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Old 05-28-2015, 05:22 AM   #71
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Cost....the Moho cost $3.25 per mile over 51,000 miles. Total with taxes, insurance, maintenance, depreciation, etc.

Once in Canada at the Cummins in Toronto an oil change on just the generator of the Moho cost $468 USD.

Also, when flat towing a towed, the set up time at a campground is no different than an AS, the Moho required blocks under the jacks or it would simply drive holes in the ground. Admittedly once the blocks were placed, to have it level itself with the push of a button was nice.

One other note of a Moho with towed, one cannot back into a parking spot or any where else. And, it is just as easy to back a trailer as a Moho, once one learns how.


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Old 05-28-2015, 03:56 PM   #72
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Why would an oil change cost 468$.?.
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Old 05-28-2015, 06:06 PM   #73
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I've heard amounts higher than that to change the engine oil in a diesel pusher.


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Old 05-28-2015, 06:16 PM   #74
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Two ways for Airstream prices to fall.
A- I stop Airstreaming
B- I buy a new one

Guaranteed.
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Old 05-28-2015, 11:10 PM   #75
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The Airstream only park in which we have a share is Ponderosa Shadows located in Lakeside, AZ which is a few minutes from Show Low. The 131 miles to our place in Gold Canyon, AZ is about 2:45 of driving though the Salt River Canyon which is scenic, but the inclines and winding road are such that the posted 35 mph is reasonable and prudent going down to the bottom and then backup the other side.

https://sites.google.com/site/ponderosashadowsinc/

There are currently a few memberships for sale (each membership is a share of stock in the corporation). Usually when a family passes on or they sell their Airstream.... There are 40 memberships in the corporation and each one has an associated lot.

This year's dues were $850 for the season (typically mid May to mid October, depending on the weather at the time) and is all inclusive for water, electricity and the share of property taxes and other expenses.

The basic requirements are age 55 (or one of a couple has attained that age) and ownership of some model of an Airstream trailer, 5th wheel or bus.

More details are on the web pages in the link above.

I consider this permanent summer location a part of our Airstream investment.
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Old 05-30-2015, 07:11 PM   #76
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Opinion or fact ?

[QUOTE=Msmoto;1628230]Cost....the Moho cost $3.25 per mile over 51,000 miles. Total with taxes, insurance, maintenance, depreciation, etc.

[This Cost Per Mile is totally dependent on miles run. & your choices for the other costs. More miles = less per mile, up to a point. With RVs, a better figure is: how many adventures, how many nights out in the vehicle, how many new relationships during your period of ownership.]

Also, when flat towing a towed, the set up time at a campground is no different than an AS,

[My trailers have spring bars with lever rods, ball latch with lock, 7 pin cable, blocks of wood to put under the tongue jack's foot, disconnect the TV out from trailer, use level in several places, blocks of wood to put under every stbl jack's foot, a power drill to get out + kneepads to put on + go around & run the stbl jacks down. Add in raising wheels with wood or shims if trailer isn't level side to side and fix this before disconnecting from TV. None of this work is associated with settin up or readying my motor coach for the road. I do not & never will flat tow a car. ]

And, it is just as easy to back a trailer as a Moho, once one learns how.

[When backing a trailer to the right, the site moves out of view in the mirrows. After that the TV driver is dependent on observers for directions for safe parking. I never have that problem with my motor coach. An observer is always an asset, if available, so is the rear view camera on the MC, which is always available. I can back either my 30' or my 34' trailers to the right, but avoid it as a safety practice.]

TV's: Excursion 425 HP; E250 325 HP, Jeep Commander HEMI 330 HP

The whole point of my post here is to state how much work RVing with trailers is. I don't think anyone but trailer owners know the dedication it takes to move and travel with trailers.

IMO, most CG's aren't designed by, owned by, or managed by RVers who know anything about trailers and it shows.

Let's Roll !
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Old 06-05-2015, 09:13 AM   #77
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Opinion or fact

@Wolf Alaska

Agree, all my opinion in my posts. And, the issues of moho vs TT are endless.

I recently returned from about 3,000 miles of towing, NC to SD to WI to NC, and would offer another observation. My overall average speed with the moho is better for a couple of reasons. I can stop in a rest area, eat, use the toilet, nap, all without getting out of the moho, but to do this in the AS, well, it seems to take twice the time and I have to get out.

