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Old 08-31-2011, 07:26 PM   #361
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Hey Top,

Thanks for letting me know you heard from him. When was this email? We find it odd indeed that he won't respond to us, but returned the email. Amy is talking about possibly heading to Round Rock this weekend if we don't hear from him.

Steve
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Old 08-31-2011, 08:00 PM   #362
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Steve, I take this to mean you don't know where things stand right now with the trailer. You must be terribly frustrated as I know you and Amy both are so looking forward to traveling in this SOTR during the precious time you get to spend together. Me too, I want to camp with my SOTR brother!

Never had the problem, but if my restoration folks didn't answer my calls I know I'd be pretty irate. Hopefully everything with Dave is OK. I hope you hear something soon.
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Old 08-31-2011, 08:12 PM   #363
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Steve, I take this to mean you don't know where things stand right now with the trailer. You must be terribly frustrated as I know you and Amy both are so looking forward to traveling in this SOTR during the precious time you get to spend together. Me too, I want to camp with my SOTR brother!

Never had the problem, but if my restoration folks didn't answer my calls I know I'd be pretty irate. Hopefully everything with Dave is OK. I hope you hear something soon.
Not quite D,

I received a status update from Bruce about the welding, but nothing from Dave. I agree it is frustrating to hear that he is replying to emails from Top about my holding tanks, but cannot return a text, email, or call....especially when he sent an email and text saying he would be in touch last Saturday. Considering the amount of our life savings we have in this project, it is not acceptable.

I am sure that other vintage restoration shops have clients that call, and their calls are returned in a timely manner. This should be no different.

Hopefully you are right D.
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Old 08-31-2011, 08:22 PM   #364
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Hello all,

I wish I had more to tell you. BWoodTX is going to hopefully be finishing up the welding this weekend as it was far too hot to weld last weekend. Some people he works with are supposed to be welding up part of the A frame to help him out with it. Other than this, I have nothing else.

By the way, has anyone been in contact or heard from Dave Park? He has not returned any of my calls, texts, or emails in a week other than the text from him saying he would call me last Saturday, but he never did.

Steve
strangely he was online here this afternoon about 30 minutes after you made this post. Very odd behaviour indeed. You think your post would have elicited a response. I would definitely be concerned about your property at this point.
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Old 08-31-2011, 11:56 PM   #365
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He did mention one of his friends passed away, and he had to take care of arrangements. I'm sure he'll pop back up.
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Old 09-01-2011, 06:57 AM   #366
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He did mention one of his friends passed away, and he had to take care of arrangements. I'm sure he'll pop back up.
This is true, but he did contact me after this to say he would be in touch, and he has been in contact with Top as well.

Until we hear something, we have left a message stating to stop any work on the trailer that we have not discussed or approved to be done other than the welding that Bruce will do. Dave's last email also stated that he won't do unsafe work, and he believes I am asking that of him. I have asked him to clarify the unsafe work (no response), but the only thing we disagreed on was that he was adamant about placing insulation between the floor and frame. He said the floor wouldn't be level without this, and it was unsafe. Grinding down the welds that were raised is not something he wants to do.

Steve
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Old 09-01-2011, 07:08 AM   #367
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Wow

Haven't read this in a while.... wow... hope that this all works out for all parties.....
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Old 09-01-2011, 10:23 AM   #368
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As this gets us all into matters of reputation, maybe a short time will produce a conclusion to this first 60+ days of a difficult, expensive and lengthy piece of work. I nominate the (literally) killer heat & drought take underlying blame for the interim as clarifications take place.
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Old 09-01-2011, 11:09 AM   #369
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I understand that it has been hot in Texas. I was there until the 16th of August. However, there are other times of day mainly early morning that could be used for work on the trailer, and during the hot hours, windows could be rebuilt inside the home where it is cool. We have had it posted many times from him how hot it has been, and it has slowed the work, but should not be a reason not to return any correspondence.
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Old 09-01-2011, 11:21 AM   #370
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Sorry folks, been distracted by events... One of my friends passed away over the weekend and I had to make some arrangements, etc. I have had very little free time, and will be away tomorrow also.

I will post some pics this evening when I get home - as bwoodtx said, the a-frame is off, and the new parts to replace it are well on their way to completion.

