1966-67 Caravel Wheels

[Walter Banta]

Folks,
I could use a bit of help. I would like to pick up a used rim for my '66-'67 Caravel. Unfortunately, the trailer is at my desert place which is 150 miles away. Can you tell me how many bolts the wheel has, and the width of the rim(inside the bead flange)? I would appreciate any other words of wisdom that might be appropriate in finding/purchasing a correct rim. I have one or two cornered; however, I am not sure if they will fit. I am sure that it is a 15" wheel, but this all I know. Is there a way to use a tape measure - and measure from the rear edge of the rim to the rear of the center bolt face? This might help me determine if the rims I have found are the correct width and offset.
Walt Banta

[pcasa]

Hi, the Caravel has 5 bolts. And the original 1966 Caravel manual called for trailer tires that were 6:70 X 15 tubeless. (which you now must purchase equivalents).

[Melody Ranch]

Its a 5 1/2 width and 5 holes.

[empresley]

Sorry, not all 5 bolt hubs are the same.
I know of 4 patterns with 5 bolt hubs & wheels.
The most common today found on trailers is 5 on 4.5” bolt pattern.
My guess for 2nd most common is 5 on 5”.
Third is 5 on 4.75”
Fourth (which I have never seen in person) is 5 on 5.5”

Maybe someone can share the distance between the centers of two neighboring
studs (no wise cracks please).

If you can measure with some accuracy (within 1/16”) I can tell you what the pattern is.

First one to measure their Caravel gets a case of beer from the thread starter.

em.

[Inland RV Center, In]

Originally Posted by Walter Banta

Folks,
I could use a bit of help. I would like to pick up a used rim for my '66-'67 Caravel. Unfortunately, the trailer is at my desert place which is 150 miles away. Can you tell me how many bolts the wheel has, and the width of the rim(inside the bead flange)? I would appreciate any other words of wisdom that might be appropriate in finding/purchasing a correct rim. I have one or two cornered; however, I am not sure if they will fit. I am sure that it is a 15" wheel, but this all I know. Is there a way to use a tape measure - and measure from the rear edge of the rim to the rear of the center bolt face? This might help me determine if the rims I have found are the correct width and offset.
Walt Banta

A used wheel, with no known history, is never a good idea.

That kind of used wheel fail, all the time.

When that happens, it will cost you far more than you even want to think about.

If it will be used for an "emergency" spare only, until you get to the next tire shop, then that's a different story.

Andy

[airbolt]

I just upgraded my axel and original 5 bolt wheels on my 67 Caravel to a six bolt pattern...if you want my old spare and wheel it's yours free if you pay the shipping, or you can pick it up in Petaluma, CA if you're up this way anytime soon.

Oren

[Toldfield]

My Caravel went to Burning Man two years ago. A week or so after it returned I took it up to Tehachipi for a weekend of male bonding and such. On Sunday morning I noticed that a tire was flat. We put the spare on and drove down to Mojave to have the flat fixed. Upon removing the flat tire we found that the wheel had a 12" split just outboard of the center. As near as I can tell these are the original wheels. I am very happy that this did not happen on the trip from Southern California to Northern Nevada. As a result of this I drove out to Corona and bought new wheels from Andy. The new wheels are cheap insurance against this happening again. I also picked up some really neat chrome moon hubcaps while I was there...

Tom O

[Walter Banta]

Originally Posted by Toldfield

My Caravel went to Burning Man two years ago. A week or so after it returned I took it up to Tehachipi for a weekend of male bonding and such. On Sunday morning I noticed that a tire was flat. We put the spare on and drove down to Mojave to have the flat fixed. Upon removing the flat tire we found that the wheel had a 12" split just outboard of the center. As near as I can tell these are the original wheels. I am very happy that this did not happen on the trip from Southern California to Northern Nevada. As a result of this I drove out to Corona and bought new wheels from Andy. The new wheels are cheap insurance against this happening again. I also picked up some really neat chrome moon hubcaps while I was there...

Tom O

Tom, Thanks for the input. I think these wheels are original also. I'm headed to Montana this summer, so your idea may prove to be the best.
Walt

[Walter Banta]

Originally Posted by Inland RV Center, In

A used wheel, with no known history, is never a good idea.

That kind of used wheel fail, all the time.

When that happens, it will cost you far more than you even want to think about.

If it will be used for an "emergency" spare only, until you get to the next tire shop, then that's a different story.

