Terrified of the bellypan!

[LI Pets]

Originally Posted by beckybillrae

I noticed that some of the outriggers are solid & some are open. Any idea why?

I assume a structual issue perhap where the tanks are?????

I'm not putting the pink stuff back in there.

Do you get the pink stuff off the tops of the steel with a knife, or what? I didn't think it was a big deal there.

Prodex is very good

Yes use a putty knife etc just get it out when you see the scale and wood will just keep wicking up.

[Becky B.]

Originally Posted by LI Pets

I assume a structual issue perhap where the tanks are?????

I don't know....there is one on each side by the tanks & there are two on the rear on the streetside. More mystery, I guess.

Prodex...that's the one!

Thanks for your imput! I'll let the welder know your advise...I think I'll go with putting another one back to back with the old one..shouldn't be has hard that way. Beggars (me to my son) can't be choosers!

[Argy 78]

Speaking of critters getting in the belly pan, I tried to seal all openings but just this year I had some unwanted visitors in my Argosy, were else should I look to see if there are any other openings?

[dbj216]

Wow, you have a big project going. I hope to be doing the same think next summer. Your frame rust looks similar to mine. I believe I have lots of rain water getting into the belly area from my rear bumper sewer hose storage compartment. There are no water seal there. My rear most frame cross member had holes in it. The pink batting insulation holds moisture. I also have a rear cap seam leak causing rotting of the wood floor in that area.

Okay, I used just regular old house foam insulation like a person might use to finish off a basement. I cut it in squares and glued it up between the frame cross members. We live in Minnesota, so I put up two layers, one on top of the other. I also drilled several 3/8 diameter holes in my new bellypan to let any rain water out.

So here is a picture.

[Becky B.]

Mine does look alot like yours. I haven't gotten as far as deciding upon the insulation yet. The Prodex looks good, but it's really expensive. We don't go camping that often in the cold anymore, so I don't know if it's worth the investment. I'll mull that one over the winter. The foam like you used looks nice & tidy!

I finished removing the front belly pan and banana wrap today. Looks like I'll need 4 new outriggers. All I can say is, this really isn't a girl job! I think I have metal & rust in my hair. I also found the epicenter of the previous mouse kingdom up toward the front of the trailer. Yucky, yucky, ew, ew! I think I pulled a muscle (or have a hernia) from trying to get the legs off. After I struggled all day, my son ponied up his impact drill & they broke right off! (just like dbj216 said would happen!).

I will be making new banana wrap & really hope I can get it back on. I tore one piece of it & I couldn't get a strip of it off from under the refridgerator vent area. One more hat to wear.

My daughter is getting married two weeks from today. I have to stop this obcession for a while. I can't very well go to her wedding with scabs all over my hands & black Por-15 all over my arms! I'm taking a break so I can heal before then!

[Silverwanabe]

Becky,

The underbelly is something most vintage owners will deal with at least once.
But to me 86, is not that old.

Is nasty under there.
I am surprised about the amount of rust on your rear frame.

When I dropped the rear underbelly on my 67, it looked like a big monster puked on the driveway.

[Becky B.]

Is nasty under there.
I am surprised about the amount of rust on your rear frame.

Well, believe me, I was suprised too. Ironically, my husband talked me into selling my 1976 Overlander because of all the things I read here about rear end separation. It didn't have it, but it was a worry. I never dropped the belly pan in that one. But, we thought we'd get a newer, larger model for our needs. Big suprise after I started digging into things. I hope to keep this one & am doing everything so I know every inch myself! I'm not dropping the pans for the water areas though. I think that area is still good. The center of the trailer wasn't bad--the outside was. This will keep me busy for a long time! I need to have it ready by June, so I have a bit of time.

[dbj216]

You are likely no longer terrified of bellypans and bananna wraps. Maybe you will be serving some bananna wraps at the upcomming wedding! You have drilled out a lot of rivets!

I used Airparts in Kansas City for my replacement aluminum. They came recommended by this forum. They have it in 48" wide rolls as long as you want. They also have rivets by the sack. Aluminum is expensive so don't be shocked by the cost.

Airparts Inc. Homepage

Here is their web page. I had a good experience in dealing with them.