The weather just keeps getting hotter and hotter, so while I wait for clecos to arrive I think I will be catching up on the paperwork - totaling up receipts and so forth. I'm also preparing an area to rebuild the windows.

My feet should touch the ground again on Friday, but I'm told it'll be a 108F weekend - in the shade. LOVELY.

Very tired and very drained.
Hello Dave. I'm sorry for your loss of your friend. That's very good of you to help with arrangements during this difficult time for the family, friends etc.

We've been in SA for a little over two weeks and I can't remember when I've experienced heat like this.

Take care,
Sandra.
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Old 09-01-2011, 01:24 PM   #371
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Maybe he has his head down and is working. Being bombarded by emails often makes me not want to respond at all. Sometimes a guy needs to just get things done and stop talking about it. Relax...
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Old 09-01-2011, 02:13 PM   #372
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Maybe he has his head down and is working. Being bombarded by emails often makes me not want to respond at all. Sometimes a guy needs to just get things done and stop talking about it. Relax...
Maybe this is the case, but he isn't being bombarded by emails or calls.

We last spoke on August 15th before I left Texas, and he has had 4 calls placed to him since then. Considering my latest messages to him stated to stop working until we spoke, he shouldn't be doing any work on my trailer.

We have several texts from the inception of this project. After the texts about the floor levelness without adding insulation between the floor and frame on August 19th, I texted him on the 24th requesting him to call me about the project Friday. He didn't call, but texted me at 9:06 PM stating he wouldn't make it home till late, and tomorrow would be better for him to call. He received a text Sunday the 28th, and Monday the 29th. I hardly believe that this is bombardment. If he has time to answer an email from Top about my tanks, he can answer the person paying him.
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Old 09-01-2011, 11:17 PM   #373
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Hi all,

Wow, disappear for a few days and all hell breaks loose

I was named as executor so I had some rather time-consuming duties to attend to. Some of this involved travel out of town, work with a probate court, and unfortunately, damaging my phone, which I have just had replaced.

There are a couple of areas where I can't proceed at the moment, because I have specific instructions from Steve that I cannot follow. I would like to work through these with him, and will be contacting him tomorrow to see if we can reach an understanding.

If we fail to reach an understanding, I will work with him in any way necessary to get the trailer ready to transport to another location for work to continue. I'm willing to continue, but after my unexpectedly long absence, I fully understand if Steve wants to place the work elsewhere.

Dave
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Old 09-01-2011, 11:40 PM   #374
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Insulation

You DO NOT want to put the insulation on top of the frame for leveling... just asking for problems...and the old pink stuff did absolutely NO leveling out for the framing... just lay the ply down and get it bolted in!! I agree with Steve on this one.. the only thing insulation between the frame and floor will do is act as a wick!

Glad to see you back, alive and well Dave....hope you two can work it out!
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Old 09-02-2011, 01:58 AM   #375
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That's not at all the issue.

The frame was originally attached to the floor and shell by seven elevator bolts and two regular bolts in each row. Steve has clearly instructed that I use just five elevator bolts in each row, two of which are in the c-channel.

I feel it creates a liability to replace nine points of contact with just five and to use elevator bolts in a way they were not designed to be used, to carry loads they were not designed to carry.

Normally I would continue, and do it with the nine. However, Steve firmly told me to not proceed with my plan and to follow his.

Steve did send a message suggesting I stop work until the heatwave broke, and with the other conflicting responsibilities that came up, I jumped at the chance.
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Old 09-02-2011, 05:15 AM   #376
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That's not at all the issue.

The frame was originally attached to the floor and shell by seven elevator bolts and two regular bolts in each row. Steve has clearly instructed that I use just five elevator bolts in each row, two of which are in the c-channel.

I feel it creates a liability to replace nine points of contact with just five and to use elevator bolts in a way they were not designed to be used, to carry loads they were not designed to carry.

Normally I would continue, and do it with the nine. However, Steve firmly told me to not proceed with my plan and to follow his.

