Why do I need a hitch? Confused.

[Bill M.]

I tow a 25' with a 2500 Dodge and I use the WD hitch. It is some trouble to set it up the first time. After it is all set up and adjusted it is not difficult to hitch and unhitch. I have never towed anything heavy without one and I have never seen anybody tow an Airstream without one so I just accepted it as a fact of life.

[Cracker]

The problem with trucks like my GMC 3500 long bed crew cab dually is that the coupling is short between the rear axle and the hitch ball. My tongue weight was right at 940 lbs with my old trailer and I don't care how much pressure you put on with 1,000 lb bars you simply were not going to transfer much load to the front axle - nor in fact did you unload the axle much with just the tongue weight of the trailer - and you sure as heck didn't drop the rear end of the dually more than 3/4"! The only thing you accomplished was to stiffen up the hitch and make the trailer and truck ride harder. I switched to 600 lb bars several years ago and their primary purpose was to "cushion" the coupling. They simply aren't tensioned that much. I also switched to the full Reese sway control system - after doing without it for 3 or 4 years - and I've never been able tell any difference in handling. That doesn't mean I'm not a proponent of sway control - but I simply offer the comment as another reference to the stability of the heavy, long-wheelbase, dually. I also switched the rear springs on the dually to a lower capacity GM spring to soften the ride for the trailer - and I never loosened or popped a rivet on the front.

[Howard L.]

Ibskot,
I'm pulling a 30 with a 3/4 ton Chevy Duramax using a Equal-I-zer WDH/sway control. I also move the trailer about 10 miles from storage to home and back using just the ball. I've run the trailer on the expressway to the dealer several tines-about 30 miles-hooked up to the ball only. There is a difference between equal I zer and ball only, but I'm not sure how much--I feel no stability or sway problems without it. The 30 tongue wt. about 880# and that just does not squat the rear much at all. I'm sure the sway control helps in wind and passing trucks, but I would not hesitate traveling with the ball only if I forgot and left the WDH at home (dumb thought) or the thing somehow broke while traveling. I'm sure the tougher the driving conditions get, ie crosswinds etc. the more wt. distribution/sway control hitches pay for themselves. Early on several members strongly recommended the Hensley or ProPride hitch. After driving in some pretty bad winds with the equal I zer, I see no need to spend that kind of money. The cam or friction types work just great on a trailer built to follow you like an arrow. (Just how I feel, most believe you must never leave home without it.)

Howard

[xrvr]

I stand by my statement including the one about a real truck. Wd is not always the way to go unless you just feel more comfortable going along with the crowd. Sway control is a good idea and is important. Jim

[dannydimitt]

Originally Posted by ibskot

I have a brake control.
People who pull campers say I need one. I just can't figure out why. I don't understand how they distribute the weight. The attachment from trailer to truck is still with the single hitch slot. You know of a source That could educate me? The lady that sold me one just got me more confused. What makes a camper need one and similar weight "non camper type" not?
Thanks

We just completed an 11,000 mile trip up through Canada to Alaska and back pulling an Airstream with a 2003 2500 Dodge diesel with only the ball and a single sway bar . The trailer towed perfectly under all conditions , from gravel roads to 75 mph interstate travel with horrible cross winds. The truck was loaded fairly heavy with extra tires and wheels "that were never needed"
as well as a generator and a 90 gallon fuel tank in the bed. Of coarse we had all sorts of plunder in the trailer for our 2 month journey . The dodge was running 10 ply rating tires with 80 pounds of air.
In the past I tried pulling our 66 Land Yacht with a half ton travelall without a WD hitch , That was a failure due to the standard load 35 pound tires on the TV. Hooked up the WD hitch and it towed perfectly.
If you do use the WD hitch make sure yo have only the lighter weight bars or you could destroy the tongue of your trailer while going through a dip , gully , or simply getting into a gas station . Have fun with your trailer .

[dannydimitt]

Originally Posted by zigzagguzzi

I stand by my statement including the one about a real truck. Wd is not always the way to go unless you just feel more comfortable going along with the crowd. Sway control is a good idea and is important. Jim

That's right !

