Converters on 2018 model

[capt_ron777]

Hi there . The AS booklet for the 2018 International 27 FB states that the converter in it "eliminates the need for complex electronic sensing systems" and is "designed to maintain constant output voltages regardless of the variances that occur in city power systems."I was ready to get a portable EMS protector to the tune of around $300 after reading some of the posts on the forums about problems in certain parks. Is AS this saying surge protectors or EMS systems are not necessary anylonger. Thanks for any clarifaction.

[billrector]

Originally Posted by capt_ron777

Hi there . The AS booklet for the 2018 International 27 FB states that the converter in it "eliminates the need for complex electronic sensing systems" and is "designed to maintain constant output voltages regardless of the variances that occur in city power systems."I was ready to get a portable EMS protector to the tune of around $300 after reading some of the posts on the forums about problems in certain parks. Is AS this saying surge protectors or EMS systems are not necessary anylonger. Thanks for any clarifaction.

No, I don't think so.

[rmkrum]

The convertor only deals with 12 volt DC circuitry. The ENS protector works on the 120 volt AC supply. It can save your electrical components from bad AC power conditions. The convertor won’t do diddly. They are also using marketing-speak to describe the convertor. They are just BSing what the convertor really does. Assuming this is the newer 4-stage convertor in your rig, the bottom line is that it’s a better battery charger than the old one, but it is for sure NOT an EMS or surge protector for the AC power input.

Use of an EMS is a bit controversial on the forums. As an engineer and ham radio operator that has dealt with surges, brownouts, and wrong power connections, a good EMS is essential to saving one’s butt when things go wrong at the far end of the power cord...and Murphy was an optimist.

[68 Overlander]

I think you are getting a new WFCO converter. They are the cheapest Airstream can find that I'm aware of. Airstream finally divorced Parallax over cost. The owner of Parallax told me that over the phone. They (WFCO) are 3 stage and they will claim they go into the bulk mode but have never been ever to convince me since I can't see it with my test set unless I trick it with a high load. They claim you don't always see it.
There is no significant surge protection in any converter that I'm aware of.

[fladealer]

Originally Posted by capt_ron777

Hi there . The AS booklet for the 2018 International 27 FB states that the converter in it "eliminates the need for complex electronic sensing systems" and is "designed to maintain constant output voltages regardless of the variances that occur in city power systems."I was ready to get a portable EMS protector to the tune of around $300 after reading some of the posts on the forums about problems in certain parks. Is AS this saying surge protectors or EMS systems are not necessary anylonger. Thanks for any clarifaction.

You would still want to purchase a surge protector.
the 2018 is a multi stage converter and charger but it
does not protect for a surge.

Good Luck,
Mike

[uncle_bob]

Hi

The verbiage you quoted applies equally well to pretty much every stock converter on every AS for the last few decades. They all supply 12V that is stable enough for the "stuff" in the trailer to be happy with it. They all are targeted at charging a battery. That has its impact on how they operate.

As noted above, an EMS / surge protector is a completely different beast. It's addressing a different need on the trailer. Fiddling with one does not impact the issues with the other.

Bob

[guskmg]

From sad experience, too! One surge can cost you all the equipment that in on at the time of the surge. AC, DC, it doesn't matter. Now you are into thousands of $s if you have to hire it done. Sorry to be repetitive, but it is like casualty insurance, you don't need it until you do!
guskmg

[capt_ron777]

Thank you all so much for the replies. I kinda felt that was going to be the consensus, but the AS manual was sounding so definitive. Purchasing a surge protector today. One other question re: converter. Since it is a multistage converter can it be left in on 110v to act as a trickle charger or will that potentially fry the batteries as other posts have mentioned. I'm getting a real education here from all you "old" timers with experience. Thanks.

[ROBERT CROSS]

Our routine......YMMV.

We store at home with no parasitic draw.

Keep it on the IOTA IQ4 'til it floats and disconnect, ck once a week, when/if it gets to 12.4v re-connect.