On the other hand, as i like to park in the truck stops for security reasons, with the AS I was able to back into a slot between trucks and have my bedroom window open onto a corn field, grass, woods, etc. whereas with the moho with towed, only a pull through, will work, and the windows cannot be opened next to the bed without the slid out...prohibited when next to a truck.

As far as backing, purely opinion, but with a rear camera on the AS, and a lot of practice, I just have no issue.

OK, one more for the moho....the ability to have easy A/C power...larger shower, way more convenience "instantly" but all at a cost.

Set up....my moho required blocks to be set under the hydraulic jacks, without which it drilled holes in the ground wherever I parked...over 10,000 lbs each corner. And these pads required the knee pads, sliding them under, etc.

So, it is just about what we prefer, not that one is better than another.

The most important item in your post IMO was the interaction we have with others in our travels. For me, this is what it is all about. And, with the AS, the community is very strong. With my Allegro Bus, the organization in my area fell apart, and this was very disappointing. In fact one of the primary reasons of returning to my AS TT was to have the interactions with the other AS owners via WBCCI and other get togethers.

Be well,
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Old 06-05-2015, 05:02 PM   #78
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To each his own everyone has things that sway there decision and life style.
I just prefer the AS for the way we camp. If I had unlimited funds I would buy a XV. those things can go anywhere. Tires 4 ft tall collects water of the roof filters it. You can go out for as long as the food holds out. Good camping Rand
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Old 06-05-2015, 06:24 PM   #79
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If I ever get to the point that setting up in a site is too labor intensive for me, il quit camping. If I'm only staying one night I don't unhitch. All hookups pretty much are the same for trailer or mh, where's the extra labor?
Camp labor. My very first camping voyage in my Airstream was up the road in a camping resort. I wanted to camp! I unhitched, applied the stabilizers and hooked up.

My next door neighbor, an Airstream motorhome, was packing up the next day. I sat and watched as he detached his hookups, drew in the awning, attached his toad harness or whatever it is called and then got his wife to pull forward as he worked with the towed vehicle. They pulled out until straight and finished attaching it to the rear.

Watching the process I could not help to compare. He had motorized stabilizers and awning but everything else was quite similar. I am not sure but I believe he had some kind of flush system too. He had fancier equipment but much the same stuff to do. It took him about 20 minutes though he had started the hose flushing earlier.

The only thing I believe is a major difference IMO is backing.

On the price and ownership

I purchased used. Frankly my unit was not in pristine shape at all. The original owner had a few mishaps that left their mark- the awning came loose at some point scraping the side about a foot, there is a 12"x12" square of belly pan replaced and a bumper that I straightened. Add to that repaired filiform edges and spots. The interior was great except for a freeform jigsaw cutting of the microwave opening to add a larger oven. Nonetheless I have addressed these issues as much as possible and have spent nearly half of what I paid updating and adding systems to my baby. During the 2015 Canopener I joined in the open house and several of you saw my project and commented on it very positively. It is a nice camper now with features well beyond OEM grade. I do not believe I could find a more solid camper with these features for the money spent.

