Receiver/hitch weight with WD

[Devoman]

I am wondering how the reciever works exactly.My Touareg states that it can pull 7700 lbs hitch and 770 tongue weight.
What I am wondering is if you were to change to a W/D hitch that can handle more tongue weight,Would you be able to tow a big trailer as long as it is withing the hitch towing rate.I noticed that someone is pulling a 25' Airstream with there Touareg.They have the W/D hitch.I did not realize that this could be done but then again I thought that was to big and was sitting on a fine line of towing in the past.Any help on letting me know how this works please.Thanks

[wahoonc]

Devoman,
I don't know how the hitch on the Touareg works...but on a conventional reciever you typically will have two sets of weight ratings. For example on my Class V Putnam is rated at 15,000#/1500# tongue weight or 16,000#/1600# tongue weight if you use a WDH. Not much of difference but you have to consider what it is hooked too Basically the way a WDH works is to transfer some of the tongue weight back to the trailer axles and forward onto the front axle of the tow vehicle. IIRC there were a bunch of stipulations concerning the Touareg and the WDH. Another factor that comes into play that is not typically addressed is the wheelbase length ratio. A short wheel base vehicle may be rated to tow xx,xxx# but will it have the leverage to control the difference between say a 19' and a 28' trailer?

Aaron

[jcanavera]

Originally Posted by Devoman

What I am wondering is if you were to change to a W/D hitch that can handle more tongue weight,Would you be able to tow a big trailer as long as it is withing the hitch towing rate.Thanks

The hitch/receiver combo is one component used in determining your towing capacity. My GM supplied factory hitch was only a class IV and was insufficient to use when I upgraded to my Classic slide out unit with its heavy hitch weight. In this case I replaced it with a Class V receiver. The van itself is rated to tow 9,900 lbs. so this upgrade did not cause me to exceed the van's tow ratings.

My point is that you have limits based on the towing capacity of the vehicle itself, and you also have individual component limitations. You can upgrade your receiver to handle higher weights, but you have to make sure you do not exceed the overall limits that are determined by frame, engine, and axle components.

Jack

[Devoman]

Yea I was wondering about that.So as long as I have a reciver that can handle more weight it is ok to do so.I just dont want to exceed the hitch weight though.I was really curious about that because when I had seen the Touareg pulling a 25' Airstream it seemed like that was a bit on the edge but the guy said it pulled and handled with no problem at all.It just seems alot for the vehicle.I know it can pull the 22' with no problem at all.I bet I would be able to tell a differance for sure if I were to pull something that big.

[Cedars]

Does anyone have a receiver chart showing the different classes of receivers, and weights they can handle? Or can you point me to a url somewhere that has it?
Just curious

Elizabeth in Iowa

[markdoane]

Originally Posted by Cedars

Does anyone have a receiver chart showing the different classes of receivers, and weights they can handle? Or can you point me to a url somewhere that has it?
Just curious

Elizabeth in Iowa

http://www.reeseprod.com/support/support/su_faqs.shtml

[nickcrowhurst]

Originally Posted by Devoman

I am wondering how the reciever works exactly.
What I am wondering is if you were to change to a W/D hitch that can handle more tongue weight,Would you be able to tow a big trailer as long as it is withing the hitch towing rate.

If you go to this link, particularly post #29, you will find a discussion of this precise issue:
http://www.airforums.com/forum...d+distribution
Nick.

[Cedars]

Thanks, Mark! I also found this:
http://lib.store.yahoo.com/hitches4l...h-classes.html

Elizabeth in Iowa

[jcanavera]

Just be careful because that dividing line between class IV and class V is not always as defined as you like. My GM supplied hitch was rated class IV, but the labeling on the hitch limited the hitch weight to 1,000 lbs. using a weight distribution hitch. Not the 1,200 lbs. as shown in the Reese table. Be sure to check receiver weight ratings carefully and do not rely upon someone telling you it is class IV or class V.

Jack

[wahoonc]

Originally Posted by jcanavera

Just be careful because that dividing line between class IV and class V is not always as defined as you like. My GM supplied hitch was rated class IV, but the labeling on the hitch limited the hitch weight to 1,000 lbs. using a weight distribution hitch. Not the 1,200 lbs. as shown in the Reese table. Be sure to check receiver weight ratings carefully and do not rely upon someone telling you it is class IV or class V.

Jack

Jack

I agree completely, if you check the link that markdoane provided against the link that I provided in the earlier post there is a difference between what Putnam says and what the Reese Chart calls out.

Aaron

[markdoane]

Originally Posted by wahoonc

I agree completely, if you check the link that markdoane provided against the link that I provided in the earlier post there is a difference between what Putnam says and what the Reese Chart calls out.

Aaron

I think the ratings have changed, which may explain why some class IV receivers are rated at 10,000#WD and some are 12,000#WD. The specifications are in SAE J-684, which gets changed every decade or so.

There is no SAE rating for Class V, so manufacturers can make it as heavy as they want and call it whatever they want.

The Putnam page says the class III is a weight distributing hitch, which I think may not be correct.

