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Old 05-26-2015, 06:07 PM   #61
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That's why he is quite happily married!
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Old 05-26-2015, 06:10 PM   #62
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Originally Posted by Msmoto View Post
OK, before I purchased my current AS, I did this "analysis" of the floor plans with an overlay.



Airstream Floorplans.003 by Tommie Lauer, on Flickr



The comparison shows that for actual length of the room, the AS is about 75% of the bus. Width, well, with the slides out the bus is clearly superior. And, the moho has all that nice solid cherry wood, lalala....



Weight: 41,000 moho, 7300 AS

Fuel mileage 7-8 moho, 12-14 Dodge pulling AS.



Cost: $388,000 moho, $104,000 AS (less discounts, of course)

Depreciation over four years: moho >$100,000, AS $15-25,000



Gosh, the AS does not look so expensive anymore....LOL

Have to add in the TV.

My folks had exactly two in twenty seven years of owning the same TT that were also my Dads daily driver. About 400k miles combined.

There is a crowd around here that trades prematurely. 5-7 years. Depreciation is a huge hit.

One can make a case for Moho and toad that is comparatively cheaper in this where length of ownership is key.
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Old 05-26-2015, 07:47 PM   #63
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Our 31' Classic is not really a Classic. It's a classic shell purchased new from the AS factory, shipped to Timeless in Colorado, then custom outfitted. I won't reveal the price - not because we are embarrassed by it or regret spending it - but rather because it doesn't matter.
We wanted an AS because it's not only a quality product but because you can do exactly what we did - customize it to fit our specific needs and desires. My husband is 6'4" so we have a real queen bed (not RV queen), taller countertops made of stainless steel, a huge metal shower, tall backed recliners instead of a sofa, pull out stainless top desk, deep double bin farmhouse sink, tankless hot water heater, abundance of drawers and built-ins. One of these days we'll sell our business and hit the road full time. We won't have to compromise on comfort because we planned a trailer that meets our specific needs.
We bought it 6.5 years ago; it looks brand new even though it has been camped in many times and has made numerous trips - including 2 to Colorado. We are in our mid-fifties and expect to enjoy it for many years. After 6.5 years it still meets our specific needs and wants.
We could have spent this money on a fixed-in-place retirement home, or on a home we can move around the country. We chose the latter.
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Old 05-26-2015, 08:05 PM   #64
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I started this thread. Purpose was to discuss Airstream quality not compare it with motor homes, although I mentioned I was downsizing from a class A diesel, now we have a Newell in the discussion. In case your not aware a Newell Motor Home is custom built $1.5 + million dollar coach. THREAD CLOSED BECAUSE we are WAY off the original point.....stop commenting.
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Old 05-26-2015, 11:10 PM   #65
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You are right the thread has taken on a whole new life.
I just purchased a new Nash 25'. For 1/4 the cost of an A$. It is right up there with A$ when it comes to quality and workmanship. I will be 70 this month and fully expect this coach to outlast me. I will spend the difference in price traveling and enjoying my time on the road.
I mentioned earlier that I also own a '74 Argosy 26' which I will put up against any new A$ for reliability.
But I just could not bring myself to spend the kind of money it takes to buy a new A$.


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Old 05-27-2015, 07:30 AM   #66
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The 2014 Classic model 30 listed for $96,147 without any options or tax. The same basic floor plan model with less storage for 2015 listed for over $122,000. There is a 5.5% price increase for 2016. I expect the 2016 models to be crowding $135,000 to $140,000 this year when the usual options are added.

All older Classic Airstreams values will decline more slowly with these significant increases in list prices for new units.

Between the new in 2013 2012 Ram 2500HD diesel (even at model year close prices) and the Classic Airstream acquired in 2014 plus all the custom modifications to both vehicles, the money spent is a significant number that would have purchased a modest home in our area. We also acquired a space in a mountain Airstream only RV park only three hours from our home. I figure when I am unable to manhandle the truck and trailer anymore, the Airstream will still be a summer home for us.

