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Old 02-28-2012, 03:32 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by Jammer View Post
In the context of this thread, the OP has a 4500 pound trailer and is concerned about using 600 or 800 pound bars. I think that concern is misplaced.

I have never used the Equal-i-zer hitch myself. If the bars are too stiff it would show up first when crossing a dip as when entering a driveway or other incline. That is where the stress placed on the a-frame by the bars would be the greatest. The stress from the truck rear axle when hitting a bump would tend to relax the wd with the shock absorber on the truck taking the hit on the downstroke.
Jammer.

If the bump is a speed bump, then the front wheels of the tow vehicle get hit first, which drives down the rear, which adds stress to the bars. When the rear wheels hit the speed bump, then when they return to level, they should lower to some degree, however momentary, which again, adds stress to the bars.

When a chug hole is hit by a front wheel and the by the rear wheel of the same side of the tow vehicle, then the front wheel offers little change, but the rear wheel dropping in the hole, will add stress to the hitch bars.

Of course, that all depends on the depth of the chug hole. The deeper, the worse the reaction becomes.

Andy
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Old 02-28-2012, 03:50 PM   #16
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[QUOTE=Inland RV Center, In;1112994]The rating of the bars depends on 2 things.

The trailer tongue weight and the exact tow vehicle.

What tow vehicle do you have?

The heavier the tow vehicle duty, the lighter tha bars should be.

In your case, unless your using a car, the bars are over rated.
6

Well, it's an F150, so it's a bit springy....and I figure that the tongue weight is likely a bit higher than what I quoted, as the hitch is pretty heavy, so it's probably more around the 700# range. I haven't actually weighed it (I know I should), so this would be hypothetical, but the "factory" weight dry is 4480#/435#....we're pretty much fully loaded all the time, so let's just say it's 6300#/~600#...the hitch (a HaHa) will add another 100 or so to that, so 700# would be a good approximation.
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Old 02-28-2012, 04:10 PM   #17
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Shawn...

This is a good investment to eliminate the estimation...mine was off by 300lbs.

Good tips on the site also...

Bob
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Old 02-28-2012, 07:35 PM   #18
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I look at it this way.
With the palms of your hands facing you. Lock the fingers together then rotate both hands so the palms are facing away and push your hands away from your body.
Do you feel the stress in your fingers and forearms?
The stress in your fingers represents the tension of the spring bars and the stress in your forearms is what the frame of the truck and trailer go thru. The truck frame can handle it but the trailer frame and shell can't.
If you have over rated or maladjusted spring bars, I believe you will damage the trailer. The design of this trailer is to enable it to flex when necessary. If you hold the frame in the front ridged with spring bars that are over rated and the trailer wants to flex. It will, and it will result in rivets popping and dents showing up in the front lower sections and around the door.
When you have a tongue weight in the neighborhood of 15%. Most of the shock that the rear axle of the TV encounters is absorbed by the TV's suspension especially on long wheel based TV's.
I routinely come across threads or articles about the tube type receiver hitches experiencing damage. Where the tube or pipe across the rear of the TV has been twisted or torn. In my mind it's the result of an under rated or overloaded hitch or a combination of both. When you literally try to prevent the rear end of the TV from flexing down as you go thru a dip you are putting tremendous stress on the receiver hitch assembly and the trailer frame as well.
I believe if you are using a weight distribution hitch it must be rated to match the trailers tongue weight when towing by using and adjusting it correctly.
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Old 02-28-2012, 08:40 PM   #19
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[QUOTE=exthemius;1113012]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Inland RV Center, In View Post
The rating of the bars depends on 2 things.

The trailer tongue weight and the exact tow vehicle.

What tow vehicle do you have?

The heavier the tow vehicle duty, the lighter tha bars should be.

In your case, unless your using a car, the bars are over rated.
6

Well, it's an F150, so it's a bit springy....and I figure that the tongue weight is likely a bit higher than what I quoted, as the hitch is pretty heavy, so it's probably more around the 700# range. I haven't actually weighed it (I know I should), so this would be hypothetical, but the "factory" weight dry is 4480#/435#....we're pretty much fully loaded all the time, so let's just say it's 6300#/~600#...the hitch (a HaHa) will add another 100 or so to that, so 700# would be a good approximation.
I would suggest dropping the bar ratings to 750 or 800 pounds, and experience and observe the positive difference.

