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Old 01-30-2014, 11:38 PM   #29
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1955 22' Flying Cloud
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More Cabinet Pics

The first couple pics show the removal of the corrosion and then how they turned out after the first real cutting polish with the black compound bar and F7.

On the second photo, one can see how the black compound bar cut the first lateral strip removing the corrosion pitting as I went across. I was, and continue to do a lot of experimenting with removing corrosion, pitting, and rough areas.
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Old 01-30-2014, 11:44 PM   #30
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Yow! Lookin' good!
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Old 02-01-2014, 12:28 AM   #31
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1955 22' Flying Cloud
Lansing , Kansas
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Questions

OK,

Weather permiting in real time, as opposed to where I am at catching up on the documented work on the trailer, I will be taking the shell off of the frame tomorrow. As I look forward to taking this to the welder for some modifications on the frame, I have a few questions.

As soon as I get the floor off, I will be measuring for tanks, spare tire holder, and the axle.

Some preface, a short list of items that I plan on doing to the frame:

- Repair any rusted areas.

- Add steel plate to the side of the frame where the new axle will attach

- Add L channel steel on the cross members to hold up the tanks.

- Add some L or C Channel to the bottom of the frame to extend the depth 3-4 inches to allow the enclosure of the tanks.

- Add an additional cross member under the front step area.

- Extend the bumper 6" in order to allow the addition of a bumper trunk.

- Add new chains.

- Enclose the C-Channel of the main longitudinal frame rails at the front and rear to help close the belly pan.

I am sure that I am forgetting something, but I have some questions related to the frame work"

- How to determine if there are problems/wear issues with the hitch on the trailer? I am planning a visual inspection, but looking into it, it seems to be in pretty good shape, though it looks like it needs some stripping, repainting and lubrication.

- What are the merits of adding front (and possibly back) frame to shell plate? There is not a front plate on the front of the frame. I would like to add an aluminum sheet up front, possibly at .060" piece and then strips on either side of the storage compartment door on the rear in order to reinforce the connection between chassis and shell at the front and rear.

- Ability to place fresh water tanks into the frame? I have seen a few examples on the forums of folks adding fresh water tanks to the frame. I would like to do this, but I am curious about related issues. For example, do I need to put the pump in the frame as well in order for it to prime. I plan on insulating and heating all of the tanks in the frame.

- What specific actions and areas need to be strengthened on the frame for tanks? Is there anything else that I am forgetting to strengthen. I realize that I am adding weight to the trailer with the tanks, but I am hoping that with some modern, lightweight appliances and cabinetry that I can keep the trailer in the neighborhood of the original weight (no more than +500 pounds).

I would be dearly interested in any input or ideas. More pics to come soon. Thanks.
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Old 02-01-2014, 08:52 AM   #32
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I popped some pictures of my Overlander set up on your '55 FC frame and belly pan thread if that helps and the pump is good above the frame. All of my tanks are plumbed from above, even the outflow fittings so that's a bit unusual but the pump will prime itself. I would maybe add some reinforcement in locations where you might install BAL jacks or as in one thread I saw the owner welded little pockets for another style of stabilizing jack which was quite slick/ concealed. We added welded in strips above the tanks to add a tiny bit more support too.
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Old 02-01-2014, 08:59 AM   #33
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Two things...
one is to run some type angle , probably 1" length wise between each cross member, in the center of the frame. That ties the frame together and will really strengthen the floor.
two if you are going to add a torsion (best axle) axle be aware that the axle shaft sits back from the actual axle tube. Mark on your frame where the center of that axle shaft will be, remembering that it will be under some pressure once the frame/body/etc are in place.
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Old 02-01-2014, 11:38 AM   #34
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Matt you have two threads going about basically the same thing. I suspect for a lot of people some of your responses don't make sense as it appears you are posting relies of one thread on another thread . It would be nice and for sure more efficient if you kept every thing together.
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Old 02-05-2014, 11:37 PM   #35
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1955 22' Flying Cloud
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Taking apart and polish experimentation

I started out inspecting the condition of the windows, so that I could start ordering the parts to repair the windows, and put them back to top condition. Sadly, only one was complete and working. The rest were either missing, broken, or missing pieces.

The one missing the handle there is the window in by far the worst condition. That window crack extends all the way into the frame, and I am in the process of trying to refabricate the inner glass retaining brackets, that are cracked through.

Removed a couple of vintage electrical pieces. The switch is a piece of art deco coolness that he picture does not do justice to. But I think I will have it re-chromed and use it again, only with indicator lights both top and bottom.

