Goal Zero for disaster preparedness

[FCStreamer]

With the experience of last year’s hurricane season, I’m approaching this season with a different attitude. I’m purchasing a couple of things I normally wouldn’t. One was a satellite phone (that’s worthy of its own post). The other I’m thinking of buying is a Goal Zero solar generator.

As with most of these type of purchases, my use cases should determine if I should buy, and which model. They’re not cheap. But I’m not facing another hurricane without some method of keeping my phones charged.

I considered some of those solar chargers they sell for under $100 at Amazon. I’m a big believer in “you get what you pay for”. And one of my use cases involves running a small fan for 8 hours. So that led me to Goal Zero.

Anyone here with a similar use case have a Goal Zero? Which model did you get and how has it worked out for you? I’m thinking on getting the Goal Zero 400 Lithium. It’s the smallest lithium model they have. It’s $600. Not exactly an easy purchase for us but doable. The Goal Zero 1000 Lithium is $1300 but obviously more than twice the capacity and twice the weight, but twice the runtime.

Decisions, decisions...

[Lgebhardt]

Costco has the Goal Zero Yeti 1000 for $999. I thought about getting one, but decided an inverter generator was a better fit for my needs.

[uncle_bob]

Hi

If we are talking about an RV-centric situation here, you will get *much* better bang for the buck adding solar to the RV. If that is maxed out, add lithium. The (quoted above) $999 will put a *lot* of panels on top of an RV. It's also enough to drop a 100AH / pretty much stores forever Battle Born lithium into the mix.

Bob

[FCStreamer]

No, it is not RV centric. I will use it while at the RV, but I want to be able to use it at home or wherever I need to evacuate, so portability is important.

I’ve been looking at the Boulder 100 Briefcase solar panel option.

[FCStreamer]

Originally Posted by Lgebhardt

Costco has the Goal Zero Yeti 1000 for $999. I thought about getting one, but decided an inverter generator was a better fit for my needs.

I saw this one. It looks like a good deal. Goal Zero sells it for $1300.

I’ve narrowed it down to either the 400 or the 1000. Portability is important. Plus it’s $400 more, but more than twice the capacity.

[uncle_bob]

Hi

Ok, if it's not RV centric ....

Portable solar panel packages run in the $400-ish range. That gets you a 200W panel. It can be used for evacuation *or* RV use. Power wise it's a bit above what you see with the magic solar + battery gizmos. You get both a (rare) evacuation use plus a (far more often) RV use out of it. To me that makes the "bang for the buck" a lot better.

So, what does it do for you?

You can operate anything that will run off of 12V while the sun is (enough) up in an emergency. The "big deal" is recharging things like cell phones, tablets, and computers (at least to me). They already *have* batteries in them. No need to duplicate the battery. You are pretty much stuck, nothing to do / nowhere to go in a typical evacuation. There is *lots* of time to do this or that. The sun is out and you are just sitting there.

What does it take to go from portable solar to charging?

Well, to me, it's USB chargeable devices. Then all you need is a 12V -> USB adapter. Get that sized right and you can recharge just about anything you can lug with relatively little "sun time".

Cost wise you probably aren't going to break $500. Net result is a device that can be used in a lot of ways.

Just a thought ....

Bob

[OTRA15]

We are considering the 1000 or larger for similar reasons. FYI there are already a few threads with details about charging options, and various add-ons:

http://www.airforums.com/forums/f448...co-163149.html
http://www.airforums.com/forums/f240...-a-178647.html
http://www.airforums.com/forums/f448...ve-168108.html

For longer storage capacity during hurricanes, the 3000 might be worth the cost IMO:

http://www.airforums.com/forums/f240...-a-177828.html

. . . although its portability is not as good, as you note FCStreamer.

"Goal Zero" search results:

https://www.google.com/search?q=goal...com&gws_rd=ssl

BTW all these units are basically "big batteries" so the "generator" moniker is a bit misleading IMO. Goal Zero also carries solar panels, which make a lot of sense, although it takes ages to recharge the larger units by sunshine alone, apparently.

Peter

[Boog]

I put together my own “solar generator”. I used a MinnKota trolling motor battery box -$50.
A 35-amp AGM deep cycle battery to go in the box - $65. (The Goal Zero 400 has a 33 amp hour battery)The box will take up to a group 27 battery if you like.


