|
|
10-12-2013, 09:48 AM
|
#21
|
3 Rivet Member
Currently Looking...
Sunset Beach
, California
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 146
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by ROBERT CROSS
That's certainly very devious of them...what kroc.
Guess the PM is shrinking, what with the improving RV market and all.
Bob
|
Hi Robert,
I couldn't agree more!
I wouldn't mind buying the wheels and tires myself, but I'm concerned about two points. First, from an engineering standpoint, is there any difference in the axles or the way that they are mounted? Second, if I change the wheels and tires and something happens, even if not directly related to the change, what does that do to my liability and how would the insurance company react?
Have an awesome weekend,
Rion
__________________
GinMame (Rion & Nobuko DuVall)
AIR# 58703
TAC CA-24
|
|
|
10-12-2013, 10:45 AM
|
#22
|
Rivet Master
1974 Argosy 20
2014 20' Flying Cloud
Kooskia
, Idaho
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 4,591
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by jcanavera
Personally if I were buying a new Airstream, I'd take the stock wheels and tires and then do what I did and buy the wheels on the open market. The tires will have value, the wheels will be brand new and if you watch the Michelin ads, you can probably get $70-$75 in rebates.
Jack
|
That is what I did on my new single axle 20' FC. My Sendel wheels were $123 each (not the very best price, but they were available, other dealers on line were out of stock), and the Tires from Costco were $232 each installed. I could not get a rebate as I only needed 2 tires, not 4. So, my total price was about $700. BTW, no Discount Tire dealer in this area.
Whatever I get from selling the "old" 15" factory tires and wheels will reduce the cost. Anyone want a pair? 3000 miles on the GYM tires. Wheels are flawless.
|
|
|
10-12-2013, 12:01 PM
|
#23
|
https://airstreamorama.com
2013 27' FB International
Palm Springs
, California
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 65
|
I'm glad I found this thread...I'm picking up my new International Signature 27FB in a few weeks and asked the dealer for a quote on an upgrade to the 16" wheels ant tires used on the EB model...$4,150! Ridiculous! I'll look at alternatives...
|
|
|
10-12-2013, 12:12 PM
|
#24
|
Moderator
2004 30' Classic Slideout
Fenton
, Missouri
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 10,411
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by idroba
BTW, no Discount Tire dealer in this area.
Whatever I get from selling the "old" 15" factory tires and wheels will reduce the cost. Anyone want a pair? 3000 miles on the GYM tires. Wheels are flawless.
|
FYI if you deal with Discounttiredirect.com (their Internet outlet), they usually have discounted mounting and balancing agreements with several dealers throughout the country. In my case there is not a Discount Tire dealer in town (we have none in St. Louis). Their web site gave me a choice of about 4 dealerships, I used National Tire and Battery (NTB) since they were closest to my home. When I went there I showed them my receipt and informed them that they have a deal with Discount Tire. They looked it up in the computer and I got a discounted price for mounting balancing the tires on my new wheels, demounting the tires from the Alcoa wheels and disposing of my old ST tires ($15 each).
Jack
__________________
Jack Canavera
STL Mo.
AIR #56 S/OS#15
'04 Classic 30' S.O.,'03 GMC Savana 2500
|
|
|
10-12-2013, 12:18 PM
|
#25
|
4 Rivet Member
2017 27' Tommy Bahama
2016 30' Flying Cloud
2014 27' FB Eddie Bauer
Hot Springs Village
, Arkansas
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 328
|
16" wheels and tires
I got mine from our dealer for 325.00 plus tax and they paid shipping. Of course, I bought a new trailer from them so I expected some discount. A/S price was 368.00 plus shipping which was estimated to be 50.00 per wheel.
Rick
|
|
|
10-12-2013, 08:11 PM
|
#26
|
Rivet Master
2014 31' Classic
2015 23' International
2013 25' FB International
Apache Junction
, Arizona
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 6,223
|
I bought 5 SenDel T03-66655T wheels, 5 Michelin tires and a six sensor Dill TPMS. That way I can rotate the five tires.
SenDel makes a galvanized steel wheel (part number S62-66655TG) as well as a white painted wheel (part number S62-66655T) rated 3,500 pounds.