[ROBERT CROSS]

"Wd is not always the way to go unless you just feel more comfortable going along with the crowd. Sway control is a good idea and is important." Jim


Proud in the crowd I am, still trying to find out what a 'real' truck is though.

Stream Safe, Jim

on edit....I forgot no more AS, sorry.


Bob

[dannydimitt]

Originally Posted by ROBERT CROSS

"Wd is not always the way to go unless you just feel more comfortable going along with the crowd. Sway control is a good idea and is important." Jim


Proud in the crowd I am, still trying to find out what a 'real' truck is though.

Stream Safe, Jim


Bob

That would be a long nose Pete

[tkowalyk]

Originally Posted by Inland RV Center, In

With your SUPER HEAVY DUTY tow vehicle, you should only use 600 pound bars. The 1000 pound bars will transfer considerable road shock to the trailer, that in time, will cause many different and expensive damages. Airstream trailers, MUST have a soft ride, or else. That includes having torsion axles that still have good rubber rods in them. Andy

Andy,

We tow our 2013 27 Classic with our 2007 Dodge Durango (5.7 Hemi, rated at 8,950 towing capacity and about 1,700 payload) with a Reese dual cam with 800 lb bars.

We had this set up for our 25 Classic. We did have to adjust the cams, and move up one chain link to get the trailer level.

Do you think the 800 lb bars are right for our current set up?

We have went on several short and a few long trip (2000 miles).

Always respect your opinion.

Thanks,

Tom

[MrUKToad]

Originally Posted by zigzagguzzi

I stand by my statement including the one about a real truck. Wd is not always the way to go unless you just feel more comfortable going along with the crowd. Sway control is a good idea and is important. Jim

I can't think of a situation where WD isn't advantageous. Spread the load, people, spread the load.

[overlander63]

I've towed the same Airstreams with the shop's dually, with and without WD, and the difference is very noticeable. Not just the same length, but the exact trailer. the ride was more stable with the WD bars in place.

[Howard L.]

Originally Posted by MrUKToad

I can't think of a situation where WD isn't advantageous. Spread the load, people, spread the load.

I don't mean to disagree, in fact I'm not. But, I do have a question. Aren't we placing more weight on the trailer when we hook up the bars to the a frame 30 inches behind the ball. Aren't we in fact using the trailer to lift the back of the truck? Aren't I taking on some weight of the wheelbarrow when I pick up on the handles to shift some weight forward? Physics tells me if the WDH is lifting the TV rear and transferring some weight to the front axle, some weight is transferred to the trailer axles also. Am I right? If so, is that not a negative offsetting some amount of the weight transfer positive? Is that part of why stiff 1000 # bars can cause trailer damage? (that was more than one question wasn't it)

[dznf0g]

Yes, Howard, you are correct....I think the answer here is...if your TV manufacturer requires WD at a particular actual loaded tongue weight, you should have a WD system. The auto manufacturer has determined an excess of that spec has a negative effect on handling and some component(s) stress which must be relieved by proper distribution of of that tongue weight. (Actually we should call that receiver weight...including the weight of the hitch).

Even below that spec, I believe there are benefits to wd, but the mfr spec should be adhered to, IMO.

[rostam]

ibskot, you are not the only one that is not clear on how WDHs works! I have been confused as well. I found a diagram online that explained the forces involved, but could not fully understand it. I plan to take it to a mechanical engineer friend of mine, and have him explain it to me.

I have also heard from some people that WDHs may not be necessary (most people say its mandatory though). It is a bit confusing, because we are told in order to have stability the tongue weight must be heavy (10% to 15% of the total trailer weight). Then we are told because the tongue is heavy, we must use a WDH to spread it to TV's front axle and trailer's axles.

First, modern WDHs weigh 200# to 300#. Aren't we just worsening the problem by adding another 200# to 300# to the tongue? Can't we just not use WDHs and make the tongue lighter so we do not have to use WDH? Isn't this a self made problem?

Second, can WDH even transfer the 200# to 300# it weights to TV/Trailer axles? I really like to see CAT scale measurements to see the effectiveness of WDH in distributing the weight. In another RV forum, people had mixed experience with weight distribution.