A 100-watt folding solar suitcase from Renogy: https://www.amazon.com/Renogy-Watts-.../dp/B00HR8YNK6 -$250.


And I’m going to get a 300 watt inverter for use with small 110 volt items - $30. https://www.amazon.com/BESTEK-300W-P...+watt+inverter


So that’s $400 for everything - including the 100-watt folding solar panels. Any one item can be used separate from the rest and if any one item fails, it can be easily replaced without scrapping the whole setup.

[Dragline]

Or a Westinghouse IGen2500 converted to propane

[uncle_bob]

Originally Posted by OTRA15

We are considering the 1000 or larger for similar reasons. FYI there are already a few threads with details about charging options, and various add-ons:

http://www.airforums.com/forums/f448...co-163149.html
http://www.airforums.com/forums/f240...-a-178647.html
http://www.airforums.com/forums/f448...ve-168108.html

For longer storage capacity during hurricanes, the 3000 might be worth the cost IMO:

http://www.airforums.com/forums/f240...-a-177828.html

. . . although its portability is not as good, as you note FCStreamer.

"Goal Zero" search results:

https://www.google.com/search?q=goal...com&gws_rd=ssl

BTW all these units are basically "big batteries" so the "generator" moniker is a bit misleading IMO. Goal Zero also carries solar panels, which make a lot of sense, although it takes ages to recharge the larger units by sunshine alone, apparently.

Peter

Hi

Unfortunately solar is limited by some basic physics. If you want ~X watts, you will only get that out of ~Y area. A small panel will give you a small number of watts and a long charge ....

Bob

[FCStreamer]

Thanks for the links. I think that there is a misunderstanding on intended use. And the companies that sell these are partly to blame by calling them “generators”.

They don’t generate anything.

They store electrical power. Batteries would be a more accurate description.

Also, if your plan is to connect 120v appliances, you should think long and hard. Even the biggest Goal Zero Yeti, the 3000, can only run so much for so long before it dies, and it takes forever to recharge unless you have a ton of solar panels, and then it only takes the whole day.

Some folks may be wanting to run fridges and ACs and microwaves with this thing. Good for them.

I don’t. My primary use case is to keep my phones and iPads charged. My secondary use case is to run a fan in the case of a power failure. And in my case, I’ve also run out of propane to run my generator, or I’m at a place where my generator is not available.

Portability is paramount. If I’m not carrying it with me, it doesn’t do me any good.

Being able to charge it with solar is a nice backup.

This may not be what you would use it for. That’s fine. Different strokes for different folks.

I was wondering if someone actually owned one and had used it, what your impressions are.

[OTRA15]

Originally Posted by FCStreamer

. . .
I was wondering if someone actually owned one and had used it, what your impressions are.

One or two of the links I posted earlier have a couple of active users of either the 1000 or 3000 IMO.

[uncle_bob]

Hi

If a fan is just a fan ( = it's not a roof fan for instance), the portable fan that Home Depot sells as part of their "Ryobi" house brand will run for a *long* time on the largest battery (6AH ??). I don't know how many days that is. I didn't need to run it for more than 2 days ( single charge / single battery).

If the fan is something specific, I'd check the current drain. I have some that pull 4A on 12V. I'll take a lot of battery to run one of those for a day, let alone two or three.

Bob

[lkm4321]

I purchased the 1000 watt lithium from goal zero. It has a built in inverter so I plug it into the TT using the 110 pigtail. Very pleased this far. On our last trip on several nights we Watched a movie and ran the furnace and used light etc. as we normally would and still had 25% power in the morning. House batteries fully charged. I already had 250 watts of solar so purchased a 100 watt portable panel. Under full sun recharges in 6 hours. Really like not having to haul extra fuel and a generator. Perfect for sites that do not allow generators or limit hours. Down side, Cloudy days can leave you stranded for power. Added benefit. When not on the road it's a portable power supply for those times when power is needed

[uncle_bob]

Hi

One thing to be very careful about here. Batteries (which all of these are) get rated in amp hours. A pretty typical rating on a full sized (group 27) lithium battery is 100AH. A 100AH AGM is similar sized. To the 50% point, you get 50AH on the AGM and the full 100 on the lithium. Your stock house batteries (if you have a pair and in good shape) likely will have 80 to 100 usable AH. To keep this simple, I'll assume your RV has a usable 100AH.