My wife is like a little girl in a new playhouse. She just loves the complete camping experience in our Airstream. When the wife is really happy, so is everyone else.....
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Old 05-27-2015, 10:25 AM   #67
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We also acquired a space in a mountain Airstream only RV park only three hours from our home. I figure when I am unable to manhandle the truck and trailer anymore, the Airstream will still be a summer home for us.
switz.... where is this AS only park? Sounds interesting!

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When the wife is really happy, so is everyone else.....
Truer words were never spoken!
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Old 05-27-2015, 12:45 PM   #68
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To replace our current truck and trailer would be a ridiculous sum of money.
$50,000 for a comparable truck + $140,000 for a comparable trailer = $190,000 to replace the rig-
Hope nothing drastic ever happens-


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Old 05-28-2015, 12:06 AM   #69
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Sorry I took the thread off course (I have Asperger's syndrome and do stupid stuff like that without realising I'm doing it so I apologize...and we're known for obsessing on one thing and RV's happen to be my particular...but I prefer to think of it as a hobby I'm very invested in).
But to the original topic...hell yes Airstreams are expensive but I think they're worth every penny...just not brand new. Sadly they depreciate at the same rate as any luxury vehicle (BMW, Benz, etc.) Which is why I say buy gently used. I can't believe the price difference between the '16s and '14s.
There is no question that Airstreams are one of the highest quality products currently being made. As far as the travel trailers segment in particular, the new Land Yacht has nothing on the market that even comes close. If I didn't personally find towing a trailer such a hassle compared to a Class A with a toad I would have bought one in '14 their first year (though the new ducted air makes me glad I didn't...)
Anyways, I'm off to the B-van forum's to direct my questions there.

I'll leave on this...never forget how lucky we all are to be owners of an Airstream (whether trailer, B-Van, Class A) the fact is we own Airstreams!! The most recognized name in RV's the whole world over, with the coolest owners I've ever met. That SOB class A I mentioned sure as heck doesn't come with rallies and forums like these.

Happy Streaming everyone! Here's to an amazing summer wherever the road takes you.
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Old 05-28-2015, 12:23 AM   #70
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If I didn't personally find towing a trailer such a hassle compared to a Class A with a toad I would have bought one in '14 their first year
Class A's can be incredibly comfortable and easy to drive. The space, amenities, and luxuries are awesome! The big diesel pushers just glide down the road, almost silently, with a wheelbase for pure smoothness and comfort. And they are incredibly fast and easy to set up in camp. Unhitching the toad is also fast and very easy. I know I will miss those aspects when we shift from our 44' diesel pusher to a 30' Airstream. But we're looking forward to the economy of the trailer and I know there will be decent creature comforts, even if at the cost of more time and effort for set-up in camp and hitching/unhitching.
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Old 05-28-2015, 04:22 AM   #71
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Cost....the Moho cost $3.25 per mile over 51,000 miles. Total with taxes, insurance, maintenance, depreciation, etc.

Once in Canada at the Cummins in Toronto an oil change on just the generator of the Moho cost $468 USD.

Also, when flat towing a towed, the set up time at a campground is no different than an AS, the Moho required blocks under the jacks or it would simply drive holes in the ground. Admittedly once the blocks were placed, to have it level itself with the push of a button was nice.

One other note of a Moho with towed, one cannot back into a parking spot or any where else. And, it is just as easy to back a trailer as a Moho, once one learns how.


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Old 05-28-2015, 02:56 PM   #72
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Why would an oil change cost 468$.?.
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Old 05-28-2015, 05:06 PM   #73
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I've heard amounts higher than that to change the engine oil in a diesel pusher.


