Tell me the History!

[ThePooches]

I purchased this Airstream today but they couldn't tell me anything about it. Also, it came without a Title and no bill of sale. It's a Overlander with a rear bath, side kitchen...assuming 26 ft but haven't measured it.

Can anyone tell me any further information about this trailer? (Year, Style?)

Also, I live in Michigan. How should I go about getting it registered and insurance without title or bill of sale?

Thank you for any insight in advance!

[1973Argosy]

Without at least a bill of sale I'm not sure how you would go about getting it registered. Hope you didn't pay much as it could be stolen. First move would have to be taking the Vin numbers to your local police department and have them verify that it is not stolen. If it checks out your dmv should be able to tell you what you will have to do to get it registered.

[OTRA15]

It should not have been difficult to get a bill of sale from the seller, including his or her identification, and authority to sell the trailer. There are generic forms available on the Internet for this purpose. Did the seller refuse to give you a bill of sale? Did he or she tell you the history of the AS and give you info on its former owners?

It is crucial IMO that you get a bill of sale from the seller, or you are going to have trouble registering it.



Good suggestion to take the VIN to the police or DMV. Just be prepared to be arrested for possession of stolen property however!



The price of $1250 seems like a steal [intended], unless the AS is stolen, and you get arrested for possession of stolen property. And cannot register it at the DMV. [edit -- see PS]

Good luck,

Peter

PS -- Your other thread is here:

http://www.airforums.com/forums/f348...-a-172114.html

In general it is easier for everyone if you keep a single thread going for starters IMO.

[ThePooches]

I wasn't able to pick this up myself, so I paid someone that I know to pick it up for me. The bill of sale was forgotten in the transaction. I've reached back out to the seller but getting no response ....

And yes, I agree about the two redundant posts. I thought the $1,250 title entice more people to assist with seeing what year this is. I'm eager to start researching and understanding what I have. However, I'm finding that challenging. I've narrowed it to what I think it a 1963 Overlander but the exterior lights are throwing me for a curve.

Thank you for your responses thus far!

[goransons]

I would agree before you go much further you need to run a vin check with the authorities. Then you can start the process to legally register it, which generally in most states is a multi year waiting period or bonded title. You can email the Vintage Airstream Club historian, Joe, at historian@vintageairstreamclub.com but the only thing he can look us if there are any club numbers ghosted on the front and back end caps. He can tell you who had it in years around when it was new, but that's about it because the club didn't track vin numbers, just owner/members.

[66Overlander]

Originally Posted by ThePooches

I wasn't able to pick this up myself, so I paid someone that I know to pick it up for me. The bill of sale was forgotten in the transaction. I've reached back out to the seller but getting no response ....

And yes, I agree about the two redundant posts. I thought the $1,250 title entice more people to assist with seeing what year this is. I'm eager to start researching and understanding what I have. However, I'm finding that challenging. I've narrowed it to what I think it a 1963 Overlander but the exterior lights are throwing me for a curve.

Thank you for your responses thus far!

Yes, you have purchased a 1963 26' Overlander International with double bed, made on Ohio.

The marker lights above the window are not original and were likely replaced at some point in the past. It is not uncommon for them to have been replaced with whatever was available, because the original style became unavailable or at least hard to find. Reproductions are now available.

[David F]

After you have determined it has not been reported stolen, hire a specialty company to navigate the process of securing a bonded title. The cost is very reasonable.

[kdickinson]

relevant input and advice - but the question wasn't "is this legal" it was - can someone "Tell me the history". The serial number will give you date and location of manufacture. Just google airstream serial number lookup. Not sure what other "history" you are looking for - with date and model in hand there will be plenty of marketing material specific to the year and model that will give you an idea of what the unit looked like when new which could be interesting. There are also forum discussion threads on every year and model. Best of luck with your purchase and I hope you are able to update it to your liking and enjoy it as it was intended to be used!

[ThePooches]

I'm not getting anywhere with the seller. She thinks I'm seeking a title so I've had to explain that I'm seeking a bill of sale and what that entails. She still isn't understanding my request.

I'm trying to do an online VIN search but everything is requesting a 17 digit Vin, which Airstream didn't start making until the 80's. Any insight on how to do an online vin search?

I called local law enforcement but they were no assistance without the trailer actually being brought to the department.

[Rjpuckett]

Trying to upload picture.

[OTRA15]

Originally Posted by kdickinson

. . .
. . . but the question wasn't "is this legal" it was - can someone "Tell me the history".
. . .

She/he also asked the following question . . .

Originally Posted by ThePooches

. . .
How should I go about getting it registered and insurance without title or bill of sale?
. . .

