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Old 01-25-2004, 10:49 AM   #1
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Hi all;

Don't want to mess with karma but we have a line on a 1969 GlobeTrotter 21 ft. Just about to put our offer in - waiting on a few questions to be answered to determine a good fair price.

We really love this layout, size and weight - so we have to have it! (just bought a new Kia Sorento for our tow vehicle - if we knew we were going the A/S route we would have bought Silver! instead we have Indigo Blue - well at least it is blue!!!! and has the silver accents on the bumbers and door panels).

We are looking on the lighter side of the A/S world - just not ready for the big boys. They may be cheaper to buy vintage today but they are a lot more to restore, use/pull and park one if you know what I mean.

This will be a long distance buy for us and hoping to tie in a side trip during our "snowbird" holiday in a couple of weeks and will be travelling an extra 1500 miles - if the deal goes through - knock wood, and keeping all toes and fingers crossed.

It was only a week ago I knew nothing about "Airstream" other than my fleeting memories of the "caravan" holidays in Cornwall England as a little girl. To the big "silver shinny things" on the huge highways my first summer in Canada 1968. I guess 1969 was a neat year for me - everything changed - as the world was changing too - We stepped out from the post war age right smack onto the MOON (my first real close look at the Airstream on Television) and since then there has been no turning back.

We are from the generation that has infant memories of the early 60's during which we developed mostly who we are today. Survived the 70's, 80's, 90's and have boldly stepped from the MOON to the new millennium. We enjoy holding our breath at every corner in great anticipation of the next adventure we conjure up!!

After spending hours on the internet reading your forums, the history, all the trials a tribulations of finding and restoring Vintage Airstreams and dreaming of winning a lottery to get into an brand new one LOL - We can say we are HOOKED!

She is 35 years old had mostly regular use and is still in pretty good shape. The outside could be mistaken for the new Bambi (once polished of course) but the inside although all intacked is tired and in need of a nice overhaul to bring everything back to pristine order.

Well we don't have her yet but sure hope we will be the successful owners. Really intrigued with this year/model - had a shell change that year that went on for the next 25 years. Changed from the rear bath (which I understand caused a few headaches with weight and warping - bootie-sag?) to a small side bath. The front dinette with the expandable table in the middle is perfect for us providing both an eating area and a lounge and the added bonus of the full affect of the "bay" window rather than sitting with your back to the window.

We have a few minor modifications in mind - more for convenience - but will be very careful to keep it in the period. Which is one of our big questions??? - if you take a close look at the 69 models they are still very much 60'ish but have incorporated subtle hints of the 70's. When looking up any information to date - I find the 69 GT listed in with the 70's and not in with the 60's. This makes her even more special - a misplaced soul not sure where to belong - still considered a 60's model but rolling with a 70's shell - sporting fabric design from the 60's mixing in the 70's - way beyond her time even then!

The layout boasts the "future" needs of the baby boomers or the tailenders like us. Somewhat lazy ...not wanting to have to make our bed every day - hence the rear goucho that can be left up - and not really into cleaning a bathtub on holiday - so the bath went for the bed. It must have been an easy decision for the designers with the knowledge of hot showers sprouting up in rest stations and National, Provincial and State parks across North America - so the tub in the bathroom takes a hiatis being replaced with the "wet bath" or "bird bath" sink and toilet only combination.

The 70's brought a sense of equality with both the wife and the "better" half wanting to "play" in the kitchen - could this mean that the larger galley was built just for us to spend more time together??? And to compliment the kitchen came the "kitchen congregation" (which is still with us today) and this could be the very reason for the fabulous expandable dinette table that conveniently tucks away for those rainy or lazy days just relaxing in the GlobeTrotter.....just my interpretation of the 3rd generation evolution of the Airstream.

All we are going on right now is a few pictures - have not even stepped inside one - all done through internet research - and relying heavily on your photographic skills - and imagination of the various aromas 30-40 years can muster inside each A/S beauty to be.

So in the interim I call upon all you long time Airstreamers to point us in the direction of as much information as possible. Floor plans, specs things like does she have brakes, where can we pick up a manual , where to get information and technical jargon on all the systems within her and the multitude of "Newbe" questions I am sure we will have.

We have never owned a "Travel Trailer" before but have been "Water-camping" for over16 years in our '20 Cruiser. And if our boat was Aluminum it would be the water twin of the GlobeTrotter.

Sorry for the long post - just our way of introducing ourselves.

