Will Pro Pride Hitch Add Tongue Weight?

[jcl]

Originally Posted by DRPREECE

It adds 200 lbs. My factory tongue weight is 903 lbs. With the ProPride attached, including the stinger, it measured 1100 lbs. using a tongue scale and verified on the CAT scales.

Did you validate the 903 lbs with a scale?

[DRPREECE]

Unfortunately no. I did not have the scale before the PP was installed. However, I know the shipping weight of the PP (including stinger) is 200 lb. I was actually surprised when the scale read 1,100 lbs - mathematically confirming the advertised tongue weight. Plus the fact the CAT scale showed an increase of 1,140 lbs. on the rear TV axel with the weight distribution removed confirmed the tongue scale reading. I consider anything within +\- 100 lbs. close enough given the large potential for inaccuracies across the measurement methods. That being said, the shipping weight of the hitch is most likely very accurate.

[Luigi123]

How do you know how to set the weight distribution bars. Still guessing how far to raise or lower them. Is there an adjustment based on front wheel well to tire as it raises and lowers when Airstream ( 30ft) is attached. Just recently installed the 1400 ride is very stiff compared to the Reece dual cam with Air Safe that I had on prior to the PP.

[SteveSueMac]

Originally Posted by Luigi123

How do you know how to set the weight distribution bars. Still guessing how far to raise or lower them. Is there an adjustment based on front wheel well to tire as it raises and lowers when Airstream ( 30ft) is attached. Just recently installed the 1400 ride is very stiff compared to the Reece dual cam with Air Safe that I had on prior to the PP.

I think you could use front fender measurements to "rough it in". If the nose comes up 2" and you can bring it down 2" with the WD jacks, you're certainly close. I originally had 1000# bars and early on wasn't getting enough weight pushed to the front - I had a lot of "porpoising" or bouncing because the steering was not as tight to the ground. I was able to drive the jacks up to about 7" off the frame and get enough weight to stop the porpoising.

But eventually I went to the 1400# bars. The beauty of the jacks is that you can dial in exactly how much you need - no more, no less. But for that to be as accurate as possible, you need a trip to the scales. I haven't gone this year but the first year I went several times to get a baseline then each year after I go back to check (like real life, it's easy to put in weight when you're not looking! [emoji3]).

Start with Fender measurements to get a good sense of how much you need, drive it around and see how the steering feels and you might have enough info to be happy. Best though if you can do a 3-pass run on the scales to really know what you're dealing with.


Good luck!

[SailorSam205]

Originally Posted by Moflash

Tongue weight is a constant and does not magically disappear.

Tongue weight is a constant only for a specific tow configuration and will be different based on hitch and possibly other factors.

Originally Posted by PKI

Why would we measure the tongue weight at the end of the shank when the tongue ends at the ball coupler. Or if we are asking if the PP/H hitch adds weight, why would we not compare the weight of another hitch with a similar length shank to the PP/H configuration? Why do other designs not use a long shank if it reduces tongue weight? Pat

My view. TW is the down force applied to the TV. Because hitches using a standard ball allow a pivot at the ball, it is appropriate to measure the weight at that point. With a Hensley design hitch, the weight is transferred inside the hitch receiver.

Recognize that you are dealing with levers when hooking up a trailer - there is a negative to using a long shank on a ball hitch, you generally get more squat on the TV. Similarly, the trailer lever is from the center point of the axle(s) to the weight transfer point. The longer the lever, the lower the down force at the transfer point. You can see an example of this in the instructions on how to determine TW with a bathroom scale. Also, there is a power dolly company that recommends using a dedicated hitch-up bracket mounted well aft of the ball. Because the weight transfer is closer to the axles, there is more down force which results in better traction for the tow dolly. Final example - your common breaker bar, the longer the bar, the lower the effort you need to expend...

[ROBERT CROSS]

Moment arm leverage is not only present with the hitch, and the distance that is added to the tongue.