The second piece is the complete fuse box distribution panel for the trailer. This I will not be keeping. If you are desirous of the original, I can send it to you for the cost of shipping. The pictures are provided by my 10 year old son, who is learning to point the camera. That’s how he ”helps” dad.
On the textured wall, I experimented with straight polishing with black compound and a spiral sown wheel, and then eventually a sisal wheel. I dried sanding with 400 and 600 grit sand paper with a wet method. This initially appeared smother than any other method. Then I dried the 3Msanding pads, which seemed to allow the sisal and spiral sown cotton wheels to shine faster. Although, not sanding at all provided ultimately the shiniest result. Is started on areas where I was sure would be covered up or changes later on. Eventually though I realized that there were too many nicks, and holes in the panels for later use, and rationalized my unwillingness not to polish the entire trailer interior. I eventually decided that I would just do the endcaps and the midline 16” strips in the middle of the ceiling and the wall sides. I do not recommend soda blasting. From my perspective, the sisal wheel with black compound works the best so far for the initial cutting, followed by the spiral sown wheel. I plan on following it all the F9, F7, C and S in the Nuvite method. More to come.
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Old 02-08-2014, 09:07 PM   #36
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Lansing , Kansas
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Interior skin removal 1

I hope that I am not driving anyone off with any of my posts, but still hoping to get answers to my questions. If you’ve got ideas, I would love to hear them.

Barry, thanks for the tip on the frame extension, I think that that technique is going to work best for me. I just ordered axles, and will be ordering the tanks and fittings very soon based on the depth of my frame. 4” + 2” extension should allow me to get 5” deep tanks, insulation and tank heaters into the belly pan.

Taking the first few skins off started to reveal a few things that I did not know or expect. No nests or mouse remnants so far, thankfully. Just thin fiberglass insulation and dingy wiring. Some of the wiring had grommets through the frame ribs, and some did not. Lots of old and very stubborn black sealant on the rivets and seams. Looks like old and somewhat dried out 3M style auto rubberized undercoating.

The C Channel in each end is in three pieces. The two corner pieces on each end are formed channel actually in very good shape showing no corrosion, despite the corrosion to the adjacent skin. And since the factory apparently hit the very top edge in many cases, there aren’t as many holes in the rail as there might be. The front lower piece and curb side lower piece either have too many holes or too much corrosion in the corners to be used again in full. They will need to be replaced.

There is also no hold down plate in front. No signs of any issues caused by that lack, but I am tempted to put one in when I put the trailer back together. I would like to put in hold down “straps” on either side of the baggage door in the rear as well to help anchor that.

The PO screwed a small aluminum sheet of some kind down in the rear, but the last 3” of the floor is completely rotted and whatever was left was easily sucked up as mush by the shop vac as I cleaned. I would like to figure out some kind of flashing that would shed the water out of the trailer away from the wood under the C Channel in the rear.

The last learning point for me was the alloy. All of the lower panels were 7075 T6, manufactured by both Reynolds Aluminum and Alcoa, all of it is alclad. The outer skins and ceiling panels appear to be 2024T3. Not sure if this was deliberate to mix up the alloys. I did some checking online. Based on the scholarly articles I found on the alloys, 2024T3 is said to be less corrosion resistant, slightly softer, but 5-10x more resistant to fatigue cracking than the 7075T6. I didn’t observe any fatigue cracking in the skins, and from my observation, the corrosion difference between alloys is negligible in a 59 year old trailer.

However, the C Channel made from alclad sheeting (as opposed to the formed channel) of some identifiable type is fatigued and corroded almost completely away in some places, especially the rear. I love the British slang term “knackered”. This stuff fits the description well, the non-formed channel is definitely knackered. I will probably look for the most corrosion resistant alloy for channel replacement.
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Old 02-09-2014, 04:36 AM   #37
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Although ours is a caravel and not quite as aged as yours I used a 5 inch piece of flashing between the floor and frame in the rear and added a non corrosive undercoating on top of the por's to insulate the 2 dissimilar metals if you have the space for a hold down plate I would certainly use one because sometimes more is better and you seem to be right up front with that. As for the aluminum I would use the 2024 t3 for the belly pan I have found that most of the insulation you use can degrade over time and I am using foam board and have coated the entire floor with thompsons water seal and in areas where water will penetrate the belly pan (extream road and hazard areas) I am coating the underside of the floor with undercoat. All wiring replaced and I used the plastic casing and grommets (hate shorts that I could have prevented). Are you replacing the entire subfloor or just patching? I asked because they used 5/8 plywood or (floor wood as they called it back in the day) I replaced mine with 3/4 inch. Thanks for listening.
Cliff
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Old 02-09-2014, 11:17 PM   #38
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1955 22' Flying Cloud
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Cliff, thanks for getting back to me. I was thinking of a piece of Z style flashing between the subfloor and rear c-channel, not sure if that's what you mean or below the subfloor. The rear cargo door area seems to be a likely leak area. I like your idea of the undercoating the subfloor and frame. I was planning on POR-15 for the frame as well. I am doing a full shell off restoration so the entire floor will be replaced. The one it came with had had it.

