WD Bars: How Do You Lift Them????

[Chuck]

put a block under the jack leg? not enough travel on mine, otherwise.

[HowieE]

Have you considered the towing limits of the Chrysler 300 as per manufactures recommendations?

It is not a problem of weight transfer.

You have one unsafe system there.

[mstephens]

Originally Posted by Chuck

put a block under the jack leg? not enough travel on mine, otherwise.

Oh, I've got plenty of travel on the jack. I just don't want to life the car's rear wheels off the pavement! And, I assume the jack was made for lifting the 1000 pound tongue of the trailer, not that PLUS a 4500 pound car!

I feel like I must be doing something wrong procedurally. Lots of people have WD bars. To be effective, they need to carry a heck of a lot of load, and that takes a lot of force to get hooked up.

[ROBERTSUNRUS]

Originally Posted by mstephens

Thanks....
The biggest problem right now is a physical one...how on earth to get the bars up higher? I am at the limit of what the tongue jack can do. Surely this must be a common problem for any WD bar setup? Right? How do people lift the bars to get a lot of WD?

Hi, with my Eqal-i-zer brand hitch, my tongue jack will raise my set-up high enough for me to push my spring bars into place by hand. You might consider driving your tow vehicle's rear wheels onto blocks and may also need to add a block under you tongue jack. Your chains should snap in place easily. You could use something like Lynx leveler blocks, which you might need to carry anyhow.

[gmw photos]

Mark,
What I am suggesting about restoring front axle weight is that I would have guessed ( key word here fro me is "guess" ) would be that restoring the front axle to 100% would be a good starting point. If you are trying to go to a siginificant higher load on the front, then I could see that could make snapping the bars up more difficult. You are essentially having to "preload" the front suspension of the car with all that weight, connect the bars, then lower the trailer "onto" the bars.
Is it considered normal to restore more than 100% front axle load on these car setups that CanAm does ?

[gmw photos]

Originally Posted by HowieE

Have you considered the towing limits of the Chrysler 300 as per manufactures recommendations?

It is not a problem of weight transfer.

You have one unsafe system there.

Will all due respect, can we just keep the focus of this thread on trying to help the OP with the issue of connecting his weight distributing hitch ?

His setting up of this car to pull this trailer has been covered in depth in other threads, and it is safe to say he has done a lot of homework, and a lot of work on this. If you read his other threads, you'll see all the effort that has gone into it.

[hshovic]

I have 3/4 ton Chevy and a 25' Safari. with a Reese WD.
I just lift the tongue with the jack a bit, and the bar chains slip on the hooks very easily. And off very easily. Could it be possible that your vehicle hitch is so low it cannot work properly?

[Silver Goose]

Originally Posted by mstephens

Oh, I've got plenty of travel on the jack. I just don't want to life the car's rear wheels off the pavement! And, I assume the jack was made for lifting the 1000 pound tongue of the trailer, not that PLUS a 4500 pound car! ...

If you have the standard Barker jack that Airstream installs on the trailers, it is rated at 3000# which may be more than the combination of your tongue weight and rear vehicle weight at the bumper. I have successfully used it to raise the rear of my Expedition off the ground to change a rear tire. If you find you need to raise the rear of the 300 that high to attach the chains, be sure to chock some wheels. Assuming the receiver is rated to exceed the amount of weight you are putting on it, be watchful where it is attached to your TV. Hopefully there is sufficient reinforcement at the mounting points. We realize there is a lot of stress on the receiver and it's attachment and many of us make a point of looking at things under there on a regular basis for loose hardware, cracks in welds, etc.

[HowieE]

Originally Posted by gmw photos

His setting up of this car to pull this trailer has been covered in depth in other threads, and it is safe to say he has done a lot of homework, and a lot of work on this. If you read his other threads, you'll see all the effort that has gone into it.

If you would be so kind as to post a link to that tread I will read it.