Inverters are rated in watts. It does not matter if they put out the watts for two seconds or an couple of days. It's a way to look at peak power. The equivalent number to amp hours is watt hours rather than watts.

example:

Your 100AH 12V battery will put out (maybe) 400A for a bit. That would be 4.8 KW .. (gee a 5KW "generator"). That is not how you rate the system. It's nonsense. More useful is the 100AH x 12 = 1.2 KWH power rating.

Watts are a useful number in some cases. A solar panel is rated in maximum watts. You may or may not ever see that many watts come out of it. Unless you are in the desert in mid summer, getting max watts for most of the day ... not likely.

Your 100W panel if running at max with no loss will 7.7A at 13V. You can recharge a 100AH battery in 13 hours with one under ideal conditions. Under the more likely case, you are out over 24 hours ( = multiple days of sun).

Why bother with all this yack? The numbers you see on these gizmos do *not* make it easy to compare them to what you have already. In many cases you are buying a battery that is *much* smaller than what you already have In an RV centric situation, the money probably is better spent to upgrade (or repair) the existing system on the RV.

One quick way to compare this stuff is weight. Your house batteries likely weigh in around 150 pounds if you have AGM's. That's not the full system in the RV, just the batteries. If your lead acid based "grab and go" gizmo weighs 40 pounds, it's a good bet it is < 1/4 of what you have already.

Bob

[OTRA15]

FYI here is the Goal Zero 1000:

https://www.goalzero.com/shop/power-...power-station/
https://www.amazon.com/Goal-Zero-Por.../dp/B074T392CQ

. . . with the following tech specs from the Goal Zero link above:

Battery Details

Cell Chemistry: Li-ion NMC
Peak Capacity: 1045Wh (10.8V, 96.8Ah)
Single Cell Equivalent Capacity: 290.44 Ah @ 3.6V
Lifecycles: 500 Cycles to 80% capacity (Discharge: 1C, Full charge/discharge, Temp 25C)
Shelf-life: Charge every 3-6 months
Management system: PWM charge controller, low battery protection

FYI

[OTRA15]

Another new thread on the 3000 FYI:

http://www.airforums.com/forums/f240...ce-183983.html

FYI

[FCStreamer]

So I’ve been learning a lot about fans lately. I’ve determined that my use case includes charging phones, iPads, and running a fan. Maybe one of those Dometic low voltage 12V portable freezers. That’s it. For anything else I’ll have to wait until I get to the trailer and crank up the generator.

So I’m down to the 400 Lithium and 1000 Lithium. $600 vs $1000, 17lb vs 40lb, 400 watt hours vs 1000. Because of size, weight and price, I’m leaning towards the 400.

I’ve found some fans that draw 2A, probably 10-15A if I crank them up a bit (50-60A on high). I’ve also found some 12V fans. I could run one of these all night on the 400 Lithium. And recharge the next day with a 100 or maybe even a 200 watt solar panel.

This will also keep all my phones and gadgets charged.

A Goal Zero Yeti 400 Lithium and a Boulder 100 watt briefcase solar panel run $900.

A Goal Zero Yeti 1000 Lithium and a Boulder 200 watt briefcase solar panel plus the MPPT controller module upgrade runs almost $1700.

Decision time....

[OTRA15]

If the 400 proves to be too small, you can always get another and have the convenience of locating them in different places IMO. One solar charger could keep them both charged, if you are using one at a time. Not too bad an upcharge for the second unit. Lighter weight. Easier to take the uncharged one to a location with 120v power for charging.

400 . . .

[uncle_bob]

Hi

A couple of points:

500 cycles on the Goal Zero lithium battery may be reasonable for the chemistry they are using. The lithium chemistry used on most RV lithium's gets you into the 3,000 to 5,000 cycles range. That's a pretty big difference.

A fan's current drain will depend a *lot* on how much air it's moving and at what pressure differential. A fan that pulls 50 to 60A is rare. It would flatten your battery in under two hours. It also likely would blow the windows out of any room you used it in. The Home Depot Ryobi fan will run for several days on a single 6AH battery. That suggests it's pulling < 0.2 A.

If you flatten a 100AH lithium overnight, re-charging it with a 100W panel will take a while. Think in terms of 20 hours of sunlight to get the job done. Even that is optimistic. Reality may be closer to 30 hours of sun. Also plan on moving the panel every hour or so to catch as much sun as you can.

Bob