Loads of fun so far. Working on the windows while I wait for the axle. Slow going so far, but I should be done and in good shape in a few weeks. Lots of learning about polishing, sanding, and shaping. More pictures to follow.
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Old 02-11-2014, 08:27 PM   #39
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More interior removal

Just some thoughts as I continued to take pieces out of the interior to whittle away at getting the windows out while the weather was good. A lot of the process was figuring out how it all went together. Learning point was the order of march to take elements out:
- Remove interior window frame
- Remove external raincap over the window
- Drill out external window rivets under backframe gasket
- Remove window
This then should allow the removal of the interior panels, and allow one to get to the preponderance of the hidden rivets under the window sill, except where there are other hidden rivets, or the PO puts in about a pound of sealant between the window and sill. The rear window, as an escape hatch also has an extra row of rivets on the piano hinge at the top, which allows the whole window frame to swing out, and thus escape.

The large front window sill on the street side was starting to crack where there was -already a relief seam. I had to be extremely careful removing it. You can also see the difference under the curtain mount between the soda blasted and un-soda blasted area under the mount.

Finally, one of the curbside interior window brackets is cracked through, and I will try my hand at making a new one. Without professional tools, it is tough to get the really sharp brake seam.

One question I am still trying to get an answer for:

- How to determine if there are problems/wear issues with the hitch on the trailer? I am planning a visual inspection, but looking into it, it seems to be in pretty good shape, though it looks like it needs some stripping, repainting and lubrication.
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Old 02-11-2014, 08:50 PM   #40
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One question I am still trying to get an answer for:

- How to determine if there are problems/wear issues with the hitch on the trailer? I am planning a visual inspection, but looking into it, it seems to be in pretty good shape, though it looks like it needs some stripping, repainting and lubrication.[/QUOTE]



The old couplers typically wear quite a bit on the interior leading edge. We usually add a bead of weld in that area, then die grind it into shape to suit the ball. This is done when the frame is either upside down or the coupler is off the "A" frame. You will get a pretty good feel whether the ball feels tight or loose when it's locked in place. We've seen a bunch of these old couplers fall off the ball, even when locked down, so take a lot of care when you're rebuilding it. I believe Vintage Trailer Supply has the spring for the lock.
Good luck,
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Old 02-11-2014, 09:16 PM   #41
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Matt,
I might be missing something in your post but you can completely remove the interior before pulling the windows. Yes, the windows need to be pulled to rebuild them but they can be done after the insides are removed or even after the shell is lifted if you are doing the full Monty.

Broken window stuff? It's all made from folded aluminum sheet, I've recreated almost every part of the '55 windows from scratch....the rest is available from VTS....
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Old 02-11-2014, 10:10 PM   #42
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Colin, thanks for the information. I will definitely have my welder address that. The latching mechanism seems to be in good shape, but the shallow size of the hitch receptacle makes me nervous about wear. If all else fails, I could take Tim Shephard's example and put on a 2 5/16" hitch...but they just don't look as legitimate.

Vernon, I haven't posted it yet, because I am still catching up, but I have fabricated two new brackets for the window that I will capture in pictures later on. I just haven't been able to get seam as sharp as the factory. On the windows, all of the windows on the sides came out without a problem. There was one hidden rivet on the side wall panels, but the front and rear were a different story. There were about three hidden rivets each on the front and rear windows and the rear cargo door that required the windows and cargo to come out in order to get the interior panels out. I really don't know how some of them got in there. The fact that the PO essentially glued the the window sills, frames and shell together made it that much harder.

I have been trying to take a positive aspect to the issue and just take my time and work it as a puzzle. I've got to just enjoy it rather than get frustrated. I love VTS as well, I think I may need to start an allotment from my paycheck. Can't say enough good things about them.

BTW, I love the name of your 34'er, that's what I call my time working on the trailer!
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1955, air conditioning, axle, door, flying cloud, frame, holding tanks, polish, restoration, shell off, tank heater, window


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