I have sent him a PM regarding the brake away cable, the safety chains, umbilical wiring, and the routing of the umbilical cable. Issues that prompted my comment.

[Sbb]

I mostly travel alone, I am female and not as strong as a guy, so my rv guy welded my pipe to a longer one ( total length about 3' 5" ) which makes lifting a breeze for me. I drive a 2013 2500 suburban and have a bambi, my car however is loaded when I travel( work related cargo). The long bar saves me.

[m.hony]

I jack up the truck and trailer with the tongue jack.
Weight bars go on real easy with just hand effort.
I have jacked the truck and trailer till the jack reached the end of its travel.

[mstephens]

Originally Posted by gmw photos

Mark,
What I am suggesting about restoring front axle weight is that I would have guessed ( key word here fro me is "guess" ) would be that restoring the front axle to 100% would be a good starting point. If you are trying to go to a siginificant higher load on the front, then I could see that could make snapping the bars up more difficult. You are essentially having to "preload" the front suspension of the car with all that weight, connect the bars, then lower the trailer "onto" the bars.
Is it considered normal to restore more than 100% front axle load on these car setups that CanAm does ?

OK, all. I have made a mistake in my weighing. I DID NOT DO A WEIGHT W/O THE WD ATTACHED. So, when I am not saying that I am only getting 200# of WD, that's probably wrong. I only weight the car with no TT, then I weighed the car with TT and WD. Since my car only front weighed 2300, and now with WD weighs 2500, I assumed the effect of WD was 200#.

GMW has pointed out my error. I needed to get a weight with no WD, which would probably show my front as LESS than 2300#, and therefore my REAL WD is probably much higher than 200#.

ME<----BIG DUMMY HERE!

Thanks GMW.

[SSquared]

I wonder if you have reached the limit of what to expect with 1000 pound bars.

I now use an EAZ-Lift Elite and get my front axle to about 200 pounds more than what the tow vehicle has when not hooked up (but I don't have a full set of tickets with the current hitch). I'm using 1400 pound bars.

Previously I used a different brand hitch with 1000 pound bars. I could easily get my front axle to 100% of it's unhitched weight. That sometimes felt squirrely, so I tried to get one chain link tighter. I couldn't do it until I put the jack down on a big stack of blocks. Then I lifted the back of the car a *lot*, and got one more chain link. I didn't have to lift the tow vehicle back end off the ground, but it was scary how high I was going. So think about 1400 pound bars.

Also, how much rotational flex on the hitch head are you getting when you drop the trailer on the ball, and when you are all hitched up with the jack retracted? My vehicle had a real problem in this area until I had Andy T. weld on some reinforcement. With too much flex, you won't get the weight distribution that you would normally get.

Good luck.

[mstephens]

Originally Posted by HowieE

If you would be so kind as to post a link to that tread I will read it.

I have sent him a PM regarding the brake away cable, the safety chains, umbilical wiring, and the routing of the umbilical cable. Issues that prompted my comment.

I didn't get that PM Howie.

[mstephens]

Originally Posted by SSquared

I wonder if you have reached the limit of what to expect with 1000 pound bars.

I now use an EAZ-Lift Elite and get my front axle to about 200 pounds more than what the tow vehicle has when not hooked up (but I don't have a full set of tickets with the current hitch). I'm using 1400 pound bars.

Previously I used a different brand hitch with 1000 pound bars. I could easily get my front axle to 100% of it's unhitched weight. That sometimes felt squirrely, so I tried to get one chain link tighter. I couldn't do it until I put the jack down on a big stack of blocks. Then I lifted the back of the car a *lot*, and got one more chain link. I didn't have to lift the tow vehicle back end off the ground, but it was scary how high I was going. So think about 1400 pound bars.

Also, how much rotational flex on the hitch head are you getting when you drop the trailer on the ball, and when you are all hitched up with the jack retracted? My vehicle had a real problem in this area until I had Andy T. weld on some reinforcement. With too much flex, you won't get the weight distribution that you would normally get.

Good luck.

