Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 06-20-2019, 12:53 PM   #1
3 Rivet Member
 
Life is a Highway's Avatar

 
2019 25' Flying Cloud
Lady Lake , Florida
Join Date: Mar 2018
Posts: 195
Victron upgrade Help please

25 ft Flying Cloud twin ft bedroom

I wanted better performance than the stock interstates and 1000 watt converter

I am somewhat confused I see many installs but not may Step one Step two reviews or instructions. Does the existing fuse and breaker panel remain?

Do you unhook the existing 3 stage charger as its not applicable for Lithium batteries. Or has some left it in and it works?

We are not installing Roof Solar maybe using a 200 Watt Portable

I am researching to install a Sterling 12 volt battery to battery charger so the Tow Vehicle charges the batteries under way, or can be started to supplement.

I have two Honda 2000 as backups for AC and a Micro Start installed on the 15 K roof air. 30 amp system

2-3 100 amp Battle Born Lithium batteries would be nice. A Victron 2000 or 3000 watt inverter charger makes sense.

A Victron 712 blue tooth monitor seems a practical option.

In our Airstream Kitchen is 1000 watt Airstream standard on/off button. Does this stay and control the Victron or is that automatic? Does this panel/button stay or is removed? Maybe is a Victron control panel installed in its place?

AM Solar has packages but I do not need the Solar options. They are Wayyyyy out there in Oregon I'm in Florida. Lew is out of the State till winter.

It seems installers want you to know everything then sell and install. Some of us end users need to have a rep look over the trailer and spec out equipment needs.

Two many late nights up watching YouTube and searching the net. Yes Frustrated- So probably may just stay with the stock system. Or just install two Battle Born 100 AMP’s in the existing battery box and inside the trailer, install a better progressive dynamics Lithium shore power charger.

Would like to hear from those who have upgraded a 25 ft twin, added Lithium and or a charger inverter. Thank's for any suggestion or better yet pictures and a parts list for our trailer. The twin beds are a pain for install-
__________________

Life is a Highway is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-20-2019, 01:05 PM   #2
Rivet Master
 
lsbrodsky's Avatar
 
2012 25' FB International
Trent Woods , North Carolina
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 2,119
2 years ago i did an install in my 25FB, you can find the thread by searching on my name. However, it is not for the novice or faint at heart. Your best bet is just wait for Lew to be back in Florida and get on his list.

Larry
__________________

lsbrodsky is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-20-2019, 03:36 PM   #3
Rivet Master
 
waninae39's Avatar

 
2017 22' Sport
NCR , Ontario
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 1,581
we replaced the battery with Lion Battle born 100AH model

we also replaced the converter with a Victron multiplus 3000VA

https://www.victronenergy.com/invert...48v-800va-3kva

here is our schematic

we are very happy with the victron products

it allows us to monitor it online from web or phone
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	AS22FB- schematic power DC-V7.jpg
Views:	30
Size:	247.9 KB
ID:	343930   Click image for larger version

Name:	AS22FB- schematic power AC-V7.jpg
Views:	25
Size:	159.1 KB
ID:	343931  

waninae39 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-20-2019, 04:44 PM   #4
Rivet Master
 
wulfraat's Avatar
 
2017 30' International
Broomfield , Colorado
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 1,980
Images: 1
If you are not extremely comfortable with 12 and 120 volt systems / design / components / wiring leave it to the pro - Lew. Worth waiting for him to return to Florida.

I could have done the install myself but chose not to, as it would have taken me about 100 man hours end to end. I had Lew do my install and it took him 70-80 hours with help (now this includes solar which was likely 1/3 of the hours)

Also - note that you can file for the renewable energy tax credit on your 2019 federal taxes. For the 2018 tax year this was a 30% credit - which paid for Lewís labor in my case...

