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Old 11-04-2013, 04:53 PM   #2367
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And we wonder what happened to American ingenuity and innovation? Pretty obvious the status quo guys have more time to spend on the Internet and less time to try new products. (Not that some might have a hidden agenda) Hang in there, 1960 may come around again someday.
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Old 11-05-2013, 08:58 AM   #2368
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Curious as to why the folks that are fundamentally (meaning they have no actual experience with the product) are so anti-Andersen feel that they have to continue to post their same arguments over and over again. Steve is the only person that has shown rational arguments for and against. He continues to use the Andersen on his small trailer and another brand on his much larger Airstream. He has found what works for him. That is simply what most here are trying to do.
Common sense and the experience of actual users shows that the Andersen is obviously not for every towing combination. Andersen is very clearly posting on their web site that the system is not compatible with the current coupler being used by Airstream. I for one would not be a happy camper if I had just spent $$$$$$ for a new Airstream and found out that I could not use the WD system of my choice due to Airstream using an inferior couple (my opinion). I am currently shopping for a newer and larger Airstream. If it happens that the Andersen is not compatible with my new trailer I would be disappointed for sure but I would have no problem with using another brand that would properly work. I also will not be posting on this "user thread" over and over again with blanket statements about how the Andersen does not work.
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Old 11-05-2013, 09:13 AM   #2369
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So, what I am understanding, the anti=sway of the Andersen is good, but the WD is less than poor. So, find a way to use solid bars instead of chains.
Also on the subject of WD, was it not said that suspension of the TV has nothing to do with WD??? If one has a TV with poor shocks or is a 1500 the Andersen is at fault because it cannot transfer the weight properly; but yet it is OK when using a 2500 because of the heavier suspension.
Sorry for the rambling but just some ?'s
As for me, I HAD a GM 2500 and 30 ft AS with a Equilizer. Bent the A frame and cracked the shell at the battery boxes. Hummm? The bars too stiff 1K. I now have a 1500 Dodge and a 25 FC and have used the Equi and the Andersen. The Equili rode very hard and emptied the cabinets on outings. I now use the Andersen and haven't had that problem. As for the WD, I run about 1 inch high measured at the wheel well in front and 1 in low in the back. I have no problem with handling.
So, do I go with WD or ride?
mike
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Old 11-05-2013, 10:50 AM   #2370
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Originally Posted by Airtandem View Post
So, what I am understanding, the anti=sway of the Andersen is good, but the WD is less than poor. So, find a way to use solid bars instead of chains.
Also on the subject of WD, was it not said that suspension of the TV has nothing to do with WD??? If one has a TV with poor shocks or is a 1500 the Andersen is at fault because it cannot transfer the weight properly; but yet it is OK when using a 2500 because of the heavier suspension.
Sorry for the rambling but just some ?'s
As for me, I HAD a GM 2500 and 30 ft AS with a Equilizer. Bent the A frame and cracked the shell at the battery boxes. Hummm? The bars too stiff 1K. I now have a 1500 Dodge and a 25 FC and have used the Equi and the Andersen. The Equili rode very hard and emptied the cabinets on outings. I now use the Andersen and haven't had that problem. As for the WD, I run about 1 inch high measured at the wheel well in front and 1 in low in the back. I have no problem with handling.
So, do I go with WD or ride?
mike
Hi Mike, interesting to me. We have a 1500 Dodge and 25' Airstream had an Equal-I-Zer hitch as well. The Equal-I-Zer was capable of weight distribution and when fully applied, did not have a proposing or bouncing problem. But I felt it was too rigid, not flexible enough when full weight distribution was applied. When loosened I lost steering control on slippery roads and the bouncing returned. So I read the early reviews here and bought an Andersen hitch.

It was problematic from the beginning, but I overlooked its shortcomings thinking it was the future of w.d. hitches, and I could make it work. Smoother ride but very poor weight distribution capability. I supported it here while dealing with it's problems.

I came on slick, wet roads in mist with semi's passing that caused the steering to feel so light I pulled off the road for the day. I discovered the mounting bolt holes I drilled into the frame had become elongated from enormous pressure the hitch applied to them; the only flexibility in the hitch is the compressed urethane bushing which is almost none. I had a front banana wrap pull loose from its rivets next to the left A-frame. The friction material began to ooze out from excessive for-aft pressure.

