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Old 10-15-2014, 08:51 AM   #1065
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Originally Posted by Pahaska View Post
I tried, but the way the bar is twisted, I could not get a photo that was worth posting. In the photos, you could barely see that it was not straight, yet the pin hole is distorted to the point that a pin will not go through.
Thanks for trying. I get the picture, so to speak, from your explanation.

Ken
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Old 10-15-2014, 12:56 PM   #1066
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Question. Should the safety cable to the trailer emergency brake be shorter than the safety chains. I recently left my hitch pin out on my Equalizer head and I got a couple of blocks from home and when straightening out of a slow turn the head pulled out and dragged on the bottom of the equalizer shank. I guess I hits the brakes and the trailer hit my TV. If the emergency brake pin had pull then maybe the trailer would have stopped without it hitting the Tundra bumper via the power jack. Had to replace the power jack, got some dents in the propane cover and a dent in the Tundra bumper.

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Old 10-15-2014, 01:02 PM   #1067
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Originally Posted by KJRitchie View Post
Question. Should the safety cable to the trailer emergency brake be shorter than the safety chains. I recently left my hitch pin out on my Equalizer head and I got a couple of blocks from home and when straightening out of a slow turn the head pulled out and dragged on the bottom of the equalizer shank. I guess I hits the brakes and the trailer hit my TV. If the emergency brake pin had pull then maybe the trailer would have stopped without it hitting the Tundra bumper via the power jack. Had to replace the power jack, got some dents in the propane cover and a dent in the Tundra bumper.

Kelvin
That is a good idea.. unless when turning you engage the AS brakes... All things considered, I think I would have the brake cable just a tad longer than the 'emergency' chains.

I wonder, tho... if you hit the brakes, why did the AS not also apply brakes since the umbilical was still attached? Did you have the brakes turned 'down' or 'off'?

Maybe you need to verify that your AS brakes are actually working? If there is a 'delay' in activating the AS brakes, can you reduce the delay?
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Old 10-15-2014, 02:02 PM   #1068
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I have hydraulic brakes and there is a little delay but it doesn't seem to be an issue when stopping abruptly. Maybe the trailer hit the truck before I hit the brakes. It happened so fast and I was probably going less than 20 mph coming out of a 90 deg turn out of my neighborhood. The shank did leave a long gouge in the asphalt having driven by the site since then. Maybe when the chains were pulled tight they pulled the trailer towards the Tundra. Would've been neat if someone had videoed the event to see what really happened. I wish this would've happened in my drive way but I was able to turn 90deg left out of the driveway, turn 90deg right to the next street, drive a 100 yards, then 90deg left and straight for 100 yards then 90 deg right and then straight for 300 yards to the final 90deg left turn which pulled out the head.

What a brain fart.

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Old 10-15-2014, 02:28 PM   #1069
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I prefer to keep the brake cable longer than the chains. As long as the chains are hooked up I want to have some level of control, not tied to a locked tire trailer that may force me to stop in harms way.

2nd hand story - hitch jumps off the ball on I-10 in rush hour traffic and the trailer/truck comes to a screeching halt causing mass pandimonium, driver puts pin back in and uses the chains to pull the trailer to the shoulder.

I accept that others think differently but this way makes the most sense to me.
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Old 10-15-2014, 08:52 PM   #1070
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Originally Posted by HiHoAgRV View Post
I prefer to keep the brake cable longer than the chains. As long as the chains are hooked up I want to have some level of control, not tied to a locked tire trailer that may force me to stop in harms way.

2nd hand story - hitch jumps off the ball on I-10 in rush hour traffic and the trailer/truck comes to a screeching halt causing mass pandimonium, driver puts pin back in and uses the chains to pull the trailer to the shoulder.

I accept that others think differently but this way makes the most sense to me.
Hi, I also think that I would only want the trailer brakes to come on,
on total disconnect.
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Old 10-17-2014, 08:05 PM   #1071
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How much WD tension compared to others?