Here is my install. Very happy with performance. I was in Yellowstone this past week and we were running through 250-350 amp hours per day (we have 600ah total). We are heavy energy users and enjoy always on residential power....

http://www.airforums.com/forums/f539...um-182406.html
wulfraat is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-20-2019, 07:48 PM   #5
Rivet Master
 
2007 27' International CCD FB
San Diego , California
Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 1,323
Quote:
Originally Posted by Life is a Highway View Post
We are not installing Roof Solar maybe using a 200 Watt Portable
I would encourage you to reconsider your position.

Batteries do not create power. They are a temporary vessel to store and provide power, when a power source is not available. No matter how much one improves battery reserves, it is not a sustainable option.

Solar on the other hand actually generates power. Depending on the size and ones usage, even a moderate system can sustain power. Indefinitely.

It also greatly improves the reserve situation such that your current reserves may prove enough. With solar, daytime power use is consumed live directly from the panels. Batteries don't begin to matter until the sun goes down. So the battery reserve now only has to hold one over for part of the day rather than the whole day without solar.

200W-400W could set you up nicely, and indefinitely.

The inverter is a separate consideration. One may need higher performance batteries (AGM or lithium) to support a higher draw inverter.

Alternatively, this may be an option for your goals that is much easier - http://www.airforums.com/forums/f37/...um-196422.html
__________________
Boondocking option package:
'07 27FB Ocean Breeze "See Turtle", 3" lift
'09 Lexus LX570, on 33's
Tongue Mount Honda eu2200i - Rear Hitch - Underbelly Storage - Blizzard NXT w/ EasyStart - 3" Lift - 6" Fan Controller
pteck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-20-2019, 09:54 PM   #6
Rivet Master
 
daleyocum's Avatar
 
2018 25' Flying Cloud
Portland , Oregon
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 662
I did the install myself in the same trailer you have. Iím an electrical engineer and find this kind of stuff ďfun.Ē I left the existing fuse/circuit breaker panel and moved the Lithium batteries under the curb side twin bed along with the Victron Multiplus 3000 inverter, Solar controller, etc. I removed the stock converter because the Multiplus includes that.

I suggest waiting for Lew unless you are very comfortable with heavy electrical wiring and general mechanical work. It took me around 100 hours all together including the 500w of solar. Parts cost was around $8k (for 300ah of battery.). I since added another 200ah. This is a serious amount of stored energy that could start a fire easily if there is a short or high resistance connection.

I agree with the previous post that you really want solar to make this worthwhile. Iíd say 400w at least. That could be on your roof or with portable panels.

Note that very few, if any, portable panels are set up for lithium. Lithium has a different charging profile and charges at a higher voltage. If you go portable, youíd be hacking them to run into a different controller, probably a Victron 100/30.

Here are a few pictures of my install.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	AF803E4C-9E61-4CB3-80B2-B0A6EBA778C1.jpg
Views:	24
Size:	276.5 KB
ID:	343974   Click image for larger version

Name:	63B50BAA-A8EE-4C6D-97D9-3121B6B276CA.jpg
Views:	22
Size:	314.1 KB
ID:	343975  

Click image for larger version

Name:	AEE9A13F-C9E3-4706-A350-CFE371814F74.jpg
Views:	23
Size:	280.6 KB
ID:	343976   Click image for larger version

Name:	51A99B68-A3F3-4A3C-A218-F2D0B497F387.jpg
Views:	22
Size:	358.2 KB
ID:	343977  

daleyocum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-21-2019, 09:45 AM   #7
Half a Rivet Short
 
2017 30' Classic
Carlisle , Pennsylvania
Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 7,850
Quote:
Originally Posted by Life is a Highway View Post
25 ft Flying Cloud twin ft bedroom

I wanted better performance than the stock interstates and 1000 watt converter

I am somewhat confused I see many installs but not may Step one Step two reviews or instructions. Does the existing fuse and breaker panel remain?

Do you unhook the existing 3 stage charger as its not applicable for Lithium batteries. Or has some left it in and it works?