When Andersen then advised the hitch was incompatible with my Airstream coupler, I realized this thing had not been fully though-out before released for sale. I immediately removed it.

I replaced it with a ProPride (Hensley type) hitch, a genuine hitch innovation. The Andersen is not even in the same league as this product in control of sway, and there are no steering or porpoising problems because the hitch can be set to full weight distribution. The tapered bars offer excellent flexibility which the Andersen does not.

Many good weight distribution hitches are available that actually do work without the problems of Andersen. Perhaps they can improve it.
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Old 11-05-2013, 11:08 AM   #2371
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Doug, thanks for the reply. I called Equilizer about the hard ride and the 1K bars, thinking that I might have to use a lighter bar. The suggested that I lessen the tension on the bars. (lower the L piece) I lost WD and anti sway by doing this, that is why I use/try the Andersen. It was also the question of $$$ and hitching the Propride.
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Old 11-06-2013, 09:06 AM   #2372
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I have an Andersen and a Quick-bite coupler. I have been following this thread for about a year and reading about not enough weight transfer to the front axle. With my last TV, a F150 super crew and now a F250 Super cab, I have not had any problem with light front end or handling. I just realized why. When we travel we have a front hitch, a 10" drop bar, a two place bike rack, and two 26" Schwinn bikes. This puts about 300 lbs. at or in front of the front bumper.
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Old 11-06-2013, 10:16 AM   #2373
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It may be time to step back and look at the history of the so called WD hitch systems.

Early on in over the road camping the trailers were small by today's standards, the TV were designed without concerns for comfort and the roads were self limiting as far a speed was concerned.

After the War advancements were made on all three fronts. As trailers got bigger, TV addressed the comfort or the passenger by providing softer rides, and the road system significantly increased the the average speed. These advancements created a need to improve overall stability of the towing combination. Thus the invention of the WD system. They were designed to corrected the tail sag common with the then softer ride characteristics of the post war TV. Note that early WD systems did not address sway control but rather had just simple bars hung from chains. As trailers got bigger and road speeds increased the problem of sway became a consideration and thus the addition of various sway control systems.

Advance to today after the gas crunch and resulting overall down sizing of the general automotive fleet consideration have changed again. Trailers did not get small, road speeds did not go down, and thus the TV fleet changed towards the use of more trucks. The aside from the general looks of a truck to a car they tend to have stiffer suspensions. These stiffer suspensions no longer need the heaver WD system to produce same ride characteristic. The tail is not dragging. The head lights are no longer lighting the tree tops. Why then not design a system that address the remaining principle problem of sway? That is what Andersen has done. As long as your combination of trailer and TV can maintain the designed steering geometry of the TV and you have not exceeded the load limit of the rear axle the system you are using meets minimum standards.

While almost all of the older bar type systems can be detooned, bar weights reduced, to this they retain the inherent problem of bounce, in fact increase this problem. The Andersen, in the use of urethane with a resonant frequency considerable different than steel, has addressed this issue.

The question then remains for each individual to evaluate where in the evolution of WD they are. A model T and a popup your good to go without a WD. A post War rig like the "Long Long trailer" you will definitely need a "bar type" WD system. However if you are driving any of the currently available rigs designed to handle loads common to today's trailers you have the option of using a system designed with that in mind.

Andersen designed a system for today needs. Yes it does not address the limitations of yesterdays trailer couplings nor the softness of spring sets in many of the lighter vehicles. If you have these issues you can do as I did upgrade my couple producing all of the advantages of the newer design or sit back and complaint about being left behind.
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Old 11-06-2013, 01:03 PM   #2374
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The question then remains for each individual to evaluate where in the evolution of WD they are. A model T and a popup your good to go without a WD. A post War rig like the "Long Long trailer" you will definitely need a "bar type" WD system. However if you are driving any of the currently available rigs designed to handle loads common to today's trailers you have the option of using a system designed with that in mind.

Andersen designed a system for today needs. Yes it does not address the limitations of yesterdays trailer couplings nor the softness of spring sets in many of the lighter vehicles. If you have these issues you can do as I did upgrade my couple producing all of the advantages of the newer design or sit back and complaint about being left behind.
I don't think that the Andersen is the natural progression for weight distribution and sway control hitches and the suggestion that those those don't buy into the Andersen's modus operandi are in some way denying progress is really quite patronizing.