Third, Lets assume WDH transfers the weight as it is advertised. Transferring weight to TV's front axle or trailer's axles may not be feasible if they are already at their max rating. Using a WDH then simply moves the problem: instead of overloading TV's rear axle, we now overload TV's front axle and trailer's axles. Doesn't this point to the TV being inadequate for the trailer we are trying to tow?

Fourth, many newer vehicles have self leveling suspension and trailer stability control built it (I am not clear how this sway control feature works). Doesn't this eliminate the need for WDH/sway control?

Last, I know that many European cars do not recommend using WDH or have the same tow/hitch ratings with and without WDH used. What is the difference between American and European cars? Could it be that the effectivness of WDHs/sway control are exaggerated?

Looking forward to your responses!

[dznf0g]

Originally Posted by rostam

ibskot, you are not the only one that is not clear on how WDHs works! I have been confused as well. I found a diagram online that explained the forces involved, but could not fully understand it. I plan to take it to a mechanical engineer friend of mine, and have him explain it to me.

I have also heard from some people that WDHs may not be necessary (most people say its mandatory though). It is a bit confusing, because we are told in order to have stability the tongue weight must be heavy (10% to 15% of the total trailer weight). Then we are told because the tongue is heavy, we must use a WDH to spread it to TV's front axle and trailer's axles.

First, modern WDHs weigh 200# to 300#. Aren't we just worsening the problem by adding another 200# to 300# to the tongue? Can't we just not use WDHs and make the tongue lighter so we do not have to use WDH? Isn't this a self made problem?

Second, can WDH even transfer the 200# to 300# it weights to TV/Trailer axles? I really like to see CAT scale measurements to see the effectiveness of WDH in distributing the weight. In another RV forum, people had mixed experience with weight distribution.

Third, Lets assume WDH transfers the weight as it is advertised. Transferring weight to TV's front axle or trailer's axles may not be feasible if they are already at their max rating. Using a WDH then simply moves the problem: instead of overloading TV's rear axle, we now overload TV's front axle and trailer's axles. Doesn't this point to the TV being inadequate for the trailer we are trying to tow?

Fourth, many newer vehicles have self leveling suspension and trailer stability control built it (I am not clear how this sway control feature works). Doesn't this eliminate the need for WDH/sway control?

Last, I know that many European cars do not recommend using WDH or have the same tow/hitch ratings with and without WDH used. What is the difference between American and European cars? Could it be that the effectivness of WDHs/sway control are exaggerated?

Looking forward to your responses!

1) Yes, you should have a minimum of 10% of the trailer weight as tongue weight. Remember you are not moving mass...only the effect of that mass on the front of the trailer and rear of the TV.

2) Most modern WD do NOT weigh 200 - 300#s. A hensley weighs about 190#s and most are around 100#s, or a little less. There are CAT scale tickets on many of the hitch threads here. Use the search function for study. Yes, many of the WD systems will easily move 300#s (150ish to trailer axle(s) and 150ish to the TV front axle....more if you had to). Some brands have trouble moving much at all. Do your homework brand by brand when deciding how much WD you need.

3) True, but if you are already that near the max for the trailer and TV axle, you have bigger issues to address.

4) Stablilty control and electronic TV sway control do not replace WD. WD and hitch sway control can help prevent or prevent sway. The TV systems help control sway AFTER it starts.
Auto level control only makes the TV/trailer system LOOK level and balanced. It can actually mask an overloaded rear TV axle, as it does nothing to distribute weight. (OK, a tiny bit, as center of gravity will change a tiny bit forward with a leveled TV as opposed to a sagging rear TV.

5) It is not exaggerated. There is a lot of conjecture as to why european mfrs don't allow WD. I won't get into structural "brand wars" here, as they are volatile, but European caravans are very light and their weight distribution and axle placement is very different than North American trailers. I suspect they count on (require?) much lower speeds while trailering. Many here use WD on their European vehicles.

