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Old 08-14-2010, 10:49 AM   #15
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2008 23' International CCD
Saskatoon , Saskatchewan
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Hi Matthew and welcome to the forums! We have a 13 foot Boler (exactly the same as a Scamp...see website link below). We also have a 23 foot Airstream. Wow! What a difference 10 extra feet make! We haven't been to any US national parks yet, but we are going to Yellowstone in 2 weeks. This trailer is a good size, but the bed isn't. It is about 3-4 inches wider than our Boler bed. Very cozy! Take a measuring tape when you look at trailers to measure the bed.

There are also so many layouts that the overall length of the trailer may not matter as much to you. You can get your "top 3 wants" in many smaller trailers. For example, the new 23 Front Bed Flying Cloud has a queen bed that my 23 doesn't. Argosys and Airstreams of all vintage have some great layouts.

Personally, we have found that the corner bed on our 23 is way easier to get in and out of than our side-to-side bed on our Boler (You can crawl out the bottom rather than crawl over the other person). However, we won't keep the 23 forever. Our next Airstream will have a walkaround queen (I'm dreaming of a 27 FB) or 2 twins. The 23 fits our needs perfectly right now.

Happy shopping! Look at as many trailers you can to get a sense of layouts.


Lisa and Paul

2008 23' Int. CCD "The Atomic Pod"
1973 13' Boler (fiberglass egg) "The Boiler" (

WBCCI #23223 (=23 CCD)
TAC- SK 23223
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Old 08-14-2010, 10:58 AM   #16
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1999 23' Safari
Perrysburg , Ann Arbor
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Like tkasten, most of my stays are in more primitive places, boondocking. I can almost always get my 23' Safari into a "tent" site, and that's big plus for me.

The tradeoff seems to be that while I'd almost always like more room, a screen porch, a swimming pool, and perhaps a bowling alley, I'd have a hard time getting a bigger unit into some of those spaces. I'm an inveterate backpacker, however, and even a small trailer such as your Scamp would usually have seemed like ultra-luxe if I could have gotten it to the places I hike to ... so some of this is pure perspective. When I bought, I was actually looking for a 25'er ... but in the end, I bought what I could find, and I have no real regrets.

I will say that I find the "corner bed" just fine, but I am most often going solo. When the DW is along, it sometimes gets small.

I think you need to go to a few rallies and go through different design units and see what fits, visit a dealer or two and sit in new floor plans, lie down on the beds for a while, etc.

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Old 08-14-2010, 03:18 PM   #17
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2008 25' Safari FB SE
Grand Junction , Colorado
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You may have a problem locating an older trailer with a queen bed. I don't know when they upgraded to queens from doubles. Size of bed is dependent on your size—the queens are too short for us, but we solved that with some adaptations.

When we were looking, we found the corner doubles had a cramped toilet area and the bathroom door wouldn't open all the way because the bed was in the way.

Some public campgrounds have small spaces or little room to back in. We have always made it with a 25' (it is actually 25' 11"), but it can be tricky because the access roads are often very narrow. There are not as many long spaces as private campgrounds and they tend to fill first, so length can be an issue.

If you buy an older trailer you will probably have to put money into it. You'll have to check for floor rot, floor separation, bad axles and other things that often go along with older trailers. If all that has been fixed, good. My point is that older may not be a bargain unless you are willing to put up with fixing things and able to spend the money necessary.

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Old 08-14-2010, 05:34 PM   #18
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2007 23' Safari SE
Central , Connecticut
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I made a similar move - from a T@B teardrop to an Argosy Minuet 6.0 Metre. We've just finished a 15 day trip with the trailer so I now know what it's like to live with for a while.

First off, we love towing this narrow, short trailer. It's the same width as our minivan tow vehicle, which inspires confidence. The short length means I can turn it around in tight spaces and fit within two spots back-to-back. There is very little stress in towing, and that's nice.

But. Making a bed every night gets old. Since we sleep on a king at home, we sleep in seperate beds in the trailer - my wife in the dinette, me on the (smaller but longer) gaucho.

I also love having a dinette, but we started to leave the dinette made up into a bed and eating outside. That way we only had to make up the gaucho.

My thought (today - it changes often) is that the best combo for us - without regard to budget - would be a newer 22' Sport FB. That gives a biggish fixed front bed and a side dinette, plus a short and narrow trailer. Vintage options (which are wider, but also weigh the same or less than that 22' Sport) are a 22-23' Safari or a 22-24' Argosy with twins in the middle.

Frankly, for us, we'll probably draw a line in the sand because of tow vehicle choice, ease of towing, and my love of paying for toys with cash rather than financing. But we're young in our Airstreaming lives, so we'll see where this leads us...