[ThePooches]

Also, just spoke with Secretary of State (Michigan DMV) and they said I can do a TR-205 which is an Ownership Certification process. They will then search if it's stolen or not, then be able to move forward potentially with a Title or turn it over to authorities. Since the seller is being uncooperative, I'm afraid this will be my only resort....

Thank you all for the assistance and insight. As for history, if there isn't additional exciting history (minimal made, rare, etc... then year is all I was seeking.)

[jake74]

Not sure about your state but here in Alabama anything 1982 or older doesn't require a title. You just carry unit to the dmv they check the vin and give you a tag.

[bibbs]

In NY state on older early 60’s vehicles all you need is a pencil tracing of the vin tag and state how long you have owned it. I was able to register a motorcycle and a British sports car that way. Of corse a bill of sale would help.

[ThePooches]

The form listed above worked and I was issued a title. Thank you everyone for your assistance!!

[OTRA15]

Great news, thanks for the update! Could you describe the title and any conditions? I guess they cleared the VIN as not a stolen vehicle? Thanks,

Peter

[ThePooches]

I took it to our Michigan SOS (DMV). The form used is a "last resort", only supposed to be used after a bonded title and numerous other scenarios were tried. However, I told them the scenario (unwilling seller, won't give bill of sale) that the statewide SOS (800 line) told me to have this exact form, along with a NADA Guide to show it's worth under $2500 and over 10 years old. The NADA only went back to 1966, not 1963 but they found that sufficient. However, the Manager was hassling, stating that I never should have bought it without the Bill of Sale and that if I wanted a Title (grantd that it cleared), I would need to take it to a weight station to confirm the weight. They agreed to run a NCIC (National Crime Information Center) check to see if it was stolen and told me to come back in one hour. Upon return, a different woman helped me and looked up the NCIC, then asked for my ID. I thought it was either 1) stolen or 2) she was issuing me a title. Then, she proceeded to ask if I wanted to put plates on it today and I said absolutely but asked if I was granted a title and she confirmed that I was. However, she needed the weight which the former Manager said I needed from a weight station, but I already had a printed copy of the weight from an Airstream website and that was sufficient for her. After about 10 minutes and $275, I was issues a title to be delivered in 2 weeks and a license plate. The title has no conditions, it's a clear title. All that's left is to insure it. I've read today that you have to find the right person to push this through and apparently I did.... I'm happy to answer any other questions!

[goransons]

Congratulations!!!!! I wish our state had that process! We look forward to seeing your progress.

[DavidsonOverlander]

Originally Posted by ThePooches

I'm not getting anywhere with the seller. She thinks I'm seeking a title so I've had to explain that I'm seeking a bill of sale and what that entails. She still isn't understanding my request.

I'm trying to do an online VIN search but everything is requesting a 17 digit Vin, which Airstream didn't start making until the 80's. Any insight on how to do an online vin search?

I called local law enforcement but they were no assistance without the trailer actually being brought to the department.

Not sure what is involved in registration in Michigan, but with a bill of sale you can register a trailer in Maine, and then transfer the registration to your own state. I did this twice importing vintage travel trailers into Canada from New York state and there were no problems either time. In both cases the owner had no title or registration, but provided me with a bill of sale. I went through Staab Agency for the Maine registration. Maine does not require you to be a resident in order to register a trailer there. I used my in-laws' Michigan address.

[OTRA15]

Thanks for the details, and so glad for you that it worked out!

Have a great Labor Day weekendf.

Peter

Originally Posted by ThePooches

I took it to our Michigan SOS (DMV). The form used is a "last resort", only supposed to be used after a bonded title and numerous other scenarios were tried. However, I told them the scenario (unwilling seller, won't give bill of sale) that the statewide SOS (800 line) told me to have this exact form, along with a NADA Guide to show it's worth under $2500 and over 10 years old. The NADA only went back to 1966, not 1963 but they found that sufficient. However, the Manager was hassling, stating that I never should have bought it without the Bill of Sale and that if I wanted a Title (grantd that it cleared), I would need to take it to a weight station to confirm the weight. They agreed to run a NCIC (National Crime Information Center) check to see if it was stolen and told me to come back in one hour. Upon return, a different woman helped me and looked up the NCIC, then asked for my ID. I thought it was either 1) stolen or 2) she was issuing me a title. Then, she proceeded to ask if I wanted to put plates on it today and I said absolutely but asked if I was granted a title and she confirmed that I was. However, she needed the weight which the former Manager said I needed from a weight station, but I already had a printed copy of the weight from an Airstream website and that was sufficient for her. After about 10 minutes and $275, I was issues a title to be delivered in 2 weeks and a license plate. The title has no conditions, it's a clear title. All that's left is to insure it. I've read today that you have to find the right person to push this through and apparently I did.... I'm happy to answer any other questions!