We are not installing Roof Solar maybe using a 200 Watt Portable

I am researching to install a Sterling 12 volt battery to battery charger so the Tow Vehicle charges the batteries under way, or can be started to supplement.

I have two Honda 2000 as backups for AC and a Micro Start installed on the 15 K roof air. 30 amp system

2-3 100 amp Battle Born Lithium batteries would be nice. A Victron 2000 or 3000 watt inverter charger makes sense.

A Victron 712 blue tooth monitor seems a practical option.

In our Airstream Kitchen is 1000 watt Airstream standard on/off button. Does this stay and control the Victron or is that automatic? Does this panel/button stay or is removed? Maybe is a Victron control panel installed in its place?

AM Solar has packages but I do not need the Solar options. They are Wayyyyy out there in Oregon I'm in Florida. Lew is out of the State till winter.

It seems installers want you to know everything then sell and install. Some of us end users need to have a rep look over the trailer and spec out equipment needs.

Two many late nights up watching YouTube and searching the net. Yes Frustrated- So probably may just stay with the stock system. Or just install two Battle Born 100 AMPís in the existing battery box and inside the trailer, install a better progressive dynamics Lithium shore power charger.

Would like to hear from those who have upgraded a 25 ft twin, added Lithium and or a charger inverter. Thank's for any suggestion or better yet pictures and a parts list for our trailer. The twin beds are a pain for install-
Hi

(more or less in the order you asked)

Better performance than stock interstates:

There are a *lot* of options there, lithium is one of many.

Better performance than the stock inverter:

Are you after better efficiency or more power? Victron (and many others) have inverters that go way up in power.

Step by step depends very much on *exactly* what you are doing in your exact trailer. In most setups the fuse panel only goes because it's attached to the converter in a way that it can not be saved.

Breaker panel usually (but not always) a separate beast. It generally remains in place. Again, it only goes if it can't be saved.

Finding somebody who has done exactly what you wish to do and has documented each step .... tough to find.

If you are spending a couple thousand dollars on Lithium's, tossing out the stock converter makes a lot of sense. If you want to get 100% of the capacity you paid for you will need a new converter. If 60 to 70% capacity is "ok" the existing converter will work.

Portable solar is something that quickly turns into a hassle. I would not consider using it as part of this sort of upgrade. Pay somebody to mount panels on the roof if you are not comfortable doing it.

A simple sub $100 DC/DC converter is all you need to charge Lithium batteries off your tow vehicle. Power available that way is generally very limited so it's not where most people put big bucks.

If you are into the 3 Battle Born + Multi 2K/3K range budget range, you just broke $5,000. Going back to the converter, it is fully replaced by the Multi 2K or Multi 3K. You would pull (or at least fully disconnect) the stock converter.

The stock Airstream switch does not wire directly to the Multi. There is a nice little Victron panel you can use instead. It gives you a lot of info on what is going on.

AM Solar makes visits to Florida so you don't have to drive all the way. As noted in posts above, you *do* want roof mounted solar if you are in this range budget wise.

If you go the DIY route, I would still strongly recommend at least going with the Multi-2000 to replace the existing inverter and converter / charger. Having a programable charger is a *very* good idea with (expensive) Lithium's.

Bob
uncle_bob is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-21-2019, 02:06 PM   #8
Rivet Master
 
2007 27' International CCD FB
San Diego , California
Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 1,323
I think it should be obvious to those looking to go down this lithium path that the slippery slope of upgrades is not a walk in the park. Parts cost, labor, complexity just to name a few.

As a technically savvy individual and the means to do such an upgrade, I personally would not. It's a full on custom job. To the extent that it's an exotic configuration requiring specialists to install. Mother Airstream won't recognize your trailer.