The campsite thing - we've found that we simply can't get the Minuet where we got the T@B. (We could roll the T@B into place by hand and set the hand brake.) But I don't think we've encountered sites (we MUCH prefer state and provinical parks) that would fit our trailer but not a 25' trailer. That size, if you're willing to get the size of tow vehicle it needs, gives you a lot more interesting options in layout, like center bath models with a dedicated bedroom.

Just my random musings...

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Old 08-15-2010, 08:16 AM   #19
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St Ignatius , Montana
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Thanks all for such quick and thoughtful replies! There are a lot of factors to consider...

We'll definitely be looking at vintage (or near vintage) to get a trailer we can slowly renovate as finances allow. I'd love to find a 24'-25' empty shell that someone had gutted, put a new floor in and left as a blank canvas. That being said, the vintage 2 twin layouts would probably meet our needs perfectly. Are the twin beds in these full-width twin beds or narrower?

It seems like the sites we frequent here in Western MT host some pretty big trailers. Our size concerns focus more around campgrounds we like to stay in on the west coast... Olympic Peninsula. Kalaloch and Mora campgrounds are the two primary places we base out of when we're there and I'm embarrassed to say I haven't payed much attention to the size of trailers and sites available. Anyone camped there in a mid-size AS?
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Old 08-15-2010, 10:58 AM   #20
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2008 25' Safari FB SE
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My guess is that the twin beds are narrow, but others with more experience will surely answer that. The last time we confronted twin beds was on the Alaska state ferry and they felt narrow. Neither of us wanted to sleep on the top bunk, so we managed to fit in one bunk—after all we've been sleeping together for more than 24 years—that's our norm. To us, bed size and type is important. As creatures of habit, we just don't feel comfortable in a bed very different from what we are used to. We find we don't sleep as well and that's very important when you're doing a lot of driving (or playing). People differ on this, but you'd better be sure because once you have the trailer, you are stuck with it.

Maybe you could rent an RV with twin beds and see how that feels.

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Old 08-15-2010, 06:53 PM   #21
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How big is too big? Newbie Ponderings...

Greetings mattlyon!

Originally Posted by mattlyon View Post
That being said, the vintage 2 twin layouts would probably meet our needs perfectly. Are the twin beds in these full-width twin beds or narrower?
I don't think that there is a definitive answer to your question other than they are slightly smaller than a standard twin, but the actual trailer model and vintage has an impact on the actual dimensions. When I had new mattresses made for my '64 Overlander the center twins were 1.5" shorter than a standard twin and just under 3" narrower than a standard twin - - the way the bases are designed, the standard width would have worked, but with any bulk in the bed spreads or comforters and the aisle would be too small for comfort . . .

Good luck with your investigation!

Kevin D. Allen
WBCCI (Lifetime Member)/VAC/Free Wheelers #6359
AIR #827
1964 Overlander International/1999 GMC K2500 Suburban (7400 VORTEC/4.11 Differentials)
1978 Argosy Minuet 6.0 Metre/1975 Cadillac Eldorado Convertible (8.2 Liter V8/2.70 Final Drive)
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Old 08-15-2010, 07:39 PM   #22
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1972 25' Tradewind
Houston , Texas
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I borrowed a friend's SOB 30' trailer for a short camping trip before buying my Airstream. I knew that I didn't want to pull something that large and settled on a 24-25' Airstream in my mind as the right size. Then with the Vintage trailers out just watch what goes by once you know approx. what age unit you want and how much you think you can afford. Go to Vintage Airstream: Vintage Airstream Photo Archives

there you will see a great chart on the models, year and pictures of all the different Airstreams out there. It's pretty amazing how the same basic model can be very different even in the same year. Once you lock down your choices then be prepared to jump quickly with cash in hand when what you are looking for comes on the market. Good trailers in great condition move quickly and there always is somebody else out there willing to outbid you on E-bay or sitting in the driveway with cash waiting for the owner to come home. Good luck!
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Old 08-15-2010, 08:32 PM   #23
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1964 26' Overlander
1974 31' Sovereign
Milton , ON
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We started out with a 26' Overlander and used it for about 6 years before moving up to a 31' Sovereign. I remember looking at a Sovereign before I bought the Overlander and thinking that I wouldn't want to pull something that big, but when towing I don't even notice the difference.

It's inside that the difference is significant. The Sovereign seems much more than 5' longer. Several people mentioned the bother of having to make up beds, and one of our goals in getting the Sovereign was to sleep 6 in permanent beds. We now have three sets of bunk beds, and we don't have to convert the dinette to a bed.

We still have the Overlander. The goal is to eventually restore it in 1964 style for traveling for two, but for now, traveling with 4 kids, the Sovereign is a good size, although I do have my eye on this old Spartan...
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Grant Davidson
Milton, ON

1946 Spartan Manor
1954 Va-Ka-Shun-Ette
1964 Overlander
1965 Avion C-10 Truck Camper
1974 Sovereign
2005 F-350 SRW 4x4 crew cab long box
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