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Old 05-28-2015, 05:16 PM   #74
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Two ways for Airstream prices to fall.
A- I stop Airstreaming
B- I buy a new one

Guaranteed.
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Old 05-28-2015, 10:10 PM   #75
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The Airstream only park in which we have a share is Ponderosa Shadows located in Lakeside, AZ which is a few minutes from Show Low. The 131 miles to our place in Gold Canyon, AZ is about 2:45 of driving though the Salt River Canyon which is scenic, but the inclines and winding road are such that the posted 35 mph is reasonable and prudent going down to the bottom and then backup the other side.

https://sites.google.com/site/ponderosashadowsinc/

There are currently a few memberships for sale (each membership is a share of stock in the corporation). Usually when a family passes on or they sell their Airstream.... There are 40 memberships in the corporation and each one has an associated lot.

This year's dues were $850 for the season (typically mid May to mid October, depending on the weather at the time) and is all inclusive for water, electricity and the share of property taxes and other expenses.

The basic requirements are age 55 (or one of a couple has attained that age) and ownership of some model of an Airstream trailer, 5th wheel or bus.

More details are on the web pages in the link above.

I consider this permanent summer location a part of our Airstream investment.
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Old 05-30-2015, 06:11 PM   #76
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Opinion or fact ?

[QUOTE=Msmoto;1628230]Cost....the Moho cost $3.25 per mile over 51,000 miles. Total with taxes, insurance, maintenance, depreciation, etc.

[This Cost Per Mile is totally dependent on miles run. & your choices for the other costs. More miles = less per mile, up to a point. With RVs, a better figure is: how many adventures, how many nights out in the vehicle, how many new relationships during your period of ownership.]

Also, when flat towing a towed, the set up time at a campground is no different than an AS,

[My trailers have spring bars with lever rods, ball latch with lock, 7 pin cable, blocks of wood to put under the tongue jack's foot, disconnect the TV out from trailer, use level in several places, blocks of wood to put under every stbl jack's foot, a power drill to get out + kneepads to put on + go around & run the stbl jacks down. Add in raising wheels with wood or shims if trailer isn't level side to side and fix this before disconnecting from TV. None of this work is associated with settin up or readying my motor coach for the road. I do not & never will flat tow a car. ]

And, it is just as easy to back a trailer as a Moho, once one learns how.

[When backing a trailer to the right, the site moves out of view in the mirrows. After that the TV driver is dependent on observers for directions for safe parking. I never have that problem with my motor coach. An observer is always an asset, if available, so is the rear view camera on the MC, which is always available. I can back either my 30' or my 34' trailers to the right, but avoid it as a safety practice.]

TV's: Excursion 425 HP; E250 325 HP, Jeep Commander HEMI 330 HP

The whole point of my post here is to state how much work RVing with trailers is. I don't think anyone but trailer owners know the dedication it takes to move and travel with trailers.

IMO, most CG's aren't designed by, owned by, or managed by RVers who know anything about trailers and it shows.

Let's Roll !
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Old 06-05-2015, 08:13 AM   #77
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Opinion or fact

@Wolf Alaska

Agree, all my opinion in my posts. And, the issues of moho vs TT are endless.

I recently returned from about 3,000 miles of towing, NC to SD to WI to NC, and would offer another observation. My overall average speed with the moho is better for a couple of reasons. I can stop in a rest area, eat, use the toilet, nap, all without getting out of the moho, but to do this in the AS, well, it seems to take twice the time and I have to get out.

On the other hand, as i like to park in the truck stops for security reasons, with the AS I was able to back into a slot between trucks and have my bedroom window open onto a corn field, grass, woods, etc. whereas with the moho with towed, only a pull through, will work, and the windows cannot be opened next to the bed without the slid out...prohibited when next to a truck.

As far as backing, purely opinion, but with a rear camera on the AS, and a lot of practice, I just have no issue.

OK, one more for the moho....the ability to have easy A/C power...larger shower, way more convenience "instantly" but all at a cost.

Set up....my moho required blocks to be set under the hydraulic jacks, without which it drilled holes in the ground wherever I parked...over 10,000 lbs each corner. And these pads required the knee pads, sliding them under, etc.