My front axle with no trailer was 2300#. With the most WD I can apply - what I called the scary high lift - I got my front axle to 2500#. That's what I thought was "200# of WD." But I was wrong, because I didn't weight the rig with no WD first to see how LOW the front axle weight would become. Apparently, less than 2300#.

So, maybe I have all the WD I can expect to have, or even SHOULD have.

We have the hitch head tilted back about 12 degrees or so.

My alarm here in this thread was that I though this "200#" I had was too little. I thought I need another 100# or even more, and I couldn't figure out how on earth I would get the car high enough to do that. Well, I probably have all the WD I need. But, I will now go back and get a weight with no WD applied.

Big panic over my own stupidity!

[helmsman]

Hello mstephens:

I'm sure I don't know what I'm talking about with this problem you've got. I've only pulled my airstream using similar Reese bars for over 40 years.

Looking at the photo you supplied, it appears your hitch receiver is low to the ground and you have raised the ball height quite a bit to get it level. Your bars remain low to the ground therefor your chains don't reach.

My guess is you might need to lengthen your chains. You can only tension the arc distance the latch will travel, unless you raise the rear of the vehicle. I believe you are attempting that fix.

You seem to believe you need more tension than your getting and I suggest you give Eaz-Lift a phone call for their advice.

Good luck -- Don

[MrUKToad]

Originally Posted by mstephens

Big panic over my own stupidity!

Well, we've all been there!

[gmw photos]

Originally Posted by mstephens

My front axle with no trailer was 2300#. With the most WD I can apply - what I called the scary high lift - I got my front axle to 2500#. That's what I thought was "200# of WD." But I was wrong, because I didn't weight the rig with no WD first to see how LOW the front axle weight would become. Apparently, less than 2300#.

So, maybe I have all the WD I can expect to have, or even SHOULD have.

We have the hitch head tilted back about 12 degrees or so.

My alarm here in this thread was that I though this "200#" I had was too little. I thought I need another 100# or even more, and I couldn't figure out how on earth I would get the car high enough to do that. Well, I probably have all the WD I need. But, I will now go back and get a weight with no WD applied.

Big panic over my own stupidity!

And what I am saying is that if the unloaded car has a steer axle weight of 2300, that would be my goal in setting WD....to get the front back to 2300.

The two concerns I would have about running more than 2300 on the front is, one, the car is designed to have an "understeer gradient" when pushed hard ( past it's limits ) into a corner. In other words, it should "push", or slide the front tires slightly. By running the car front heavy ( more than 2300 pounds on the steer axle in this case ) you may induce the handling to being one of oversteer ( rear tires break loose before the front tires do....or so called "loose" ). An oversteer situation with a trailer in tow is likely going to get ugly real quick.
The other issue I see as bad is it's going to be hard on the front suspension of the car to be running heavier than it is designed for.

Now....having said all that, I welcome some of the resident engineers to jump in here and correct my mistakes or otherwise throw water on my ideas.

[mstephens]

I see two competing ideas. One idea, get the car's f/r weight ratio back to the original 51%. The other is to restore the front weight back to 2300.

The car alone was 2300F/2180R = 51% front.

With my current level of WD I have: 2500F/2740R = 48% front.

I mistakenly was after making the front 51% again, or 2672F/2567R.
Now, that would take another 172# on the front! I think I would have to jack the car up about 9 feet to get that figure! Not going to happen.

If all I have to get is the original weight, that's a piece of cake.

[HowieE]

There is no single formula or ration when setting up a WD hitch. There are too many variables to consider to allow that.

What you want is to return the front axle to at least it's original steering geometry or slightly lower. Overloading the front axle just to meet a ration may result in completely misalignment of the front end and excess tire wear.

Now that said the other limiting factor is can this be accomplished and still have the rear axle within manufactures limits and the TV riding at a relative good position. If one has not exceeded the load limits on the rear axle helper spring, air bags or air shocks may be considered to accomplish this.