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Old 10-14-2007, 10:58 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by finalcutjoe
basically, there's a 480lb increase in the TV... but there were 6 more passengers, a 12ton bottle jack, pair of 8 ton jack stands, tool box, and a few other campsite accessories
It is hard to tell how much change you made because of the additional weight you added to the TV. I would stick to the configuration that you did your baseline with and see how much it has changed.
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Old 10-15-2007, 08:12 AM   #16
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Originally Posted by Inland RV Center, In
Adjusting the torsion bars, "is" how you move weight.

But again, when you have a "super heavy duty" tow vehicle, you make that task very difficult, if not impossible.

To help you understand, adjust the bars as high as you can, even if the front of the trailer is high and the rear of the tow vehicle is high. Then get some new weights.

You should see a change for the better. The the new problem becomes the hitch rating, and, the overload springs. Reducing the amount of overload springs will help tremendously.

Reducing the rating of the bars, will move weight, without having the rigidity.

But the first major step, is to do something about your tow vehicle.

Andy
what do you consider 'super heavy duty'?
my suburban is a 3/4 ton chassis. Super heavy duty would normally refer to a 4500 or heavier chassis…

I'm not sure you're understanding the configuration... the spring bars are set one notch shy of as high as they go... what do you mean 'set them as high as you can'?

overload springs? maybe you can tell us what those are?

reducing the bar rating? It's obvious there is no weight transfer with the spring bars at maximum leverage... If in fact the HD chassis is resisting the weight transfer- what exactly would reducing the spring bar rating do?

relieve the rigidity? so... lighter rated spring bars have a different modulus of elasticity?

You're obviously an old timer, here at the forums.. so I was refraining from flaming your original post... but its apparent you really don't know what you're talking about.
Perhaps you can stop being part of the problem, and provide some constructive advice without all the inflammatory remarks, and obvious Reese brand promotion.
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Old 10-15-2007, 08:22 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by uwe
Not, You're forgetting the tongue weight of the trailer. It is part of the rear axle weight. Might be over 800lbs in the case of a 30ft trailer. Probably more.
the burbs dry axles are:
steer 3072
drive 2724

after loading for travel:
steer 3640 +568
drive 5000 +2276

i have to assume the extra 2276 on the drive axle includes the full tongue weight (1050 dry for my coach)

the hitch is setup per equalizers exact specs... (using their formula for setting the ball height) when I hooked up the coach, without the spring bars, it (the suburban) was nearly the same (levelness) as when I did load the spring bars (you can see that from the original weight... only an extra 80lbs to the steer axle)

so, in that case... I figure, since I can't load the spring bars anymore than they are.. it must be the ball height or angle that will allow more torque transfer.. right?
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Old 10-15-2007, 08:57 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by finalcutjoe
the burbs dry axles are:
steer 3072
drive 2724

after loading for travel:
steer 3640 +568
drive 5000 +2276

i have to assume the extra 2276 on the drive axle includes the full tongue weight (1050 dry for my coach)

the hitch is setup per equalizers exact specs... (using their formula for setting the ball height) when I hooked up the coach, without the spring bars, it (the suburban) was nearly the same (levelness) as when I did load the spring bars (you can see that from the original weight... only an extra 80lbs to the steer axle)

so, in that case... I figure, since I can't load the spring bars anymore than they are.. it must be the ball height or angle that will allow more torque transfer.. right?
I'm almost certain there will be someone that will dispute this, but yes, tilting the "head" of the hitch so the ball moves out from the tow vehicle will allow more weight transfer toward the front of the TV. What it does, is allow you to put more load on the bars.
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Old 10-15-2007, 09:33 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by finalcutjoe
the burbs dry axles are:
steer 3072
drive 2724

after loading for travel:
steer 3640 +568
drive 5000 +2276

i have to assume the extra 2276 on the drive axle includes the full tongue weight (1050 dry for my coach)

the hitch is setup per equalizers exact specs... (using their formula for setting the ball height) when I hooked up the coach, without the spring bars, it (the suburban) was nearly the same (levelness) as when I did load the spring bars (you can see that from the original weight... only an extra 80lbs to the steer axle)