Andy

Andy, I've reviewed "Tom's" response and his endorsement of the wheels, etc. he purchased from you. This might be my best option.
Walt

[Walter Banta]

Originally Posted by empresley

Sorry, not all 5 bolt hubs are the same.
I know of 4 patterns with 5 bolt hubs & wheels.
The most common today found on trailers is 5 on 4.5” bolt pattern.
My guess for 2nd most common is 5 on 5”.
Third is 5 on 4.75”
Fourth (which I have never seen in person) is 5 on 5.5”

Maybe someone can share the distance between the centers of two neighboring
studs (no wise cracks please).

If you can measure with some accuracy (within 1/16”) I can tell you what the pattern is.

First one to measure their Caravel gets a case of beer from the thread starter.

em.

empresley,
Thank you for your response. After posting, I happened to think that I had used an old 14" wheel tire when I was working on the trailer(temporary fitment). Having the tire/wheel handy, I measured the bolt pattern, and it is a 4.5" X 5 pattern. This is a start; now for the width/off-set...
Walt

[Walter Banta]

Originally Posted by Melody Ranch

Its a 5 1/2 width and 5 holes.

Melody Ranch,
Thank you for your response. When you say 5 1/2 inches wide, is that measured "inside" the two vertical edges(bead flanges)of the rim? This would be the edges/flanges where the inside diameter of the tire seals against when inflated.
Walt

[Walter Banta]

Originally Posted by pcasa

Hi, the Caravel has 5 bolts. And the original 1966 Caravel manual called for trailer tires that were 6:70 X 15 tubeless. (which you now must purchase equivalents).

pcasa,
When I was working on this trailer several years ago, I was able to get the 6:70 X 15 tires. They are bias ply nylon(6 ply) and were made in Mexico and marketed by Denman as trailer tires(Performance Tire, Long Beach, CA). I have had poor luck with radial tires, so this was the reason for nylon. The only other option was Chinese tires(These were marketed as trailer tires by an American company - name forgotten). My father worked 34 years for Goodyear, so Chinese was low on the list of good ideas. As a point of information, however, Tucker Tire in Tennessee markets 10 ply nylon tires, which are also Chinese, in 7:00 X15. They are advertised as Airstream tire size, which caught my attention. I purchased a set(5) of them for an old Jeep I was working on, and was pleased. Tucker Tire claims to have sold thousands of these with no problem. Ironically, the cost of five tires with shipping to Los Angeles was less than five Chinese tires(6 ply) marketed locally. If you have a larger Airstream, this may be interesting to you.
Walt

[Melody Ranch]

Those are the measurements I got from Inland when I was shopping for new wheels to go with the new axel. I just told the wheel supply 5 on five and a half and they knew what I needed. They are 15 in wheels, by the way. I first mounted 235's on the wheels and guess what? Would not fit the wheel well. Then I went 225's and they fit. Do what Tom said...go new wheels.

[drag'nwagon]

Walter,

I just happen to have 2 wheels and tires from a '65 Caravele in my garage. They are 5 hole on 4.50" bolt cirle, zero offset, 15.000" Ø, with like new 6.70 x 15.00 high bias 6 ply tires. This is the correct OEM equipment for your trailer. If you are looking for new stock steel wheels you will want to contact Dexstar in Indiana they wil provide you with a distributor in your area. The 6.70 x 15.00 high bias tires are still available and are widely used to today, you may to look into a farm store or some tire wholsaler to find them. These tires are not used any longer on passenger cars so going to the "big box" commercial tire stores will leave you confused because they do not recognize them anymore. I just got new 7.00-15.00's for my '56 for $70.00 ea.

[Walter Banta]

Originally Posted by airbolt

I just upgraded my axel and original 5 bolt wheels on my 67 Caravel to a six bolt pattern...if you want my old spare and wheel it's yours free if you pay the shipping, or you can pick it up in Petaluma, CA if you're up this way anytime soon.