If you tow with a big truck and it is set up to adequately deal with the leverage applied by hanging 1000 lbs onto a point some distance behind the rear axle then the Andersen may well work for you. The problem is that a pick-up truck is one of the least effective tow vehicles in the road. Yes, it can take a big load load in the bed but it its intrinsic stability is dreadful when set against most other vehicles on the road. The irony in your argument about "today's needs" is that in terms of auto evolution, the pick-up is still in the dark ages.

To want to tow with a vehicle other than a truck is not to deny progress. It does signify, though, that people want more stable and more economical tow vehicles than those proffered by the truck manufacturers. To use a Hensley or a Propride is hardly a denial of progress either; their designs have yet to be bettered and they work for pretty much any combination you care to name.

I think I've said before that the Andersen is a novel development but most certainly isn't the competition beater that it was initially made out to be. How can it be when it won't work effectively for huge swathes of the towing community?

I'm very pleased that Andersen users are enjoying their experience and making the most of the benefits that it brings them. But please, people, don't make out the non-adopters to be some sort of Luddite, flat-earth types because most probably they are using the best solution for their own particular needs, which just happens to be something other than the limited use Andersen.
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Old 11-06-2013, 01:52 PM   #2375
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According to a recent conversation that I had with Dave Andersen Airstream sales/applications make up less than 1% of their sales. The engineering adjustments they have made for that -1% have been for the sake of customer service and good will. I am not questioning the motives of anyone here for the unfounded statements they continue to repeat over and over again. I do know that if I used another brand that I would not be repeatedly coming to this thread to either slam the Andersen or heap praises on that other brand. To do so would be the height of arrogance and there is certainly enough of that going around already.
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Old 11-06-2013, 05:22 PM   #2376
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Why do some choose to brag about their brand of hitches on a thread with "Andersen" and "User" in the title? Do they really think we need saving from the dreadful folks at Andersen, or perhaps they have a vested interest in another product?

I have received Private Messages from satisfied users who do not want to deal with all the negative comments from non-users.

Disregard the posters who have not tried the Andersen hitch and you will see that most enjoy the hitch and some don't. 100% of the non-users seem to think it is no good. Isn't that interesting? There is no such thing as a true "One size fits all" and the Andersen hitch is no exception.


The comments about the unsuitability of pickups as tow vehicles deserves its own thread.
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Old 11-06-2013, 09:08 PM   #2377
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Why do some choose to brag about their brand of hitches on a thread with "Andersen" and "User" in the title? Do they really think we need saving from the dreadful folks at Andersen, or perhaps they have a vested interest in another product?

I have received Private Messages from satisfied users who do not want to deal with all the negative comments from non-users.

Disregard the posters who have not tried the Andersen hitch and you will see that most enjoy the hitch and some don't. 100% of the non-users seem to think it is no good. Isn't that interesting? There is no such thing as a true "One size fits all" and the Andersen hitch is no exception.


The comments about the unsuitability of pickups as tow vehicles deserves its own thread.
I was replying to Howie's post; he's the one who mentioned stiffly sprung trucks. The discussion on the use of specific types of tow vehicles is pertinent to the debate on this thread because it's important in understanding whether or not the Andersen is going to work for you.
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Old 11-06-2013, 09:10 PM   #2378
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According to a recent conversation that I had with Dave Andersen Airstream sales/applications make up less than 1% of their sales. The engineering adjustments they have made for that -1% have been for the sake of customer service and good will. I am not questioning the motives of anyone here for the unfounded statements they continue to repeat over and over again. I do know that if I used another brand that I would not be repeatedly coming to this thread to either slam the Andersen or heap praises on that other brand. To do so would be the height of arrogance and there is certainly enough of that going around already.
What unfounded statements?

Any discussion on this Forum would be very poor fare if people didn't present opposing views. Pros and cons are always required in debate.
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Old 11-06-2013, 09:59 PM   #2379
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Hi, it has been already stated here on this thread that, according to forum rules, one must not be required to be an owner or user of a certain product to post their opinions.
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Old 11-06-2013, 10:10 PM   #2380
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I was replying to Howie's post; he's the one who mentioned stiffly sprung trucks. The discussion on the use of specific types of tow vehicles is pertinent to the debate on this thread because it's important in understanding whether or not the Andersen is going to work for you.
What is pertinent is that you own and favor another brand of hitch. I also noticed that your tow vehicle is not a pickup truck. Thanks for doing our thinking for us, although most of us can figure these things out ourselves.
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