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Old 12-02-2008, 06:51 AM   #43
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Originally Posted by Scotty Oh View Post
Hi Dennis, Thanks for the input but where do you get 500 lbs overweight? I understand the 300 but where do you get the 500, other than the weight without distribution.....
The 500 lbs WAS without weight distribution....in the scenario you put forward (which was good - bully for you that you actually went through the weighing process) your worst case (no tension on bars) left the truck 500 lbs overweight, and then you progressed through the stops to your best case (as far as total weight on the truck) with the Tundra being 300 lbs overweight - you never know what you have until you get it weighed.

You further stated these measurements:

Load truck no trailer:
Fender rt ft 36.25, lt ft 36.25, rt rr 38.5 lt rr 35.5
Inside top of reciever 17.75

Truck and trailer no tension on bars:
Fenders rt ft 37, lt ft 37, rt rr 36, lt rr 36
Reciever 13.75 Bottom of frame ft 13, rr 18.75

Jack 3rd mark
Reciever 15 Bottom of Frame ft 14.75, rr 17.25

Jack 2nd mark:
Reciever 15.2 Bottom of Frame ft 15.75, rr 17.00

Jack 3rd mark
Reciever 15.5 Bottom ofFrame ft 16.0, rr 16.8

Jack at the stop
Fender rt ft 36.25, lt ft 36.25, rt rr 36.75, lt rr 37.00
Reciever 15.75 Bottom of Frame ft 16.25, 16.75

I assume the Bottom of Frame measurements are taken on the trailer - is this correct? It seems to be since the receiver is being brought progressively up as you add tension to the bars, this would push the rear of the trailer down, as you indicate in the last measurement of each sequence.

I also was somewhat confused when I first started taking weights with my current Tow Vehicle/Trailer. I ended up with about eight weighs from each of three separate scales before I was satisfied with the bar setting.

One thing I might suggest -since reweighs are only a buck each - position the axles of the trailer on separate weigh pads with each "experimental" setting of the bar positions. This (getting separate weights on each of the trailer axles) will give you a pretty good idea about how the distribution bars are affecting the weight each of the trailer axles.

Any significant imbalance in the weights on the individual axles will greatly influence trailer stability.

Good luck - please post your subsequent scale results.
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Old 12-02-2008, 09:57 PM   #44
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Thanks Dennis,
I am still working on it. As about the buck, the ODOT scales when closed, the heads are left on for public use as well a truckers checking there loads. Sounds like a good idea to get the seperate axle weights as well.
Yes, I will be a little over if I don't change out the mattress and I am aware of it.
My desire is to get more mass on the frt axle. 2air has sugested trying the 1400# bars.
Any sugestion you have will be be of help.
I want to reload the TV later this week and do it all over. I have better idea of what to do now.
From where I am now parked, asphlt, trailer is dead level with carpenters level and equal measurement from belt moulding all around coach. Hitch ball height is 20.75" even if AS brochure say it is 17.75. I will check this again this week on concret slab, did not check it last time. The TV is not loaded so will load it again, maybe put more stuff in just for good measure. Including 475 in the cab and the canoe and skis on top. Might just as well see how much is to much. Reciever height should be somewhere about 17.5.
What would your take be on the proper hitch bar?

Have a good evening and thank for your input. Curently I parked in Tugman State Park, just south of Reedsport, OR.

Scotty
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Old 12-03-2008, 07:00 PM   #45
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Scotty,

Based on your fender height and receiver height measurements, it appears that your truck's receiver is "flexing" enough so that you cannot get sufficient load on your WD bars before the jacks reach their stops.

Under the "Jack at the stop" loading condition, the receiver is about 0.4" higher than I would expect it to be if the TV/receiver were acting as a rigid unit. If this difference is due to pitch-axis rotation of the receiver, it could mean that the rear ends of the WD bars are pitched upward, perhaps as much as 2-3", relative to what they would be if there were no receiver rotation.