More importantly, for anything, there's the maintenance and sustainment piece. It's never just about the initial upgrade hurdle. What happens when one's on the road and runs into a problem or failure? Unless one has the technical ability, it's going to be hard to find the right support and parts on the road. Like driving an exotic to places that you'll only find support for a Ford.

I'm not trying to be a downer, but as someone that builds and supports very complex systems, these are some of the realities.
__________________
Boondocking option package:
'07 27FB Ocean Breeze "See Turtle", 3" lift
'09 Lexus LX570, on 33's
Tongue Mount Honda eu2200i - Rear Hitch - Underbelly Storage - Blizzard NXT w/ EasyStart - 3" Lift - 6" Fan Controller
pteck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-21-2019, 07:44 PM   #9
2 Rivet Member
 
Gulliver72's Avatar
 
2015 25' FB Flying Cloud
Barnstable , Massachusetts
Join Date: Aug 2018
Posts: 52
Help w/ upgrade

I did the full upgrade in my 25í FC FRONT TWIN myself. I relied on among other sources many of those that responded here. Iím a huge fan of Victron and Battleborn products. There is WAY too much to write here.
If you would like to talk about it with someone who has walked the walk, PM me, and we can set up a time to talk.
Gulliver72 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-22-2019, 06:31 AM   #10
3 Rivet Member
 
2016 Interstate Grand Tour Ext
brookhaven , Georgia
Join Date: Jun 2016
Posts: 157
Iím currently parked in Quebec looking out at The Gulf of St. Lawrence. I have four 100 watt panels on the roof and a 200 watt Hard Korr portable. I have a Yeti Goal Zero 3000 behind the driverís seat. I replaced the Atkinson controller with their MPT version. I use a Yeti Fast Charger and a standard charger while driving powered off the Magnum inverter. At the moment, the roof panels are producing 11 amps into the coach Lifelines. The portable is producing 115 watts and the slow charger is producing about 67 watts going into the Yeti. The Lifelines are at 13.32. I have the fridge and freezer plugged into the Yeti. I parked at 11 pm last night and used about 35% of the Yeti. Iím running my Oxx Coffee Box to make cups and then turning the pot off. All of this requires some monitoring, but itís working, and Iím parking at some amazing places. Headed for Gaspe.
coasttocoast is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-22-2019, 07:26 AM   #11
Half a Rivet Short
 
2017 30' Classic
Carlisle , Pennsylvania
Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 7,850
Hi

My trailer has been back to Jackson Center for attention from Mother Airstream multiple times since I "Uncle Bob'd" the electrical system with the lithium batteries. At least so far, they haven't batted an eye when the see how I trashed out their Wonderfull creation. They were quite willing to add on to it ( = put more solar on the roof).

If you ever intend to *sell* your trailer, indeed keeping good notes and possibly doing up some diagrams would be a really good idea. Dropping one of these custom monsters into somebody else's lap with no info is *not* polite.

=====

Need to finish my coffee so I can get back to doing yet more mods to the electrical system in the trailer ...

Bob
__________________

uncle_bob is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Help with Victron Lithium Install Troutboy Batteries, Univolts, Converters & Inverters 39 05-06-2019 10:14 AM
Help with brand new Victron dznf0g Electrical - Systems, Generators, Batteries & Solar 2 05-04-2018 12:17 PM
Setting up a Victron 700 help Dragline Electrical - Systems, Generators, Batteries & Solar 8 07-06-2017 01:32 PM
TV upgrade issues: Please help! theflash44 Electronics & Connectivity 7 03-15-2016 08:52 AM
1965 Caravel Electrical System upgrade...need help please. teeraniti Electrical - Systems, Generators, Batteries & Solar 27 12-28-2009 05:52 AM


Featured Campgrounds

Reviews provided by

Disclaimer:

This website is not affiliated with or endorsed by the Airstream, Inc. or any of its affiliates. Airstream is a registered trademark of Airstream Inc. All rights reserved. Airstream trademark used under license to Social Knowledge LLC.



Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 08:08 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
×