With great anticipation and fingers crossed.....
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Old 01-25-2004, 11:07 AM   #2
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Welcome to the forum!

Its really neat to see the excitment of a "new" trailer purchase.

Couple of warnings - be careful about buying from pictures - make sure you are able to inspect the trailer - open all cabinets and poke around the entire edge of the trailer (or as much as you can get at) with an ice pick and look for floor rot. Look underneath and look for white powdery stuff that may indicate frame rust - look at the frame where you can see it in the front/rear, wheel wells and any other access where you can see the frame. Tap the underbelly and listen for particales bouncing around which may be frame rust pieces.

Be aware the 1969 is a transition year and some parts may be unique to that year - not a real biggy, just something to be aware of.

Other than that assuming everything checks out - enjoy the trailer and get that puppy on the road! Yes it does have electric brakes and you can get copies of the orginal manuel from Airstream in Jackson Center OH

Again good luck with your new trailer

Ken J.
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Old 01-25-2004, 11:30 AM   #3
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Greetings GT6921!

Welcome to the Forums and the world of Vintage Airstreaming!

Quote:
Floor plans, specs things like does she have brakes, where can we pick up a manual , where to get information and technical jargon on all the systems within her and the multitude of "Newbe" questions I am sure we will have.
Yes, your Globe Trotter came from the factory with electric trailer brakes. They will likely be Kelsey Hayes brakes if they are similar to the earlier 1960s coaches.

So far as manuals are concerned, your coach pre-dates factory service manuals by a few years - - 1972 was the first year for the factory service manual - - it is possible that since your coach is after the body style change that the 1972 service manual may be of some help in solving problems as there weren't seemingly a large number of changes (someone with more familiarity with your end of the model year specrtum will be better able to answer how helpful that manual might be for a 1969). You coach would have come with an Owners' Manual as well as a manilla envelope filled with individual manuals and literature for all of the installed accessories and options. You can purchase photo copies of the original manuals from the source below:

Quote:
Q: I need an owners and service manual for my Airstream. Where can I get one?
A: The first owners manuals were published in 1964. Prior to that, the owner received a brown envelope containing parts lists and other helpful information on the accessories in his trailer. The VAC has started making these available in the Members Archive section. A service manual with instructions for performing service operations did not exist until 1972.
You can get photocopies of owners manual (1964+) and service manuals (1972-1986) from:

Helen Davis Secretarial Services
PO Box 484 Sidney, OH 45365
(937)492-8885

Prices are about $33 and $70 respectively. After 1986 the Owners Manuals included available service information.
*The above is quoted from: http://www.airstream.net/FAQ/FAQ_3.html

You will also likely need to be making preparations for picking up the trailer. You will need a weight distributing hitch with an adjustable ball height that will allow for a hitch height of approximately 19" with a towing capacity of at least 4,500 pounds as the trailer has a dry weight of at least 3,300 pounds. To get the specifics, you can surf the following:

Airstream Trailers Weights and Measures

Another issue will be getting the trailer to tow vehicle connector situation worked out. You will find it much easier (IMHO) to have your tow vehicle wired to the current industry standard, then purchase a trailer end to match the connector on your tow vehicle. You will then need to be prepared to re-wire the trailer end to match the tow vehicle as Airstream did not use the current industry standard in 1969 - - I have had to re-wire the trailer end for both of my coaches (I don't like to deal with wiring, but was able to accomplish the task in less than two hours on the last acquisition - 1979 Minuet 6.0 Metre). You can find out more about the wiring scheme used on your 1969 Globe Trotter at:
Airstream Connector Pug Wiring Codes 1966-1981

Another potential issue will be trailer towing mirrors. Unless your tow vehicle is equipped with factory mirrors that have built-in extensions you will need a pair of good towing mirror to allow you to see out to the side of the trailer when in-transit. I have tried a number of different options and have found the McKesh Trailer Tow Mirrors to be among the most versatile - - you can find out more about the McKesh Mirrors at:

McKesh Trailer Tow Mirrors

If you haven't already found it, the Vintage Airstream Club website also has a wealth of information. You can find them at:

Vintage Airstream Club

Another site of interest is:

Vintage Airstreams

Good luck with your project!

Kevin
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Old 01-25-2004, 11:42 AM   #4
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Hi Ken;

Thanks for the welcome and your great advice for the inspect.

Unfortunately, we live in Ontario, Canada and this trailer is sitting in Lousianna. We will have enough to pick it up but certainly not galavant all over the states looking for one. I have literally looked at 100's on the internet - I think I have been to every singel used trailer dealer in North America LOL.