So, it is just about what we prefer, not that one is better than another.

The most important item in your post IMO was the interaction we have with others in our travels. For me, this is what it is all about. And, with the AS, the community is very strong. With my Allegro Bus, the organization in my area fell apart, and this was very disappointing. In fact one of the primary reasons of returning to my AS TT was to have the interactions with the other AS owners via WBCCI and other get togethers.

Be well,
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Old 06-05-2015, 04:02 PM   #78
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To each his own everyone has things that sway there decision and life style.
I just prefer the AS for the way we camp. If I had unlimited funds I would buy a XV. those things can go anywhere. Tires 4 ft tall collects water of the roof filters it. You can go out for as long as the food holds out. Good camping Rand
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Old 06-05-2015, 05:24 PM   #79
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If I ever get to the point that setting up in a site is too labor intensive for me, il quit camping. If I'm only staying one night I don't unhitch. All hookups pretty much are the same for trailer or mh, where's the extra labor?
Camp labor. My very first camping voyage in my Airstream was up the road in a camping resort. I wanted to camp! I unhitched, applied the stabilizers and hooked up.

My next door neighbor, an Airstream motorhome, was packing up the next day. I sat and watched as he detached his hookups, drew in the awning, attached his toad harness or whatever it is called and then got his wife to pull forward as he worked with the towed vehicle. They pulled out until straight and finished attaching it to the rear.

Watching the process I could not help to compare. He had motorized stabilizers and awning but everything else was quite similar. I am not sure but I believe he had some kind of flush system too. He had fancier equipment but much the same stuff to do. It took him about 20 minutes though he had started the hose flushing earlier.

The only thing I believe is a major difference IMO is backing.

On the price and ownership

I purchased used. Frankly my unit was not in pristine shape at all. The original owner had a few mishaps that left their mark- the awning came loose at some point scraping the side about a foot, there is a 12"x12" square of belly pan replaced and a bumper that I straightened. Add to that repaired filiform edges and spots. The interior was great except for a freeform jigsaw cutting of the microwave opening to add a larger oven. Nonetheless I have addressed these issues as much as possible and have spent nearly half of what I paid updating and adding systems to my baby. During the 2015 Canopener I joined in the open house and several of you saw my project and commented on it very positively. It is a nice camper now with features well beyond OEM grade. I do not believe I could find a more solid camper with these features for the money spent.

As I read through this thread, a thought struck me that I add to the discussion. Switz mentioned about making additions to his Airstreams which I know he has done- as many have done. Being somewhat newer to Airstream, I see it as a purchase for the long haul; however, in just the few years I have been on this forum several have sold their late model Airstreams for another model, others bought 10 years earlier and are buying another new one. What factor drives an already Airstream owner to plunk down another chunk of cash on another one? There is quite a bit of sharing that they are modifiable, long lived, etc. It is just wanting a different size? Considering the appeal of an Airstream and the cost, how does that factor out?
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Old 06-05-2015, 06:58 PM   #80
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As I read through this thread, a thought struck me that I add to the discussion. Switz mentioned about making additions to his Airstreams which I know he has done- as many have done. Being somewhat newer to Airstream, I see it as a purchase for the long haul; however, in just the few years I have been on this forum several have sold their late model Airstreams for another model, others bought 10 years earlier and are buying another new one. What factor drives an already Airstream owner to plunk down another chunk of cash on another one? There is quite a bit of sharing that they are modifiable, long lived, etc. It is just wanting a different size? Considering the appeal of an Airstream and the cost, how does that factor out?
When we camped at the Airstream park in VA I heard this quite a bit too. I get moving up in size, but a few folks I talked to went from 05 to 10 to 14 all the same model and length. I guess you'd have to really want ducted air or whatever reasons. Reasons I don't have yet. Maybe one day I will have my own. But I do wonder. I suppose maybe some just like new. This is why some folks like to lease cars or buy a new one every 3 years trading in the old.
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