I see from Pharm's post from a few days ago ("... I once tried 5.5 inches with alot of stuff in my truck for a trip and just thought I would give it a shot and see if it made things a tad less bumpy or harsh...and I quickly pulled over on the next highway exit as it felt downright loose and WEIRD....) that using a ProPride does not mean you don't need WD, even though the anti-sway geometry works regardless of the WD tension.

Is there any agreement, however, on whether the amount of WD tension you need is different with the PP vs. other hitches? I'm currently using a EAZLift on a GMC Yukon, but thinking about a ProPride. With the EAZLift, I crank the bars really tight, because it makes the rig feel better than if I run at 100% FALR.

On the one hand, the stability provided by the PP might mean I need less WD. On the other hand, the PP means more tongue weight, and the weight has a longer lever arm behind the rear of the car, so that might mean I need more WD.

What do you think? Does PP mean more WD forces, or less?

Does anybody have scale tickets from a Yukon (short wheelbase) or Tahoe with a PP? Do you run above or below 100% FALR?
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Old 10-18-2014, 04:20 PM   #1072
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Is there any agreement, however, on whether the amount of WD tension you need is different with the PP vs. other hitches? I'm currently using a EAZLift on a GMC Yukon, but thinking about a ProPride. With the EAZLift, I crank the bars really tight, because it makes the rig feel better than if I run at 100% FALR.

On the one hand, the stability provided by the PP might mean I need less WD. On the other hand, the PP means more tongue weight, and the weight has a longer lever arm behind the rear of the car, so that might mean I need more WD.
For your TV/TT combination and a given TV tongue weight, the added length of the PP (assumed to be 12") might cause the load removed from the TV's front axle to be about 20% greater than with a conventional hitch.

The added hitch load due to the extra weight of the PP (assumed to be 120#) might cause an additional front axle load decrease of about 10%.

The combined effect of added PP length and PP added weight is to increase the
amount of load removed from the TV's front axle by about 32% (for a given TT tongue weight).

On the plus side -- the PP's added length would make your TV/TT about 4% more "efficient" at restoring load to the front axle.

Therefore, with your TV/TT, to achieve 100% FALR when using the PP would require a WD bar load increase of approximately 28% relative to using a hitch without the added length of 12".

Ron
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Old 10-18-2014, 06:41 PM   #1073
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Perhaps that explains why Sean at ProPride recommended 1400# w.d. bars for our Ram 1500/25' Airstream. Many have suggested those are way to heavy a w.d. bar for our rig.

It distributes the weight as needed and provides a good ride (which may be aided by the coil spring Ram rear suspension). We like the setup very much, so much I think folks may tire of me recommending it.
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Old 10-18-2014, 08:27 PM   #1074
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Had the EZYLIFT and moved to PP. 1400#bars.

Our AS (34' 3 axle) handles much better now. Wind issues manageable to point my wife can tow in comfort. It is about the safety factor for us.

I will monitor closely as anything can fail. As for the WD vs Sway question, the WD is a separate discussion and fun tion of the PP. More or less tension, same lack of sway. It just doesn't.
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Old 10-18-2014, 08:39 PM   #1075
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Ssquared - I'm not an engineer - I have no idea if this makes sense or not....

I think we're looking at 2 different functions - sway control (SC) and weight distribution (WD).

It seems to me (Sean would know for sure) the SC is a result of the trapezoidal 4-point "box" created by the mechanism on the hitch and is entirely separate from WD (affected by tightening or loosening the WD jacks).

I've often wondered if one's tow vehicle required zero FALR, could one use the PP without the WD jacks entirely?

(Edit)

Regardless, if you need to restore X% to the front axle, you can dial that in EXACTLY with the WD jacks on the PP - no more, no less than you need.
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Old 10-18-2014, 09:11 PM   #1076
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WD tension compared to EAZLift

Thanks Ron, for doing the math.

I actually run now at more than 100% FALR. I didn't get a tongue weight last time at the scales, but my Yukon axle weights were:
Yukon solo: Front 3060, Rear 3260
With trailer and WD applied: Front 3280, Rear 3860.