Here is a picture of my seam. I think the Airstream factory has a seam machine that forms the joint. It also appeared Airstream used interior sheeting for the bellypan. Mine was colored on the inside surface similar to the interior walls. But us backyard Airstreamers make our own seams using holes and rivets.

I made a 4 by 8 table to work on the aluminum sheeting. I could keep it square and clamp it down while cutting, making the seam, and cutting the overall length. The table helped out a lot.

Like most projects, the teardown goes a whole lot faster than the rebuild.


David

[Becky B.]

Thanks, David, for the helpful hints! I think I'll have to set up a big 4 x 8 table like you did. I'm thinking about cutting up the banana wrap pieces in my basement on the pooltable this winter. I'll have to cover it with a board so I don't cut up the felt. I thought that maybe I'd rivet the sections together once I have them in place. Wouldn't it be easier to handle that way? I'm thinking I'll put the center back together & then the banana wrap. But, my mind is way ahead of my actual actions!

I took a couple more pictures of the front section that I finished removing yesterday. I have a total of 4 open outriggers that need repair & 3 solid outriggers that need repair. What a mess! I'm going to have to hugely bribe my son to weld up all that stuff. I'm the sort that wants things done yesterday & he's the sort that doesn't mind taking all the time in the world. Thinks I'm a big pain when I bug him to do stuff for me! I'll have to treat him with kid gloves on this one! Don't want him to bolt!

[LI Pets]

Originally Posted by dbj216

Okay, I used just regular old house foam insulation like a person might use to finish off a basement. I cut it in squares and glued it up between the frame cross members. We live in Minnesota, so I put up two layers, one on top of the other. I also drilled several 3/8 diameter holes in my new bellypan to let any rain water out.

So here is a picture.

I've heard this will disintergrage with the vibration on the road, and rodents love it...................

Prodex

[Becky B.]

Is Prodex only available from Insulation4less? Isn't there something comparable at a big box store?

[Xbob2]

Originally Posted by beckybillrae

Thanks, David, for the helpful hints! I think I'll have to set up a big 4 x 8 table like you did. I'm thinking about cutting up the banana wrap pieces in my basement on the pooltable this winter. I'll have to cover it with a board so I don't cut up the felt. I thought that maybe I'd rivet the sections together once I have them in place. Wouldn't it be easier to handle that way? I'm thinking I'll put the center back together & then the banana wrap. But, my mind is way ahead of my actual actions!

I took a couple more pictures of the front section that I finished removing yesterday. I have a total of 4 open outriggers that need repair & 3 solid outriggers that need repair. What a mess! I'm going to have to hugely bribe my son to weld up all that stuff. I'm the sort that wants things done yesterday & he's the sort that doesn't mind taking all the time in the world. Thinks I'm a big pain when I bug him to do stuff for me! I'll have to treat him with kid gloves on this one! Don't want him to bolt!

Start the conversation with "Son, we have been reviewing our will ... "
Bob

[Xbob2]

Originally Posted by beckybillrae

Is Prodex only available from Insulation4less? Isn't there something comparable at a big box store?

Refletux(sp?) at Lows ...
Bob

[LI Pets]

Originally Posted by beckybillrae

Is Prodex only available from Insulation4less? Isn't there something comparable at a big box store?

not really the same rating, they sell prodex for about $.25 a square.

[Minno]

Originally Posted by beckybillrae

I noticed that some of the outriggers are solid & some are open. Any idea why?

On Little Girl, the solid outriggers were directly in front of and behind the wheel wells. I think they are solid to help keep critters and debris out of the belly area. The stairs have special outriggers as well, and they have slots in them to guide the stair mechanism when you raise and lower them. At the very front and rear, the outriggers are solid, but not full height. They are tapered on our trailer to allow for clearance for the corner banana wraps. The rest of the outriggers are open. I imagine to help conserve weight more than anything else, and maybe to allow for some air movement inside the belly pan. Maybe.

The slots on the stair outriggers are a great opening to allow critters into the belly pan area, and there have been a few discussions on how to deal with them. One of the better ones I remember was stuffing brass or bronze wool (like steel wool, but it won’t rust) into the slots to keep the critters out. I have no idea where to get brass wool though. I’m not sure what I’m going to do about the slots yet either.