We would be 90 years old by the time we found one like it up here.

As it is a popular size it will not last long and it is in just at the lower end of average condition accorinding to the guidelines discussed on the Vintage.com site. It could even be in a solid average state - but we are waiting on whether all the appliances and systems work or at least all the parts are there. It is all original thus does need some touch up and rejuvinating. But from what we can see it is 100% in better condition than 99% of the same or newer years that I have seen of late.

Do you know of anyone in the New Orleans area (perhaps a WBCCI member) that could provide an inspection for us? Or we will just have to take our chances - we are very handy and have restored many boats - requiring new floors and transoms wiring etc. So we are prepared to do some work. This trailer was actively used as recently as 2 years ago and has been stored in a climate controlled location. The gentleman selling it is also very mechanically inclined and we certainly trust his word on the shell, frame, rust etc. condition.

At this stage we are just looking at trailerability - wiring harness compatibility, and setting up our tow-vehicle to accept the brakes as you say - which we have no clue about - as our present boat is only 2200lbs and does not require trailer brakes. Can you let me know what is required to make the A/S compatible to our vehicle - we have a class 3 hitch with a 4 pole in line wire harness. We know we will have to have a converter but not sure what. If we could find all this out before we leave we can get it ready thus not running around down there (if of course we get it - have not heard back yet). We may also get the present owner to take it and have the bearings repacked and axle overhauled for our journey - as well as checking out the quality of the rubber. This will all be much cheaper for us than getting a hauling company to bring it up for us.

Again thanks for the hints and any other info you can provide.

I will check out Airstream for the manual right away.

Have a nice day - still really really excited. And can not wait for our trip down south - it is bloody cold here - -32C this morning which is about -25F - whatever you would not want to be in an un-heated A/S up here today!!!!!
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Old 01-25-2004, 12:10 PM   #5
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check out this thread...

Congrats! You'll enjoy the GT. My first A/S was a '70 Safari, essentially the same trailer with the floorplan you described, but in the 23' variety. It had the extra 2' in the living room floor. Otherwise, they're basically identical.

Check out this thread for someone to look at the trailer for you:

http://www.airforums.com/forum...&threadid=7387

We're all excited for you... we've all experienced the anticipation that comes with getting your Airstream!

Roger
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Old 01-25-2004, 12:15 PM   #6
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Greetings GT6921!

Quote:
At this stage we are just looking at trailerability - wiring harness compatibility, and setting up our tow-vehicle to accept the brakes as you say - which we have no clue about - as our present boat is only 2200lbs and does not require trailer brakes. Can you let me know what is required to make the A/S compatible to our vehicle - we have a class 3 hitch with a 4 pole in line wire harness. We know we will have to have a converter but not sure what. If we could find all this out before we leave we can get it ready thus not running around down there (if of course we get it - have not heard back yet). We may also get the present owner to take it and have the bearings repacked and axle overhauled for our journey - as well as checking out the quality of the rubber. This will all be much cheaper for us than getting a hauling company to bring it up for us.
What you will need so far as the connector is concerned is a 7-pole Bargman style connector. It will be far simpler (IMHO) to have a matched set - - on tow vehicle and trailer. While it would be possible to have the tow vehicle wired to the Airstream pattern, most have chosen to go with the modern standard for two reasons - - to make towing more than one trailer a simpler issue of just "plug-and-go"; and to make it easier to have the trailer towed to a place of safety if your tow vehicle becomes disabled. You can find the modern wiring standard at:

Bargman 7-Pin Wiring Standard

You will also need a brake controller mounted on or under the dash of your tow vehicle. There are a number of brands and models among those most commonly mentioned are:

Jordan Brake Controllers

Tekonsha Prodigy


Hensley Tru-Control Brake Controller


I am a bit of a loner with my preference for an older style controller manufactured by Hayes-Lemmerz that features pendulum technology with a remote "emergency" or "panic" button.