__________________
WBCCI Life Member 5123, AIR 70341, 4CU, WD9EMC
TV - 2012 Dodge 2500 4x4 Cummins HO, automatic, Centramatics, Kelderman level ride airbag suspension, bed shell
2014 31' Classic w/ twin beds, 50 amp service, 1000 watt solar system, Centramatics, Tuson TPMS, 12" disc brakes, 16" tires & wheels
|
|
|
10-12-2013, 11:19 PM
|
#27
|
Rivet Master
2012 25' Flying Cloud
Battle Lake
, Minnesota
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 7,714
|
We replaced our originals with four Sendel T02 wheels (same style as original Flying Cloud) and Michelin 16" tires, mounted and balanced for near $1500 from Discount Tire. In the now less likely event of a flat, the original 15" spare will work fine.
I installed them myself and sold the originals in nearly new condition for $500, so the switch to 16" Michelins was $1,000.
__________________
Doug and Cheryl
2012 FC RB, Michelin 16, ProPride 1400
2016 Ram 1500 Laramie Crew Cab 4X4 Ecodiesel 3.92 axles
The Truth is More Important Than the Facts
|
|
|
10-13-2013, 04:34 AM
|
#28
|
"Cloudsplitter"
2003 25' Classic
Houstatlantavegas
, Malebolgia
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 20,000
|
Four new "good-for-a-years" at seven years...$530. Got three more years to go...goodness me, what shall I do?
Bob
__________________
I’m done with ‘adulting’…Let’s go find Bigfoot.
|
|
|
10-13-2013, 07:30 AM
|
#29
|
Rivet Master
2012 25' Flying Cloud
Battle Lake
, Minnesota
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 7,714
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by ROBERT CROSS
Four new "good-for-a-years" at seven years...$530. Got three more years to go...goodness me, what shall I do?
Bob
|
How many miles?
__________________
Doug and Cheryl
2012 FC RB, Michelin 16, ProPride 1400
2016 Ram 1500 Laramie Crew Cab 4X4 Ecodiesel 3.92 axles
The Truth is More Important Than the Facts
|
|
|
10-13-2013, 08:36 AM
|
#30
|
Rivet Master
2014 31' Classic
2015 23' International
2013 25' FB International
Apache Junction
, Arizona
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 6,223
|
There is no change to the axles when switching from the OEM GYM ST225/75R15D 15" tires and OEM wheels to the factory installable 16" SenDel T03-66655T wheels and Michelin LT 225/75R16E LTX M/S2 tires.
However, the OEM 15" tire diameter is 28.3" while the 16" Michelins are 29.2" in diameter. Thus one gets another 0.45" of ground clearance.
The load rating of the OEM tire is 2,540 pounds @ 65psi and a speed limit of 65mph. The Michelin 16" tires are rated 2,680 pounds @ 80psi with no speed restrictions.
I converted the five tires on the 2013 25FB International Serenity to the Michelin LTX (P) 235/75R15 XL tire mounted on the OEM wheel and had plenty of reserve. The tires were typically supporting less than 6,000 pounds when the trailer was loaded for camping versus the derated load capacity of 7,940 pounds. The Michelin tire is wider and runs at lower pressure so there is more tread contact for braking.
See tire comparision photo in my "Images: to the left.
__________________
WBCCI Life Member 5123, AIR 70341, 4CU, WD9EMC
TV - 2012 Dodge 2500 4x4 Cummins HO, automatic, Centramatics, Kelderman level ride airbag suspension, bed shell
2014 31' Classic w/ twin beds, 50 amp service, 1000 watt solar system, Centramatics, Tuson TPMS, 12" disc brakes, 16" tires & wheels
|
|
|
10-13-2013, 09:02 AM
|
#31
|
"Cloudsplitter"
2003 25' Classic
Houstatlantavegas
, Malebolgia
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 20,000
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by dkottum
How many miles?
|
Seven years worth of miles.
Covered during the Season....
Off during storage....
Is the LT/16 group using time, milage or both?
Bob
__________________
I’m done with ‘adulting’…Let’s go find Bigfoot.
|
|
|
10-13-2013, 05:13 PM
|
#32
|
2 Rivet Member
Currently Looking...
Norman
, Arizona
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 26
|
Here is where I am on this tire thing
I bought the Sendel T03 wheels from the manufacturer on Ebay ($122 including shipping) and some nice chromed metal valve stems that fit nicely with my external TPMS.
Now this is where it gets interesting. I called Airstream's technical support line and asked, "Why did you guys choose the Michelin tires as the factory upgrade?" His reply was, "Because they are made in America." I said, "That's odd! Tirerack says they are made in Germany!" He said he would ask one of their engineers and call me back. He never did. I double checked and the Michelins are truly made in Germany.