As I read through this thread, a thought struck me that I add to the discussion. Switz mentioned about making additions to his Airstreams which I know he has done- as many have done. Being somewhat newer to Airstream, I see it as a purchase for the long haul; however, in just the few years I have been on this forum several have sold their late model Airstreams for another model, others bought 10 years earlier and are buying another new one. What factor drives an already Airstream owner to plunk down another chunk of cash on another one? There is quite a bit of sharing that they are modifiable, long lived, etc. It is just wanting a different size? Considering the appeal of an Airstream and the cost, how does that factor out?
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Old 06-05-2015, 07:58 PM   #80
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Originally Posted by rodsterinfl View Post
As I read through this thread, a thought struck me that I add to the discussion. Switz mentioned about making additions to his Airstreams which I know he has done- as many have done. Being somewhat newer to Airstream, I see it as a purchase for the long haul; however, in just the few years I have been on this forum several have sold their late model Airstreams for another model, others bought 10 years earlier and are buying another new one. What factor drives an already Airstream owner to plunk down another chunk of cash on another one? There is quite a bit of sharing that they are modifiable, long lived, etc. It is just wanting a different size? Considering the appeal of an Airstream and the cost, how does that factor out?
When we camped at the Airstream park in VA I heard this quite a bit too. I get moving up in size, but a few folks I talked to went from 05 to 10 to 14 all the same model and length. I guess you'd have to really want ducted air or whatever reasons. Reasons I don't have yet. Maybe one day I will have my own. But I do wonder. I suppose maybe some just like new. This is why some folks like to lease cars or buy a new one every 3 years trading in the old.
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Old 06-05-2015, 09:35 PM   #81
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This is why some folks like to lease cars or buy a new one every 3 years trading in the old.
Yes, I do not mean to be stating the obvious- choice. I am thinking more about cost as the 80 grand topic refers, to mods and changing up. As a used buyer I was motivated by price and like you, putting money into mods. I could have purchased the new FC I looked at but with financing.Perhaps for others there is not a particular "reason" to change often but I was wondering regarding quality and longevity how many have purchased new ones to keep them for many years and yet not necessarily vintage models perhaps 80's, 90's or 00's models. We are attesting to Airstream quality beyond that of other manufacturers and to some extent, I agree but there are also so very well built aluminum trailers. Oddly, there is quite a bit of new ideas in horse trailer construction that may be applied to an Airstream to beef up quality. When I was at the Canopener this year I noticed that the boardwalk to the beach was made of Rumber and thought how Airstream might try using that for flooring instead of wood. I guess what I mean is to hear the stories of long time ownership of the more modern Airstreams and how those owners perceive cost. I found it interesting that Matthew McConaughey went vintage after owning late model. Just sayin.
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Old 06-05-2015, 10:10 PM   #82
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Interesting discussion here. This whole discussion fits us, since we currently have a 40' Foretravel MH and are talking about switching to a 34' Airstream TT.

As was stated above, the convenience of being able to pull over nearly anywhere for a snack, break, meal, is great. Added to that is the fact that many motor homes have generators, so the microwave and coffee pot are always available. Foretravel, Newell, and some other high-end coaches don't use leveling jacks. The airbags are used for leveling, so there are no holes punched in the ground and no blocks of wood needed.

One advantage to our MH is that the driver's seat is up from the main floor, so that I look semi drivers right in the eye. Sadly, that isn't the case with newer coaches, or, for that matter, most other brands.

So why would we consider switching to an Airstream? Part of it is the way we are actually using the coach. When we bought the Foretravel two years ago we fully expected that we would be moving an average of every two weeks. Since then, though, I've joined Laborers For Christ, and projects generally last several months.

Part of the reason for a switch does involve costs. Oil changes are several hundred dollars, yes, but are generally only done once a year. Same for transmission fluid changes. With all but the smallest diesel pushers, you are running the same engine and transmission as over-the-road trucks. That means that you generally need to go to one of those shops for engine/transmission service. The shop rate for those places is fairly high, and there might not be one available in the next town. You truly need to have CoachNet or a similar service.

Last December we had what we hope was a very unusual month. We were scheduled to leave Urbana, MO for Stillwater, OK on the 3rd. We got only a couple of miles when the air compressor failed. No air pressure means locked brakes. It took about a week for the right parts to arrive and be installed. We finally headed out a week late, and got almost two hours down the road when one of the hydraulic fans for the radiator locked up and nearly destroyed the pump. We were towed to Big Cabin, OK, where we sat for three weeks waiting on parts. Total cost for that month was about $9000.

When I think about the convenience of our coach I wonder why anyone would choose anything else. When I look at it with a more practical eye, though, I realize that this may not be the right coach for us. No decision will be reached for a few weeks yet, as we have a daughter's wedding to take care of first. After that maybe things will calm down a bit and we can discuss what we want to do.

Airstream or Foretravel? Hmmm, BMW or Mercedes?
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Old 06-05-2015, 10:56 PM   #83
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Great post kb0zke. Like the jest at the end.
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Old 06-06-2015, 03:26 AM   #84
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I can see the BMW/Mercedes comparison as apples to apples, but Airstream/Foretravel?
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