Hayes-Lemmerz XPC Brake Controller with Remote Control

In addition to the wiring side, I would also suggest considering the type of hitch you are going to use and what type, if any, sway control you want to employ. I would suggest a Reese Strait-Line Hitch that includes Reese Dual Cam Sway Control and a variety of weight capacities - - you can find more information about the Reese Srait-Line at:

Reese Strait-Line Hitch

I suggest a hitch with sway control as I suspect that your tow vehicle and trailer are going to be fairly evenly matched in weight - - with the possibility that the trailer may outweigh the tow vehicle by a small margin when it is fully loaded for a trip. The hitch in the link above is the one that I use with both of my trailers - - the Minuet is very similar in weight and length to your Globe Trotter (Empty Weight of 2500 pounds with a Gross Weight of 3,100 pounds and a loaded hitch weight of 450 pounds) the hitch works well so long as the tongue weight is at least 400 pounds - - below 400 pounds and the Dual Cam doesn't function as well. For your trailer, I suspect that the hitch with 500 pound weight distribution bars would be the ideal - - it is what I use with my Minuet when towing with the Cadillac - - I have a set of lighter bars that I use with the Suburban.

You also may need a "converter" in the tow vehicle side of your wiring if your tow vehicle has separate amber turn signals - - most hitch shops should have the necessary electronic box to facilitate such a conversion.

Good luck with your project!

Kevin
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Old 01-25-2004, 12:20 PM   #7
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Thanks Kevin;

Must have been pecking at the same time.

Thanks for the info - will check out those sites right away - I get to do all the searching and the Hubby just sits back and dreams ha ha - I also have to do all the typing and searching boards to find the resourcefull people like you guys!!!!Thanks again.

He is venturing outdoors trying to get our Snowmobile started ready to take down for its consignment sale - this will be paying for our GlobeTrotter. Bought a real nice beauty 3 years ago but it turns out this sport is not for us - should have known - we are boaters and really hate the PWC's that fly in our wakes so why on earth would we like snowmobiling??? one of our dumb moves I guess. We prefer snowshoeing with our girls in the forest (Black Lab and Golden Retriever) They are seasoned boaters and I know they will just love "Airstreaming".

We are just so excited and it has been a long time since I have seen my husband get this excited about something too. He has probably got the whole thing refitted in his mind already! I am very lucky to have a handy guy - he can virtually do anything around the house from plumbing to wiring to masonary and carpentry - but I'm afraid car engines, ATV etc are not his thing - but stoves, furnaces, pumps etc and boats (save the engine for the real mechanics) are right up his alley.

Cheers
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Old 01-25-2004, 12:35 PM   #8
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Greetings GT6921!

A thought occurred to me that you need to consider if you haven't already. You will want to be prepared for the paperwork that you will need for the border crossing, customs, and registration once you get your prize back to Ontario, Canada. This can be a problem in the states let alone involving a border crossing. If my memory serves correct, Louisiana didn't become a strict title state until very recently (if it has) - - in this case, there may not be a title for the trailer - - rather a Bill of Sale. I would suggest doing a check with your local DMV officials as well as with border officials to determine what legal documentation you will need for the easiest transition possible.

Good luck with your project!

Kevin
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Old 01-25-2004, 01:03 PM   #9
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Hi Kevin;

Yes that was just another of the hundred things to consider but certainly makes the whole ordeal a lot of fun as oppossed to winning some money and taking a road trip to Ohio to buy a new one.

That is why we are anxious to make the deal as we have paper work to take care of if we are going to "hook-up" on our vacation.

We have found out that it is "admisable" as an import. We must have a verified VIN tag on the vehicle or an authenticated letter from Airstream. The owner has sent away for the "clear title" (it is now required in Lousianna) and it has been officially notrorized for that state. Once we firm the deal we will get the VIN and apply to our VIR (Vehicle Import Registarion) Registrar to have the VIN on record so that when we cross the border the US Customs will have it on record as clear thus we should have no problems at the border.

Otherwise we take the chance at the border and wait for the clearances - which could mean an extra couple of days which unfortunately we don'e have. We will have taken care of the Insurance and trailer licensing from this end - which may have to have a mechanical inspection in the states and verification faxed to our insurance company due to the vehicles age.

And if worse comes to worse - the deal goes through but we may have to make a second Holiday to pick her up. Either way ......we know we waaaaanit!
...and if life were easy......
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Old 01-25-2004, 01:41 PM   #10
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are you sure you want this trailor?
it took me about one year to figure out what I wanted
how long and what year
I spend almost 9 months looking for a trailor that was the right year and length and also in about the shape that I was looking for
It took two months to arange and transport to the netherlands

I also bought it trough the internet
got about 20 pics 30 Emails and several hours on the phone
only after I thought that the seller was honest about the trailor I went trough with the deal

Remco
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Old 01-25-2004, 02:43 PM   #11
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Yep!!! we are sure......over the years I have been known as the guy/gal in the movie "The Great Escape" you know the one who snifs the deals and happens to be at the right place at the right time.