I don't trust anything 'lectricle, especially un-attended.

Bob

[pcskier]

Originally Posted by capt_ron777

Thank you all so much for the replies. I kinda felt that was going to be the consensus, but the AS manual was sounding so definitive. Purchasing a surge protector today. One other question re: converter. Since it is a multistage converter can it be left in on 110v to act as a trickle charger or will that potentially fry the batteries as other posts have mentioned. I'm getting a real education here from all you "old" timers with experience. Thanks.

The manual is correct--as Uncle Bob mentioned, converter output power is a different topic from surge protection on the inbound side (as well as low voltage, reverse polarity, etc).

The new converter/charger by WFCO that AS is using has similar specs as the multi-stage Progressive Dynamics units that many of us have converted to, with a 'float' mode of 13.2 volts--so leaving on shore power to keep batteries charged *should* be OK.

But as just mentioned by someone else, even with my multi-stage PD unit, I prefer to just use a smart trickle charger directly to the batteries rather than leave the on-board charger on line 24/7 for weeks and months at a time. Can't give you any technical reason why...I'd just rather not have 120v AC feeding into the converter/charger all time when the trailer is not in use.

[68 Overlander]

Probably wont convince you but if you leave it connected, in 10 years you might have the same story I do. Batteries still alive with a 4 stage smart converter/charger.

[68 Overlander]

I bought the WFCO converters right of the shoot. Sold thousands of them and some still buy them aftermarket. They are the cheapest on the market and why Airstream is using them.

[capt_ron777]

Randy, could you please confirm what you are saying. Are the WFCO converters safe to leave on at all times or are you recomending another way? Thanks, sorry for being dense

[billrector]

Originally Posted by capt_ron777

Randy, could you please confirm what you are saying. Are the WFCO converters safe to leave on at all times or are you recomending another way? Thanks, sorry for being dense

I also have a 2017 Flying Cloud and called Randy for a new converter. He sold me the 60amp Boondocker converter which I just installed yesterday. There is a good post on how to use the old converter box. PM me if you buy and want help with the install because it is more involved than I first believed.

[capt_ron777]

Thanks Bill. Will look into that and if I do will let you know. Ron

[68 Overlander]

Originally Posted by capt_ron777

Randy, could you please confirm what you are saying. Are the WFCO converters safe to leave on at all times or are you recomending another way? Thanks, sorry for being dense

Many report, and I have duplicated that they often don't change into the correct charge mode, whether it be boost for a more rapid and complete charge, and float, which is your storage mode. If you leave it connected for storage, it needs to drop back the the storage mode (13.2 VDC). If it does not, it will shorten the life of your batteries significantly.

[BarryLCole]

New Classic 33(manufacture date Mar 08, 2018). Breaker on converter keeps triping when hooked up to shore power and batteries levels drop. Was in JC last week for warrany work and some troubleshooting was done but nothing definitive found. They replaced the 15 amp breaker incase it was weak. Since we left JC on 20 June, breaker has tripped 4 times. Any ideas?

[uncle_bob]

Hi

What's going on in the trailer when the breaker trips?

Best guesses:

1) You have a load plugged in that is causing the problem.

2) There's a wire loose somewhere.

Both can be tracked down, number 1 is easier than number 2. Both require some further analysis.

Bob

[68 Overlander]

Originally Posted by BarryLCole

New Classic 33(manufacture date Mar 08, 2018). Breaker on converter keeps triping when hooked up to shore power and batteries levels drop. Was in JC last week for warrany work and some troubleshooting was done but nothing definitive found. They replaced the 15 amp breaker incase it was weak. Since we left JC on 20 June, breaker has tripped 4 times. Any ideas?

Is the converter on it's own breaker or shared with something else?

[uncle_bob]

Originally Posted by 68 Overlander

Is the converter on it's own breaker or shared with something else?

Hi

According to the owners manual, the converter shares a circuit with the receptacles by the bed(s).

Bob