When setting up the '06 Burb with the HaHa, I was having trouble transferring enough weight using 1400lb bars, plus the ride was very stiff.
I swapped out the OEM receiver for a Reese V TowBeast.
Notice the much longer mount arms...more leverage equals less effort. I can now transfer the needed weight with 1000lb bars.

...my first trip to the CAT after setting up with measurements took 6 runs to get the baseline, and proper transfer. Noting the difference in side to side axle weight, and loading accordingly.
I now weigh at the start of the season, 3 runs. Never had a load related tire failure, and can't rationalize the need for 5-6 runs. If your rig is level front to rear all axles should be fairly equal. If you know the street and curbside differential you can pack accordingly.

For those who have weighed all wheels, was it done one at a time or all at once? Any tickets on the results?

Bob
🇺🇸

[SailorSam205]

Originally Posted by ROBERT CROSS

For those who have weighed all wheels, was it done one at a time or all at once? Any tickets on the results?

Bob
🇺🇸

I was at a rally where RVSEF was weighing rigs. I had my rig done. They used 8 scales all at once, one for each tire of my TV and trailer.

[TKerns]

Originally Posted by SailorSam205

Much of the HITCH weight goes directly to tongue weight. HOWEVER, because the distance from the axle to the TV is longer, more of the TRAILER weight stays on the trailer axles. If the hitch did not add to the distance from the axles to the TV, then your thinking would be correct.
I have seen posts on multiple forums where people did weigh their rigs before and after putting on a Hensley style hitch. I was surprised to see how many had minimal or negative changes to tongue weight. Here is one from this forum:

Great post Sailor Sam, and simple example with pictures.

[dznf0g]

Funny this should come up again, as I was just updating my spreadsheet.
I have a Hensley with a Propride-for-Hensley adjustable stinger and Rocktamers attached, so my numbers will be unique. The Propride stinger is both longer and heavier than a Hensley stinger as well. But if you use a quick SWAG percentage of these numbers, you might be close.

Note: Since each component is substantially different in weight and length, to be accurate, I looked at the effect of each component to calculate a total receiver effect of the system. The calculations were cross checked with CAT scale readings as well as Sherline scale.

Component weights:

Hensley total weight (sans stinger and flaps): 166.5
Hensley head weight: 99
Remainder of hitch components weight (jacks, brackets, struts, spring bars): 67.5
Flaps & Stinger weight: 89
All components were weighed on a "Doctor's" balance scale.

Since the jacks and brackets are mounted on the AS A-frame aft of the ball, their weight and effect on receiver weight is baked into the trailer coupler (tongue) weight calculation. And since the struts and springs are suspended on the A-frame on one end and the hitch head on the other, a portion of their weight is baked into the coupler weight and a portion is part of overall effective head weight. I used a 50/50 figure for this part of the calculation. It's probably off a pound or two, but accurate enough. I used 18# for the portion of the weight of the struts and bars suspended from the head.

NOTE: THE FIGURES ARE HEAVILY DEPENDENT ON THE UNIQUE DIMENSIONS OF MY TRAILER, HITCH AND TRUCK. such as wheel base, rear overhang, length of stinger, receiver to ball dimension, and the distance from coupler to axle on the trailer. these numbers have a dramatic effect on the outcomes, so be careful drawing conclusions for your rig.

Final trailer coupler weight: 860

Effective Coupler TW weight at receiver: 774
(note: Since my stinger and the PPP design is 25" from ball to receiver, there is a larger effect on effective coupler weight than with a conventional WD hitch.)

Effective Hensley Head Weight at Receiver: 98
(note: this includes the 18# portion of the bars and struts suspended by the head)

Effective Hensley Stinger/Flaps weight at Receiver: 89

Total Effective Receiver Weight: 959 (effective coupler weight, flaps/stinger, head/bar/strut portion)

So, there is a 99# difference between the coupler final weight + the Hensley component weights and the system's final effective weight at the receiver.

Of course, this does not tell you the DIFFERENCE between a conventional WD hitch setup and a PPP setup. A similar exercise would have to be done with the weights and dimensions for an opposing comparative setup....but the total difference will be Substantially less than 99#.