I called Tirerack and asked to speak to a "tire expert." I asked him to show both the Michelin XPS Rib tires and the Kumho Road Venture APT KL51 on his screen for the needed 225 75 R16 tires. I then had him read the fine print on each tires specifications. Here are the differences:
1. The Kumhos are 0.1 inch smaller in diameter.
2. The Kumhos weigh 37 lbs each, the Michelins weigh 49 lbs each.
3. The Michelins say, "Highway Rib Summer tires are not intended to be driven in near-freezing temperatures, through snow or on ice."
4. All other specifications related to load, speed, warranty, etc. are identical.
5. Lastly, the Michelins are $292 each plus shipping and the Kumhos are $115 plus shipping.
I spoke to my friend, Paul, down in Decatur, TX and discussed these Michelin tires. Paul does Airstream service. He said, in his experience, the sidewalls are very heavy on them (probably accounting for the additional weight). In addition, two trailers he is familiar had the Michelins installed in 2008 and now have sidewall cracks severe enough that the tires now need to be replaced. He indicated that these tires had run in excess of 100,000 miles and still had plenty of remaining tread. Interesting! The tread outlived the sidewalls!
Just to let y'all know, I am a Mechanical Engineer. I used to be registered in 5 states until I retired recently.
So here is what I did: I considered everything I know and I ordered the Kumhos.
I've blown out a total of 6 Goodyear Marathon's (the tire recommended and installed by Airstream) over the last two trips and I decided the Kumhos were worth the risk.
Discussion?
|
|
|
10-13-2013, 05:40 PM
|
#33
|
Rivet Master
2012 25' Flying Cloud
Battle Lake
, Minnesota
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 7,714
|
I'm not a mechanical engineer so I looked for experience with GYM's, 16" Michelins, and a few others. Don't remember seeing anything about Kumhos.
We travel far from home, often to remote areas or busy interstates, not where I want a tire with frequent unreliability. Or unknown reliability. The best experience I've seen has been with 16" Michelins, have not seen a blowout reported and they are providing long service life.
Airstream is offering them as an upgrade which indicates they approve. Airstream does not use Kuhmos or other less expensive 16" tires as standard equipment on their Eddie Bauer model, they use Michelins even though they could get by cheaper.
Using this reasoning, I put on four 16" Michelins, kept the original spare, and sold the near-new GYMs. We now travel with confidence in our tires, which we did not have before.
__________________
Doug and Cheryl
2012 FC RB, Michelin 16, ProPride 1400
2016 Ram 1500 Laramie Crew Cab 4X4 Ecodiesel 3.92 axles
The Truth is More Important Than the Facts
|
|
|
10-13-2013, 08:18 PM
|
#34
|
2 Rivet Member
Currently Looking...
Norman
, Arizona
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 26
|
One Last Thing
The fact that GYM's are trailer-rated with a speed limit of 65mph tells you something about trailer tires, in general. They aren't even rated for "human conveyance."
Both the Kumhos and the Michelins are light truck tires and built to a much higher standard. My only concern with truck tires rated E is the load rating of 2680 pounds @ 80psi. E-rated tires now encompass what used to be called "10 ply." The old exploding GYM's were load rated 2540 pounds @65psi and load rated D and have really soft side walls.
I'll study the load vs inflation charts to match up the recommended load on the new Kumhos and try to keep from shaking the interior doors off their hinges!
I'll keep y'all posted.
|
|
|
10-14-2013, 04:39 AM
|
#35
|
"Cloudsplitter"
2003 25' Classic
Houstatlantavegas
, Malebolgia
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 20,000
|
Not surprising, Airstreams aren't "rated" for human transport either.
I believe ST tires are made to be used on trailers.
Our TV Michelin's are E's but, never have been loaded to 80psi.
Bob
__________________
I’m done with ‘adulting’…Let’s go find Bigfoot.
|
|
|
10-14-2013, 02:19 PM
|
#36
|
4 Rivet Member
2012 25' FB Eddie Bauer
Fairbanks
, Alaska
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 268
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by farrel509
Now this is where it gets interesting. I called Airstream's technical support line and asked, "Why did you guys choose the Michelin tires as the factory upgrade?" His reply was, "Because they are made in America." I said, "That's odd! Tirerack says they are made in Germany!" He said he would ask one of their engineers and call me back. He never did. I double checked and the Michelins are truly made in Germany.
|
Reading this made me curious, I looked at the OEM Michelins on my 2012 EB and all of them were made in Canada.
