his poorly painted on fake numbers and copied club rondel. No such number exist and he is claiming because he made the rondel 1/2 inch smaller that there is no copy right violation. He mentioned that the club dues are set too high and he is not paying them. I think this if nothing else is an ethical issue and possibly even does violate copy rights. Opinions from ACTUAL club members are welcome.

It might be copyright infringement. It might be trademark infringement. The distinction between the two is difficult for a layman like me to make.

But in my layman's opinion… if the roundel he's using is a recognizable copy, regardless of the diameter, it's still the club's official symbol, just like the 1˝" diameter roundels on our ID badges are still the official symbol of the club. Maybe if he put Alfred E. Neuman's face on the roundel instead of Wally Byam's, and/or he used Roman numerals or put the numbers on upside down, he might make a legitimate claim to parody, but a smaller version of the real symbol is not a parody, and just because he's using a number that's never been issued (if the number he's using hasn't ever been issued), he's still pretending to belong to the club whenever anybody sees his trailer, and only someone who's actually in the club would know the difference.

WBCCI has an attorney who is more knowledgeable about trademark and copyright law, so the Facebook page should be referred to the WBCCI management to see if they wish to pursue the matter and get a cease-and-desist order issued. I'd recommend forwarding a link to the Facebook page, along with an explanation of the problem, to Lori Plummer so she can get it to the right people.

Aviator 09-26-2015 06:12 PM

I think it is wrong.

AWCHIEF 09-26-2015 06:39 PM

1 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by markdoane (Post 1689318)
I don't think you have any grounds for a lawsuit. He could claim it is a parody. And it probably is.

I am not planning on suing anyone. He is getting pretty nasty about it. A number of club members are spooling him on into to making a bigger jackass of himself. He is now claiming it is a restoration. He is also resorting to insulting Canadians to boot.

This is his idea of an authentic restoration,

markdoane 09-26-2015 06:47 PM

Yep, that's a parody. (Ignoring the fact that you can't copyright a number or the color red)
.

AWCHIEF 09-26-2015 06:54 PM

Funny guy, now he has started a new tread. Called "Troll List". Listing the names anyone that has critized his, in my opinion, unethical behavior. This is on the "Airstream Crazies" page if anyone in interested in following this "parody".

Protagonist 09-26-2015 07:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by markdoane (Post 1689356)
Yep, that's a parody. (Ignoring the fact that you can't copyright a number or the color red).

You can copyright or trademark a logo, though, and he is using a copy of the real WBCCI logo, which seems to take it out of the parody arena and puts it into the infringement arena.

And you can trademark colors. Just ask UPS, who trademarked their distinctive UPS Brown. But in this case there is no such distinctive color as WBCCI Red, so the mere fact that the numbers are red and hand-painted isn't an infringement. In my opinion it's the arrangement of the real logo centered above the numbers— so that to the "average" person it looks like a real WBCCI number— that makes it an infringement.

However, none of us has a legal right to do anything about it, except to complain to someone who does have the right. Namely WBCCI's retained attorney, as noted in my previous post.

AWCHIEF 09-26-2015 07:35 PM

My only issue is his complete lack of ethics. He is supposed to be a business man. I can only speculate how he runs his business if this is any indication.

Punch 09-26-2015 07:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AWCHIEF (Post 1689351)

.... He is also resorting to insulting Canadians to boot.

Well, I don't see how you can get any lower than that! :angry::angry::angry:
He'd better not come anywhere near my igloo, or I'll make him eat poutine and listen to Celine!

AWCHIEF 09-26-2015 07:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Punch (Post 1689375)
Well, I don't see how you can get any lower than that! :angry::angry::angry:
He'd better not come anywhere near my igloo, or I'll make him eat poutine and listen to Celine!

Brilliant, We need a link button. By the way I like Celine.

markdoane 09-26-2015 08:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AWCHIEF (Post 1689359)
Funny guy, now he has started a new tread. Called "Troll List". .

I can't find this thread. Shouldn't you be discussing this over on the WBCCI forum and not on the Airforums?

Jaxon 09-26-2015 08:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by markdoane (Post 1689381)
I can't find this thread. Shouldn't you be discussing this over on the WBCCI forum and not on the Airforums?

.
I think both forums are appropriate for the heads up discussion. Useful for folks who are not familiar with WBCCI and folks who are checking into Airstreams - good info to know about the many scams out there trading off the Airstream brand/name.
.

Tumbleweed61 09-26-2015 08:31 PM

I guess my take on it would be whether or not he's trying to derive some sort of benefit from doing this.
After all, we can decorate our vehicles with pretty much whatever we please (short of the dangerous or obscene).
So until he shows up at a rally expecting some kind of "perks", or tells someone he's a member expecting some kind of discount(s) (or something of that nature), he's just seeking some kind of attention.

Of course, another response could be, "It's really worth faking??"










.

Gearheart 09-27-2015 03:46 AM

The "gentleman" created enough of a stink that he got booted off that facebook group.

AWCHIEF 09-27-2015 05:23 AM

Yep, fun is over. Poser kicked out and thread deleted.

HowieE 09-27-2015 08:07 AM

Any idea what the number may represent? Does not look like a birth date and clearly is not his IQ.

He went to great detail to produce the Club decal but went amateurish is the execution of the numbers.

I may have to join Facebook just to follow this saga.

AWCHIEF 09-27-2015 08:39 AM

It is all over, he was banned from Airstream Crazies and his Facebook page is also gone. He was just a nut trolling for attention.

Protagonist 09-27-2015 08:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AWCHIEF (Post 1689517)
It is all over, he was banned from Airstream Crazies and his Facebook page is also gone. He was just a nut trolling for attention.

But his trailer is still out there, and will NOT make him very many friends anywhere that he takes it camping— at least not among WBCCI members.

xrvr 09-27-2015 09:07 AM

Anyone who has bought a used AS with the numbers on it is doing the same thing, no? It's all intent, I guess. Jim, towing a fake AS.


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