We know there would be hundreds out there across the states but we found this one.

As far as style - there is nothing that can compare to the Airstreams distinct and timeless shape - and the mesmorizing shinny skin. After looking at 100's of other trailer styles - our mind was made up early on in the process.

In regards to the layout- this is the BEST layout for us - we have no children - and far too late now to even consider them - just not in our cards. But we do have dogs (2) gorgeous girls who travel with us everywhere - and this is the first trip we will be taking in over 10 years without our girls!!! Yikes how will I manage.

This model has the rear goucho bed with the small side bathroom. We are hoping to refit the bathroom to have it a wet bath and refit the goucho to make it an oversized double or mini queen take your pick - re-locate the floor cupboard to provide more room.

The Galley is perfect for our needs (we will be making a lot of our own meals as my husband is a diabetic) I will also add that by the pictures the condition indicates minimal use with no tell-tail wear on the counters, walls, or the stove - if the area around the stove is not used much then neither will the sink. The bathroom looks just like when it rolled out of the factory - and the walls are clean with no evidence of any water leaks. (although we have not seen any pics of the ceiling yet).

Anyway - we seem to be pretty lucky. To give you an idea...
We picked up our first boat for 1K put in $800 for a complete refurb and turned it for $2500.00 plus the installation of Central Air Condition in the house we were living in at the time. This went to pay for our present boat - an 83 Searay Cuddy '20 with trailer $4K over the past 6 years we have put about 6K into her and now everything has been replaced and refurbed to last for ever.

Moving to where we live - out of the blue we decided to look for a place where we always boat to - the Kawarthas in Ontario. Just one week of looking landed us a Timberframe home on 4 acres just minutes down the road from Stoney lake. Something that would have cost 200K-300K we picked up for $87K

Needed a little tractor to pull my garden trailer - picked up a 1969 (yes same year- original Simpsons made by MTD) - restored to original working order and still runs today (I did it not my Hubby!!!) ha ha.

Then we wanted a snowmobile (don't ask me why) but another week of research and I landed us a brand new 2off year with only 200miles - and this will be sold in the next two weeks for very little under what we paid for it - as it is the only sledd to hold its value - a key thing to consider when buying anything these days - and the proceeds will go to pay for our GlobeTrotter.

Our most recent buy (which has taken a little longer to wait for 4 years) was a waterfront property to slip our boat and eventually build a small retirement home - just 8 minute walk from our house. Again at the right place at the right time we picked up a property that is worth 200K+ for $54K

We are not rich - just smart and I must say real lucky shoppers -those deals just seem to be there when we are looking for them. I think some of it has to do with gut instinct to - there are many more "deals" that I have seen and walk away from cause it did not feel right - but this is not one of them.

We want to stick with this size because we want to travel with it - and hopefully we can hook up with some of the great caravans I have read about and maybe stop into some Rallys. We can not afford to run the big SUV/Trucks - and our weather just does not spare a vehicle sitting with no use - our winters and humidity will eat it up in a year. So our pulling weight is limited to under 4000lbs we max out at 5000lbs. When we become full timers then we can look for the more stately coaches but for now it is the sporty cuties.

We are the type of people that like to take a well used oldie and give it a new life- cause they just don't make 'em like they used to!

So we say throw caution to the wind - take a deep breath and jump right in - there is nothing that can not be fixed or restored - it is just a matter of when you can get to it or afford it ha ha ha.

Cross border US/Canada importing is a lot easier than overseas - thank goodness.

Most things take about 10 days to proccess here. Gees even our trip south is a last minute thing to spend some warm time with my parents - we are still waiting on our passports to arrive!

But thanks for the caution anyway - and I'm sure there will be a few more e-mails and a couple of phone calls before the money exchanges.

What did you end up getting remco? and are you happy with it?

SPK
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Old 01-25-2004, 02:48 PM   #12
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Welcome aboard GT!

A quick scan of the above doesn't show this link -- Airstream Values -- Price vs. Condition. The market in used Airstreams is all over the place. The asking price and actual trailer condition will be unique. It is very hard to see the "perfect trailer" and expect to find the same thing again for $1000 less somewhere else.

Understand how to look for soundness -- axles, floors, etc. Take a small flashlight and mirror and plan to eyeball as much of the plywood floor -- front end, rear, fore and aft of battery & fridge, etc, etc.

Look into "85MH325" Roger's link below if you want somebody with some Airstream experience vetting out a distant purchase.

Best wishes!
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