[Jim Lee]

Long time ago we pulled bumper pull cargo trailers. With a dual-wheeled tow vehicle (one ton or larger) we didn't used WD hitches. On 1 1/2 and larger vehicles (F500, C50 and larger) we used spring hitches-- with trailer axle leaf springs.

Without spring hitches the front of the trailers were subject to too much road heave and busted rivets and torn sheet metal.

I am glad I read this about the bars... I never knew the difference. I pulled an 18' flatbed trailer with our vintage school bus from Springfield MO to Chicago in 2011 for a McDonald's commercial and I used the big bars -- what are they 1200 lbs? The are curved at the chain end.



When I first got our AS in 2007 I used those big bars but they were awfully heavy to put on and off. I had set of light 700 bars so I use those and never really got the chains tight at 3 or 4 links.

Then, I switched from bias ply to radial tires which set lower. I had to lower my hitch and at 4 links the trailer rode high in the front. I told my wife I was going to find a set of medium bars to use. then I put the bars at 3 links and it rode level.

I was still thinking I wanted medium bars until I read the comments here. I'm going to be satisfied with what I got. I like the ride with the radials on the trailer.

[dannydimitt]

Originally Posted by Howard L.

I don't mean to disagree, in fact I'm not. But, I do have a question. Aren't we placing more weight on the trailer when we hook up the bars to the a frame 30 inches behind the ball. Aren't we in fact using the trailer to lift the back of the truck? Aren't I taking on some weight of the wheelbarrow when I pick up on the handles to shift some weight forward? Physics tells me if the WDH is lifting the TV rear and transferring some weight to the front axle, some weight is transferred to the trailer axles also. Am I right? If so, is that not a negative offsetting some amount of the weight transfer positive? Is that part of why stiff 1000 # bars can cause trailer damage? (that was more than one question wasn't it)

Yes the wd hitch adds weight to the trailer axles as well as the steering axle . The damage can and does occur when to much downward force is applied to the support chains on the WD hitch and can actually cause the tongue to buckle and fail at that point if your lucky , or cause the trailer frame to bend behind the front wall of the coach and destroy the entire front of the trailer.

[MrUKToad]

Originally Posted by dannydimitt

Yes the wd hitch adds weight to the trailer axles as well as the steering axle . The damage can and does occur when to much downward force is applied to the support chains on the WD hitch and can actually cause the tongue to buckle and fail at that point if your lucky , or cause the trailer frame to bend behind the front wall of the coach and destroy the entire front of the trailer.

I haven't come across tales of such drastic damage to trailers using WD systems, but I have heard a lot about overly rigid spring bars transferring a lot of the road vibration into the front of the trailer and loosening rivets to a serious degree. Those spring bars need a bit of flex in them to dampen things down a little. Similarly, very stiff rear springs on the TV can have the same effect.

[ibskot]

Originally Posted by moosetags

The hitch bar goes into the the receiver on the tow vehicle. The weight distribution bars on the WD hitch system are put under pressure on the trailer tongue bars. This puts a downward pressure on the front of the hitch bar in the receiver. This transfers some of the tongue weight through the receiver to the front axle of the tow vehicle.

Google "weight distribution trailer hitch systems". There is a good explanation under How Stuff Works.

As far as only campers needing WD, that is not correct. I was involved in towing very large boats (over 30' long, weighing 12,000#), and we would never consider towing without weight distribution and sway control.

Brian

Thanks for all the replies. I have been of site for a bit. We didn't buy the AS. When we got there it was not in the shape that the pix represented. We couldn't reach a new price so I walked. By looking at the tires I was actually afraid since they were so bad. I had prior understood them to be okay. With 4.5 hrs to drive and his price wasn't changing I want comfortable. I plan on taking the hitch back then rereading this thread to determine what I need. I fear that my setup isn't right at $300.
I did take notice of trucks pulling campers on the way down and back. Some use them and some don't. I am confused as to why camper pullers do and enclosed cat haulers don't.

[Larry C]

A WD hitch works exactly the same as a loaded wheelbarrow. You lift up on the handles and it transfers weight to the front wheels. Imagine the bars being the handles.....
Hope this helps