__________________
Rick
"When you find yourself in a hole - quit digging!"
2012 1/2 Eddie Bauer, 2016 Ram Laramie 3500 SWB 4x4 6.7L Cummins 68RFE
|
|
|
10-14-2013, 02:56 PM
|
#37
|
Rivet Master
2007 28' International CCD
Springfield
, Missouri
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 1,423
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by farrel509
I bought the Sendel T03 wheels from the manufacturer on Ebay ($122 including shipping) and some nice chromed metal valve stems that fit nicely with my external TPMS.
Now this is where it gets interesting. I called Airstream's technical support line and asked, "Why did you guys choose the Michelin tires as the factory upgrade?" His reply was, "Because they are made in America." I said, "That's odd! Tirerack says they are made in Germany!" He said he would ask one of their engineers and call me back. He never did. I double checked and the Michelins are truly made in Germany.
I called Tirerack and asked to speak to a "tire expert." I asked him to show both the Michelin XPS Rib tires and the Kumho Road Venture APT KL51 on his screen for the needed 225 75 R16 tires. I then had him read the fine
print on each tires specifications. Here are the differences:
1. The Kumhos are 0.1 inch smaller in diameter.
2. The Kumhos weigh 37 lbs each, the Michelins weigh 49 lbs each.
3. The Michelins say, "Highway Rib Summer tires are not intended to be driven in near-freezing temperatures, through snow or on ice."
4. All other specifications related to load, speed, warranty, etc. are identical.
5. Lastly, the Michelins are $292 each plus shipping and the Kumhos are $115 plus shipping.
I spoke to my friend, Paul, down in Decatur, TX and discussed these Michelin tires. Paul does Airstream service. He said, in his experience, the sidewalls are very heavy on them (probably accounting for the additional weight). In addition, two trailers he is familiar had the Michelins installed in 2008 and now have sidewall cracks severe enough that the tires now need to be replaced. He indicated that these tires had run in excess of 100,000 miles and still had plenty of remaining tread. Interesting! The tread outlived the sidewalls!
Just to let y'all know, I am a Mechanical Engineer. I used to be registered in 5 states until I retired recently.
So here is what I did: I considered everything I know and I ordered the Kumhos.
I've blown out a total of 6 Goodyear Marathon's (the tire recommended and installed by Airstream) over the last two trips and I decided the Kumhos were worth the risk.
Discussion?
|
The Michelin Rib is not needed its overkill the Lt's are what everyone has been using with no drama.Why after all the trouble you have had would you buy some tire that is unproven on your Airstream?
By the way tires should be replaced every 5-6 years even if they are not driven 1 mile as rubber deteriorates.Most people are unaware of this and will argue but its a well known fact.Also even the Lt's have a thicker sidewall than most tires which is a good thing for our trailers as the have a tendency to scrub on tight turns.Oh well, Good luck with the new tires.
|
|
|
10-14-2013, 05:32 PM
|
#38
|
"Cloudsplitter"
2003 25' Classic
Houstatlantavegas
, Malebolgia
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 20,000
|
Hard to say for sure if the "country of origin" is actually the country of manufacture...but makes for good reading nonetheless.
List of tire companies - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Bob
__________________
I’m done with ‘adulting’…Let’s go find Bigfoot.
|
|
|
10-14-2013, 09:04 PM
|
#39
|
Rivet Master
1999 34' Excella
Currently Looking...
Hillsboro
, Texas
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 6,408
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by ROBERT CROSS
|
"Oh, what a tangled web....
__________________
Peace and Blessings..
Channing
WBCCI# 30676
|
|
|
10-14-2013, 10:45 PM
|
#40
|
Rivet Master
2012 30' Flying Cloud
San Antonio
, Texas
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 682
|
Would one of you 16 inch light truck tire guys explain the reasons you are switching. I can understand getting rid of the Goodyear Marathons but do you think it best to go to a LT tire really designed for that, light truck, with a secondary use as a trailer tire for very heavy loads. The trailer tire is designed exclusively for trailers, giving a soft ride, good traction and tread design, tougher sidewalls--hitting curbs, etc. Why not stay with your 15 rims and put on a very well respected tire like the E rated Maxxis 8008. That gets you 10 ply, 80# and what? I think 2800+ lbs of muscle each. ????
Howard
|
|
|
|
|
Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
|
|
Posting Rules
|
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
HTML code is Off
|
|
|
|
Recent Discussions |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|