so, in that case... I figure, since I can't load the spring bars anymore than they are.. it must be the ball height or angle that will allow more torque transfer.. right?
Time for pictures.
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Old 10-15-2007, 09:50 AM   #20
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I too am going through this set up. I have an EQ hitch as well.
For me the angle of the hitch head was important in trying to transfer the tongue weight of the trailer off of the rear axel of our 3/4 ton Suburban. I am using 7 washers at the hitch head and my L shape brackets are ajusted to 3 1/2 holes from the top. In other words you can see 3 1/2 holes from the top.
I was only using 5 washers and my bars were pointing up from the ball looking back torwards the trailer. I now have a level ride and my distribution bars are level with the A frame of the trailer. I used a tape measure to assure overall spring compression. I am now only an 1/8 of an inch front, and 1/2 inch rear spring compression on the TV and the trailer sits about a 1/4 inch lower in the front Versus back. Last, don't forget to torque the small screw below the hitch head when hitched.
Good luck with yours.
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Old 10-15-2007, 10:03 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by subfan1
I too am going through this set up. I have an EQ hitch as well.
For me the angle of the hitch head was important in trying to transfer the tongue weight of the trailer off of the rear axel of our 3/4 ton Suburban. I am using 7 washers at the hitch head and my L shape brackets are ajusted to 3 1/2 holes from the top. In other words you can see 3 1/2 holes from the top.
I was only using 5 washers and my bars were pointing up from the ball looking back torwards the trailer. I now have a level ride and my distribution bars are level with the A frame of the trailer. I used a tape measure to assure overall spring compression. I am now only an 1/8 of an inch front, and 1/2 inch rear spring compression on the TV and the trailer sits about a 1/4 inch lower in the front Versus back. Last, don't forget to torque the small screw below the hitch head when hitched.
Good luck with yours.
i'm not sure about the washer fix... is that just to fine tune the ball height, because of the rough sets on the shank? that is, the spacing on the shank holes moves the ball an inch at a time, the washers give you fractional adjustment?
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Old 10-15-2007, 10:06 AM   #22
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subfan;
been to the scales yet? I'ld be interested in your weights, as another burb man, that is.
and Joe, I hope you make the final cut!
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Old 10-15-2007, 10:09 AM   #23
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subfan;
been to the scales yet? I'ld be interested in your weights, as another burb man, that is.
and Joe, I hope you make the final cut!
ha!
thanks,
i've got to get this in line before my next 4000+ mile trek in two weeks...
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Old 10-15-2007, 10:27 AM   #24
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The washer adjustment has to do with the angle of the hitch head which is used to transfer weight, it is not used for adjusting hitch height. As you noted in your response, that is what the big holes are for on the shank.

I have not been to the scales yet, I wanted to make my adjustments using the tape measure first. I don't have a scale close by otherwise, that would be my next stop.

I fine tuned my adjustments last week-end at Beckmans parking lot then took the trailer in for service. Getting ready for Thanksgiving week-end trip to Palm Springs.
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Old 10-15-2007, 11:15 AM   #25
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Joe,

I have run your numbers through the handy-dandy Crowhurst hitch calculator and came up with the following observations:

By my calculations, you have about 1700# tension in the bars in the first case. This is transfering 700# from your rear axle, adding 490# to the steer axle and 210# to the trailer axle.

The weight distribution is 61% drive axle/39% steer axle.

In the second case you have about 3000# of tension in the bars, and you are unloading about 1260# from the rear axle, adding 880# to the front and 380# to the trailer axle. In this case you are transferring a good deal of passenger and cargo weight off the axle in addition to the tongue weight.

The weight distribution in the second case is 58% drive/42% steer.

(note: bar tension is not the same as bar ratings, 3000#bar tension does not exceed the rating of 1200# bars. 1200# bars are for 1200# tongue weight.)

I agree that you have barely changed the weight distribution in your tow vehicle, even though you have really cranked the bars up. I think the reason you are having trouble getting the axle weights more balanced is the weight you have added as cargo and passengers.

Have you considered taking along another vehicle? Maybe you can unload some of the weight by putting the kids in their own car. I think this would be a good idea as you are over the rated GCWR of your tow vehicle.

But it's your call. I just run the numbers.
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Old 10-15-2007, 12:47 PM   #26
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hi fc'

the 30 with slide is a porker on 2 axles...

don't rely on the factory reported tongue weight,

i'd wager YOUR tongue is over 1400 lbs and perhaps 1500...

after filling with propane and loading the unit.

so

1. scale the trailer and tongue un hitched and level.

IF you have time at the scale, moving cargo INSIDE the trailer and reweighting...

MIGHT lighten the tongue some.

as already stated THERE AREN'T ANY OVERLOAD SPRINGS on your tv...

IF the tongue mass is as expected the w/d bars are UNDER rated.

all the bending in the world will not increase the redistribution IF the bars are maxxed out.

reducing your hitch rating and bars to 750lbs when the tongue is nearly twice that weight is just CRAZY dumb...

without a 3500 or 4500 tow vehicle with dualies.

2. consider HIGHER rated w/d bars...

i realize they aren't easily interchangeable and the entire HITCH may be under rated.

that's one of the many advantanges to the haha, all the w/d bars fit one hitch

and the 'no sway' feature is unaffected by spring bars or their adjustments.

3. you can/might also consider UPGRADING the sub's rear suspension...

by adding an assist spring package.

no this doesn't increase the axle rating but it can help redistribute the tongue mass some.

the 30 slide model really needs a class 5 set up and a "beefier" 3/4 ton mule.

cheers
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Old 10-15-2007, 01:29 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Inland RV Center, In

Your hitch rating should be dropped to no more than 750 pounds.

However, because of the hitch rating you have, you will find that the front of the trailer and rear end of your tow vehicle, will no longer be level, but instead will be high. Not a good thing.

Andy
What is the "hitch rating"? The weight carrying capacity of the hitch? Would I be correct in my thinking a WD hitch will change the apparent tongue weight depending on it's setting?
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Old 10-15-2007, 01:52 PM   #28
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finalcutjoe,

I don't have anything to add to this discussion, but I do have a question. What is the weight rating for your front and rear axles?

Bill
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