Originally Posted by beckybillrae

I'm not putting the pink stuff back in there. I'm going to use some kind of insulation that people on the forums recommend (can't remember the name offhand--have to look it up again). Do you get the pink stuff off the tops of the steel with a knife, or what? I didn't think it was a big deal there.

Prodex comes highly recommended. The stuff you can get at Menards, Home Depot, and Lowes around us is Refletux (SP?). It’s not the same stuff as Prodex. Reflextux is made with air bubbles (similar to bubble wrap), and according to some of the other posters, the bubbles will pop in the extreme heat in the South when used inside an AS wall. And then it loses it’s insulation value. The Prodex, while a bit more expensive, is made differently and again, according to others, does hold up to the heat as it’s not made from bubble wrap type material. We plan on using Prodex in Little Girl.

Originally Posted by beckybillrae

I think I might land up making new sides for the banana wrap. It has some holes & corrosion in it. From what I've read, it's not that hard if you have a sharp tin snip.

You’ll want a set of 3 Aviation Snips. Widely available at hardware stores and online. Why 3? One cuts straight, one makes left-hand curves, and the third makes right-hand curves. Spend a bit more and get the offset type that will allow the sheet metal you’re cutting to pass under the joint of the cutters easily. Wiss and Irwin are two good brands to look for. No endorsement here – this is the first link that came up in Google – just to give you an idea of what you’re looking for: http://www.google.com/products/catalog?hl=en&q=wiss+aviation+snips&cid=1821681455 4915161705&sa=title#p


On the welding – I totally agree with how Bob said to start the conversation with your son.

[Becky B.]

I'll go with the Prodex. Do you think one roll of 4 x 175 is enough? It's $210 plus $28 s/h, so it comes out to .34/sf. It's actually cheaper than the Reflectix from Lowe's.

What do you think about the electric snips they have at Harbor Freight? I could put them on my Christmas list, along with the pneumatic riveter! I have a Harbor Freight right around the corner, so if it pukes, I can return it & get another one!

I've also called a local supplier & they have .032 aluminum in sheets of 4 x 10 for $48. I don't think that's too bad....at least I don't have to pay for shipping.

I think I've conquered my terror of the belly pan.....now I just have to line all the ducks up for the real work!

I love all the advice & encouragement...it really helps build the confidence!

[Minno]

Becky - do you mean this one? http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=92148

I was going to buy one, or a pneumatic one in the spring. I should have bought a pneumatic riveter this past Summer, but I didn’t. For the belly pan installation, I do plan on getting one. Harbor Freight carries ok quality tools IMO. Not as heavy duty as some of the commercial grade tools you can find, but for occasional use while restoring your airstream, they are quite good. Plus, they offer an extended warranty for dirt cheap on most products.

I would suggest still getting at least the straight cutting snips. They would easy to have under the trailer with you in case you need to trim something during installation.

Keep up the great work!

Chris

[Becky B.]

Chris,

My son says I should get this one: - Harbor Freight Tools - Quality Tools at the Lowest Prices

instead of that one. I have a pair of straight snips at home here, so I'll save a couple bucks there.

He thinks that instead of welding new outriggers on, he could just put another one back to back and self-tap them together. Seems to think it would be less stress on the original weld since the top is good but the bottoms are bad. What do you think?
Obviously, he'd have to fix the hole in the back with a weld, but what about the outriggers?

[Minno]

Originally Posted by beckybillrae

My son says I should get this one: - Harbor Freight Tools - Quality Tools at the Lowest Prices
instead of that one.

I agree. I was also going to get the pneumatic one instead of the electric one.

Originally Posted by beckybillrae

He thinks that instead of welding new outriggers on, he could just put another one back to back and self-tap them together. Seems to think it would be less stress on the original weld since the top is good but the bottoms are bad. What do you think?

I like the idea of not having to cut the old outriggers off. But I think I’d weld them together rather than using screws. Or maybe nuts and bolts with lock washers. Then you can do the repair without worrying about charring the plywood.

Maybe someone else will chime in with an opinion for you as well.

[Ambie '64]

Becky, I went with the two rolls of 24 inch Prodex. Your frame sections are probably just a bit under 24 inch spacing. You will have a bunch of it left over (or you can do two layers to achieve an R-21 value). Here's my install...