[Devoman]

Now I have an airsuspension system on my Touareg.Would that help some in the pulling of a bigger Airstream.I would have to get a stronger reciever though.So how would I do that without using a W/D hitch unless I get an equalizer hitch again but stronger.Are there stronger reciever hitches out there.I would only need something for sway control like I do with my Airstream right now.(I am using an equalizer hitch with the 600 lb rating.I know I would have to go with a bigger one if I were to do something like this.)

[CanoeStream]

In response to one type of question a few months back, a member went to a CAT scale and validated the idea that weight distribution torques the TV frame so that some load is also borne by the front axle. With the trailer being the heavier object, no load change occurred at the trailer axles.

You need to figure out your TV's load capacity if not clearly published. Beyond the issue of the 770# tongue weight, you should look at empty curb weight of the TV (ignore trailer). Subtract that number from the TV's GVWR (ignore trailer, GCWR, tow capacity, etc). The difference should be your TV's load capacity. If you TV does not come with a hitch receiver under the rear frame, you must include that weight in how much load you put in the TV (again ignore trailer). Here goes a list of things you must include and subtract from the TV's load capacity:
1. Hitch receiver unless a standard item of the TV's trim line (eg, GS, LS); and if a standard option you will see a corresponding reduction of load capacity in the manual.
2. Any option bought with or added on the TV
3. Driver & passengers
4. Everything you load into the TV
5. Would you want to stay below load capacity by a consensus 10-15% for handling & safety?
6. What is left is your allowance for tongue weight. Published factory numbers for empty trailer are a starting point. Please add weight distribution gear & propane to your tongue weight. 10-15% of gross trailer weight needs to be at the hitch or you lose stability altogether. A pure 10% as your numbers suggest is hard to hit on the nose.

Maybe 770# dead weight at the rear bumper wouldn't overload the rear axle. Weight distribution certainly would move some of that to the forward axle, but it won't decrease the contribution of tongue weight. You can almost always ignore max towing capacity and GCWR if you avoid exceeding the TV's load capacity, cuz then I guarantee you won't approach the Madison Avenue numbers given for tow capacity.

[2airishuman]

hi devoman

i can see the mental wheels turning........i also have considered if and how a w/d system can allow for pulling greater loads.....my limited conclusion....w/d moves weight around, via the frame, from one axle to another. actual tongue mass doesn't change much, while the vertical load at the hitch does....per nicks equations....

nicks thread on the w/d analysis explains it fairly well.....but you must understand and believe in math.....

generally air suspension does NOT increase towing/load carrying parameters....but does alter the feel/dynamics of the driving experience.

you must also consider the load rating for both axle systems and wheel/tires.

i suppose if some one built a t.v. with 4000lb axles and 1000lb springs.....then changing to an air suspension rated at 4000lb WOULD increase towing/load carrying.....but this would be an unusual situation.....most of the time axle systems, springs and wheels are pretty well matched.

for the touareg you will need to know the rated axle limits and the tire/wheel limits......along with frame limits, braking limits, tranny limits and so on.....

vwoa can supply these values.....actually the tire, axle rating should be at hand.....wheel, tranny, frame, trans and brakes may take some digging.

the car makers pull all these issues together and factor in longevity and failure parameter before deciding on the rated limits.....yes there are folks to multiply this number by 1.2 but most of us factor by 0.8......

sure a higher capacity hitch, receiver and w/d system can be added...but these will still be limited by which ever of the vehicles built in limits apply.

for enough money, wheels/tires and axle systems and brakes could be up rated, but what will the vw frame and trans allow?

in addition to load limits..............wheel base must be considered......when going to a longer trailer. have you looked at the basic formula for t.v. wheel base compared to trailer length?

the touareg has a fairly short wheel base.

have you seen the videos of lebaron's pulling 34s or ford rangers pulling 30s?

seeing someone tow a bigger rig, hearing a testimonial that 'it works great' or noting no ill effects first hand......well that still doesn't mean it will work on hills, during emergencies, over time, or that it's safe......and i don't just safe at the obvious level.......for example what's happening at the wheel bearing or drive shaft or hubs or lug nuts.......failure at any of these could lead to an accident.

also keep in mind they extra graphics you are considering will add to the trailer weight!!

cheers
2air'

[CanoeStream]

In response to one type of question a few months back, a member went to a CAT scale and validated the idea that weight distribution torques the TV frame so that some load is also borne by the front axle. With the trailer being the heavier object, no load change occurred at the trailer axles.

Let me clarify -- None of the tongue weight was transferred to the trailer wheels by effective weight distribution. The tongue weight did not change. Weight distribution only spreads some of the tongue load up to the front wheels.

The thread in question -- http://www.airforums.com/forum...ers-17984.html

[DreamStreamr]

Our hitch and truck (F150) are both rated well above what our truck can pull up the mountain, and waaaay above what we would have pushing us down the mountain. Our next t.v. we will select first for ability to proficiently control and stop the Airstream and then for ability to pull it. The ratings are so of like how my dad always referred to the speed limit -- you don't have to pull this much but you should not pull more than the max rating.