So I'm adding 220 to the front, 600 to the rear. So if I changed to ProPride, adjusted for 100% FALR, it could be in the same ballpark for amount of WD tension. The question would be, would the Yukon feel squirrely with the ProPride set up this way.....I guess not.

BTW, I care about amount of WD tension because of the flex I see in my trailer: my front outside compartment door is jammed tight when the bars are hooked up, and the inside doors on the under-bed compartments are also slightly cock-eyed.
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Old 10-19-2014, 09:11 AM   #1077
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PharmGeek View Post
goto, the concept of the wheel wells is therefore:

1) measure height from ground to wheel well unhitched
2) Hitch up and crank up the WD jacks to X height
3) measure again the wheel well height from ground....
4) adjust WD jack to make the wheel well match #1

That should in theory then get steering back to what it was without the trailer hitched up....

That is the principle anyway as I understand.
Okay after reading this (complete thread) I can say for sure there is one hell of a lot of info here and most of it points around the fact that 4.5 - 6.5" is the running consensus on cranking up your WD jacks....

I don't have access to my trailer right now (in storage in south) but I do have access to my measuring stick I use to set my WD jacks and it tells me i'm cranking up 9"! - So worth this I'm mind I think I'm doing something wrong.....

First let me backup and articulate what i'm doing to arrive at the 9" and maybe someone can tell me what i'm doing wrong.

- My TV is a 2015 F150 and I'm pulling a 28' Flying cloud. I'm not sure of my hitch weight but I'm guessing it's around 1050LBS. My ProPride is outfitted with the 1400LB WD bars.

- If I measure the height of my truck hitch without the trailer attached my height from the ground is 15.5" to the bottom of the hitch receiver under the bumper. Once I hook the trailer, I try to get as close as possible to that 15.5" measurement by cranking my WD bars. To get within 1/2" of the 15.5" I need to crank 9" on my WD Jacks. I must say the pressure on these jacks as I go that highs substantial! Toward the end (last 1" or so) going up I can hardly hold the 18 volt drill I use to crank with. It wants to spin out of my hand. As a result i'm questioning putting that much pressure on the WD bars.

Can someone please tell me what i'm doing wrong?

I see in many posts folks talk about measuring the front wheel well, when i'm measuring at the hitch receiver. Is that the issue?

Thanks in advance for any help

Cheers
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Old 10-19-2014, 10:14 AM   #1078
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Okay after reading this (complete thread) I can say for sure there is one hell of a lot of info here and most of it points around the fact that 4.5 - 6.5" is the running consensus on cranking up your WD jacks....

I don't have access to my trailer right now (in storage in south) but I do have access to my measuring stick I use to set my WD jacks and it tells me i'm cranking up 9"! - So worth this I'm mind I think I'm doing something wrong.....

First let me backup and articulate what i'm doing to arrive at the 9" and maybe someone can tell me what i'm doing wrong.

- My TV is a 2015 F150 and I'm pulling a 28' Flying cloud. I'm not sure of my hitch weight but I'm guessing it's around 1050LBS. My ProPride is outfitted with the 1400LB WD bars.

- If I measure the height of my truck hitch without the trailer attached my height from the ground is 15.5" to the bottom of the hitch receiver under the bumper. Once I hook the trailer, I try to get as close as possible to that 15.5" measurement by cranking my WD bars. To get within 1/2" of the 15.5" I need to crank 9" on my WD Jacks. I must say the pressure on these jacks as I go that highs substantial! Toward the end (last 1" or so) going up I can hardly hold the 18 volt drill I use to crank with. It wants to spin out of my hand. As a result i'm questioning putting that much pressure on the WD bars.

Can someone please tell me what i'm doing wrong?

I see in many posts folks talk about measuring the front wheel well, when i'm measuring at the hitch receiver. Is that the issue?

Thanks in advance for any help

Cheers
Doug
This is just a guess as I don't have any experience towing a lot of weight with a 1/2 ton pickup. However I think it may be that you need that much force to restore things to near level with the F-150's suspension. Since you don't have access to the trailer, there is not much you can do now. However, I would suggest next time you hook up, that you try the wheel well measurement method and see what you get.

Ken
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