Steve did send a message suggesting I stop work until the heatwave broke, and with the other conflicting responsibilities that came up, I jumped at the chance.
Dave,

This is not completely accurate. I reviewed our skype conversation this morning. You stated that each rail had seven bolts originally...not nine. The outriggers not being part of the rail, still get their two. I was okay with using 5 E bolts to secure the each plywood sheet over the central cross member area, and then the two outriggers with the bolts you made the command decision on to purchase.

I will be in class until 1500. Looking forward to hearing from you.

Steve
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Old 09-02-2011, 06:01 AM   #377
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I hope those concerned will read this constructively and critically. Try, I know it is hard for you to do that....

There is a place and time for everything...

Disagreements between you two, not good forum fader. All of us reading want to see this project a success for all involved.

Micro managing sucks and is something my shop will not allow. Everyone has a roll to play and they need to stay within their rolls. If Dave is paid to do the work, he needs to do the work and doing the work involves executive decisions like how many bolts to use. How much savings is involved in loosing two bolts per row? I will gladly send you the dozen bolts needed as my donation to your project. I have a 50 pound box of them on the shelf.

The attitude "I am paying the bill and it is my choice how it is done" just is not fitting here. When you hire someone to do a job, they do the job. Sometimes it is hard to let go and trust that your desires will be met. You are paying Dave to be in charge, not paying to be in charge of Dave.

Communication is key. Even if a death occurs, a client that needs constant contact, still needs to know what is going on. Sometimes this need is hard to recognize. Hopefully you will now realize to not drop out for a few days(or a week) without making it clearly known that you are going to do that.

Now stop this back and forth(keep it out of our vision) and move this project forward!!!


One parting note; grind down the weld, notch the plywood and move on. This is not rocket science and the last thing you need is to try and reinvent the Airstream. To quote the guy most look at as an Airstream Superstar; "t's just a flocking trailer!"
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Old 09-02-2011, 10:00 AM   #378
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When you hire someone to do a job, they do the job... communication is key - a client needs to know what is going on...
Great observations from an experienced restorer. I know I'll keep that in mind when examining my expectations as we farm out some of the work on our '54 Safari this fall.

There's no reason these little hiccups should derail a successful working relationship - we're all rooting for you two, and hoping it results in another beautiful trailer.
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Old 09-02-2011, 10:22 AM   #379
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You DO NOT want to put the insulation on top of the frame for leveling... just asking for problems...and the old pink stuff did absolutely NO leveling out for the framing... just lay the ply down and get it bolted in!! I agree with Steve on this one.. the only thing insulation between the frame and floor will do is act as a wick!

Glad to see you back, alive and well Dave....hope you two can work it out!
I'm looking at this from two positions: I have access to modern non-wicking non-water-retaining materials with good R value that are not compressible and do not degrade over time. Also, the sides of the sandwich, the frame and wood floor have treatments which are far superior to those available in 1956. The frame is uneven due to reinforcing brackets and fish plates which can not be ground down. Insulation allows me to create a flat floor to base everything else on, without any of the problems you describe.

How can I be so sure? I took a 2"x24" strip of prodex, weighed it then submerged it in water for 24 hours, then removed it and re-weighed it. It weighed the same and had absorbed no water. I then parked the truck on it for 24 hours, then checked it if had deformed. There was a slight compressed area which puffed back out in around three minutes.

I also note that the frame will get condensation on it (like a car in the morning) and be in contact with the wood, which I consider a design issue, and prodex prevents the water contact.

The other aspect is that Steve has put a lot of thought into how to keep the trailer cool. 3/4" of fir has an R value of 2.8-3.0 - just adding a strip of 1/8" prodex insulation raises that to 6 or 6.5...

This is one of those cases where there are advantages to either option. I can improve insulation, make the floor more level (which matters to me as a cabinet-maker) and save a lot of the client's money. I'm not talking about using a whole roll of prodex under the floor, just of using 2" strips of offcut waste prodex to buffer between the frame and floor in particular areas - where the frame can get very hot or hold, and near the PITA reinforcing brackets.

The alternatives are to use a router to thin the underside of the floor to accommodate the brackets, or to just lay flooring over them and have nothing in the trailer be straight.
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Old 09-02-2011, 10:26 AM   #380
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I hope those concerned will read this constructively and critically. Try, I know it is hard for you to do that...
Good thoughts for both of us there... Thank you, Frank.
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