Next time you have the TV and TT connected, you might want to try to measure the vertical angle between the TV and the receiver to see how much it changes as you increase the loads on the WD bars.

If your receiver is flexing too much and if you can replace the OEM receiver with a stronger one, that might solve your problem.

Your scales data indicate that with no WD, an added load of 1380# on the TV's rear axle caused the rear fenders to drop 2.5". With the jacks at the stop, the WD system transferred about 200# to the TT's axles and removed about 700# from the TV's rear axle. This reduced the rear fender drop to about 1.6"

With your 1000# WD bars, you should be able to transfer about 300# to the TV's axles if you are able to get more curvature in the WD bars. If you can transfer 300# to the TT's axles, then the WD system should be able to remove about 1000# from the TV's rear axle. And, depending on the rear spring characteristics, the rear fender drop should be reduced to about 3/4".

If you do manage to transfer an additional 100# to the TT's axles, you would also transfer about 200# additional load to the TV's front axle which would cause the front of the TV to drop below the unhitched height. Some TV manufacturer's recommend against doing this, so you might want to check with Toyota to see what they say.

If you are experiencing excessive receiver flex and if you can eliminate that by using a different receiver, IMO that would be a better solution than using 1400# WD bars.

Ron
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Old 12-03-2008, 11:38 PM   #46
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Thanks Ron, How would I go about doing as suggested in par. 3?
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Old 12-04-2008, 12:52 AM   #47
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Scotty
I really don't want to scare ya. I'm glad U got the outfit over the scales. If are still not transferring enough weight U may never. Because its being absorbed in the frame in the form of a twist or bend. I know u think this is so much Horse pucky but its true. Frames will hide weight . I have seen it to many times where the gross vehicle weight in not reflected in the axles wieght (which are less) thus the hiding of weight
I know I have paid some overload fines in my day for the differences.
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Old 12-04-2008, 07:24 AM   #48
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Originally Posted by Scotty Oh View Post
Thanks Ron, How would I go about doing as suggested in par. 3?
protractor and level

or build a contraption, found in another forum here:
http://rv.net/forum/index.cfm/fuseac...pging/1/page/1

it started re. chevy OEM receivers, but its got some good posts you might find useful...
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Old 12-04-2008, 09:02 AM   #49
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1000# may not be enough

Scotty,

I have an 07 Tundra and found that 1000# Equalizer bars were not enough
for the 900# tongue weight on our 25' Safari. I switched to 1200# bars
and the weight is transfered more effectively, resulting in a smoother ride
and better steering feel. The Tundra has a lot of rear suspension travel
which seems to absorb a lot of the transfer effect. The receiver does not
flex, nor does the frame to any extent based on my observations.
If you are to believe Toyota: Toyota Tundra Features
Click on the "Integrated Hitch Receiver" video.

Terry
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Old 12-04-2008, 11:06 AM   #50
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Much good info. Gives me encouragment
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Old 12-04-2008, 04:58 PM   #51
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Originally Posted by Scotty Oh View Post
Thanks Ron, How would I go about doing as suggested in par. 3?
Scotty,

You could try the following:

1. Clamp a straight edge, in a near vertical position, onto the side of your receiver or drawbar. Your 18" level would work fine for the straight edge.

2. With no load on the HA's jacks, measure the horizontal distance from the front edge of the straight edge to a point on the rear surface of the tailgate. The higher up on the straight edge -- the better.

3. As you apply load to the WD bars, measure the horizontal distance from the straight edge to the tailgate, always measuring at the same height above the receiver . If this distance decreases, it means the rear end of the receiver is rotating upward relative to the truck. It also means the HA and the front ends of the WD bars are rotating upward.

Any pitch-axis rotation of the receiver and hitch will reduce the amount of WD bar curvature which can be achieved before the jacks are at the stop. Since the amount of weight transfer is directly proportional to the amount of bar curvature, any reduction of curvature will reduce the amout of load which the WD system can transfer.

Ron
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