Oren

Oren,
I would, indeed, be interested in your spare and tire. Let me ask a few questions.
1. Is the tire nylon or radial?(Were all three nylon or radial?)
2. Are these the original wheels? (I'm not so much a purist, but I would like to match as much as possible, and I do have the baby moon caps.)
3. Would you be interested in parting with/selling all three wheels/tires in your original five bolt(4 1/2") pattern?
Here is why I ask: I currently have three, 6:70 X 15 nylon trailer tires for the trailer. I am planning a trip to Montana this summer, and I know that the nylon tires are not terribly common any more; hence, I am trying to get situated for "unfortunate contingencies". I have little, if any, faith in radials(bad luck-thrown tread and wheel well damage), so nylon seems to be the lesser of two evils.
Walt Banta
wbanta@lausd.net

[scottanlily]

Just for a note on the bolt patterns talked about , The 5 on 5 1/2 bolt
pattern is comonly found on older Ford Broncos and pickups ,older Jeep CJs
and Jeep 1/2 ton pickups and international harvester Scouts and travelalls .
The center hole can be larger ,as on the Scout and Jeeps .and smaller
on the travelalls and Fords .Ive never ran across this size on an airstream
trailer . The 6 bolt lug pattern with 12" brakes on vintage airstreams matches
chevy truck wheels ,and the early wheels with the hub cap clips.That being
said ,i would agree to buy NEW wheels for trailer service ,best way to go .
you never can be sure about an old wheel ,especially in single axle applications where the trailer weighs 4 to 5 thousand pounds ,two old wheels
that came off a truck that weighs 4000 pounds ,yet has 4 wheels supporting
the weight ,not two . somthing to think about when deciding on wheels .

Scott of scottanlily

[Walter Banta]

Originally Posted by Melody Ranch

Those are the measurements I got from Inland when I was shopping for new wheels to go with the new axel. I just told the wheel supply 5 on five and a half and they knew what I needed. They are 15 in wheels, by the way. I first mounted 235's on the wheels and guess what? Would not fit the wheel well. Then I went 225's and they fit. Do what Tom said...go new wheels.

Melody Ranch,
There seems to be a discrepancy in our wheels. Mine have the 4 1/2" pattern with 5 bolts. I am familiar with the 5 on 5 1/2" pattern; it is too large. I might well go with new wheels; however, I am still "casting about" for input and options. (I have ruled out radials - too many thrown treads/bad experiences)
Walt Banta

[Walter Banta]

Originally Posted by scottanlily

Just for a note on the bolt patterns talked about , The 5 on 5 1/2 bolt
pattern is comonly found on older Ford Broncos and pickups ,older Jeep CJs
and Jeep 1/2 ton pickups and international harvester Scouts and travelalls .
The center hole can be larger ,as on the Scout and Jeeps .and smaller
on the travelalls and Fords .Ive never ran across this size on an airstream
trailer . The 6 bolt lug pattern with 12" brakes on vintage airstreams matches
chevy truck wheels ,and the early wheels with the hub cap clips.That being
said ,i would agree to buy NEW wheels for trailer service ,best way to go .
you never can be sure about an old wheel ,especially in single axle applications where the trailer weighs 4 to 5 thousand pounds ,two old wheels
that came off a truck that weighs 4000 pounds ,yet has 4 wheels supporting
the weight ,not two . somthing to think about when deciding on wheels .

Scott of scottanlily

Scott,
Thanks for the input. I am familiar with 5 on 5 1/2" pattern wheels. I have International Scouts and older Jeeps that use this pattern. It is too large for the Airstream. The Caravel used a 4 1/2" pattern with five bolts(Eventually, I thought to look at an old 14" rim that I sat the trailer on when I was working on it.). I hear what you are saying about used rims. The two I presenly have on the trailer are original(I think). The "new rims" that several parties have "touted", including the dealer, are they "Thicker Steel" - are they "Better Made"? It has been my experience that so long as there is no compromising rust, no obvious splits/cracks/bends/tears, and no oblonged/woggled-out lug holes, the rim is all right. Am I missing something important?
Walt Banta

[airbolt]

the spare is not a radial....not sure about the tires that were on the trailer. They had good tread, but the age is unclear to me. I don't really recommend using the old original steel wheels, but if you want them all, I believe the guy who put my new axel on still has the original wheels, tires, and baby moons (the moons are original and in near perfect condition)

I upgraded to new Henschen axel and new aluminum 6 bolt wheels....and like I say, I don't recommend staying with the original drivetrain....I'm a big fan of the Caravel, but I do believe that this particular equipment was under-designed. There are way too many recorded failures to ignore.

Give me a call at 707-775-5209 if you want to try to get any of the old parts and I will be happy to see if he will cough them up for free. He kept them to dispose of them for me so I don't think he will care.

Oren