Andy
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Old 02-28-2012, 09:44 PM   #20
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''I routinely come across threads or articles about the tube type receiver hitches experiencing damage. Where the tube or pipe across the rear of the TV has been twisted or torn. In my mind it's the result of an under rated or overloaded hitch or a combination of both."

If your referencing the GM units... they are not under rated in what they are specced to tow, they are under rated/fail because they are junk...

Bob
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Old 02-28-2012, 11:09 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ROBERT CROSS View Post
''I routinely come across threads or articles about the tube type receiver hitches experiencing damage. Where the tube or pipe across the rear of the TV has been twisted or torn. In my mind it's the result of an under rated or overloaded hitch or a combination of both."

If your referencing the GM units... they are not under rated in what they are specced to tow, they are under rated/fail because they are junk...
+1

Another way to look at this is that these receivers don't fail because they use a tubular crossbar design. They fail because they are poorly designed. The welds were breaking on mine when I bought my Suburban, so I hauled the whole thing to the scrapyard and replaced it with a much more solid aftermarket hitch. The root cause of this is that the V5 testing standards for WD hitches are woefully inadequate, and GM (among others) design to the V5 standards.
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Old 02-28-2012, 11:17 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Inland RV Center, In View Post
Jammer.

If the bump is a speed bump, then the front wheels of the tow vehicle get hit first, which drives down the rear, which adds stress to the bars. When the rear wheels hit the speed bump, then when they return to level, they should lower to some degree, however momentary, which again, adds stress to the bars.

When a chug hole is hit by a front wheel and the by the rear wheel of the same side of the tow vehicle, then the front wheel offers little change, but the rear wheel dropping in the hole, will add stress to the hitch bars.

Of course, that all depends on the depth of the chug hole. The deeper, the worse the reaction becomes.

Andy
I'm not buying it because any speed bump/chug hole the tow vehicle will recover from without leaving a control arm or two behind has to be shallower than half the tire diameter. If we use a practical maximum of 12" then with a 135" wheelbase you get around a 9% incline. On the other hand the maximum approach angle on these vehicles is around 17 degrees or a 31% incline (tangent of 17 degrees times 100). The spring deflection on such an incline will be three times what you could possibly get in a chug hole.
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Old 02-29-2012, 06:28 AM   #23
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Jam,

First thing I did when we got the 06 Burb....not even funny though.
Can't count how many we replaced at the Chevy Store.

Bob
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Old 02-29-2012, 02:40 PM   #24
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Bringing it back around.

Do you advocates of additional sway control feel that the manufacturer of my TV has not designed a sway control system that really works?

I can't elucidate geometry as some of you folks can. I thought the settling I had front vs back (when I lowered the trailer onto the standard hitch) seemed to be acceptable, perhaps allowing me to forgo the WD type hitch.

I'm not trying to argue with anyone. I'm here to learn from the folks who have towed bizillions of miles. (Insert bowing smilie face.) I'm BIG on safety, and want the easiest towing experience available. I also want to keep my GVW as low as possible. (I don't see fuel costs coming down in the future.) Am I still leaning in the wrong direction for this 22 footer being pulled by a 1/2 ton pickup (5 liter engine) with integrated OEM sway and brake controllers?
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Old 02-29-2012, 02:50 PM   #25
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I have an F150 with the "integrated sway" and brake controller, and towed 25k miles with my A/S last year all over the west...if safety is what you're about, then you need to have something in place outside of the electronic sway control on your truck (which only kicks in when you're really wagging tail). We ended up getting a Hensley, because with the amount of miles we travel, we wouldn't put a price on the cargo (myself, wife and two kids) we travel with, and the statistical likelihood of something going wrong -- think of it as an insurance policy or sorts....you might not "need" it, but when you do and you don't have it, then it's too late.
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Old 02-29-2012, 02:55 PM   #26
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JazzDad

No matter how good the electronic stability control on the pickup is, the question remains of weight distribution between the front and rear wheels. The tongue weight of the trailer has the effect of reducing down force on the front wheels which results in some loss of steering control. Even if there is an autoride-type system that adjusts the ride height so that the reduced down force on the front wheels is not evident from the suspension loading, the loss of steering remains.

The question then is whether you lose enough down force on the front wheels, when hitching the trailer, to be problematic. I would imagine that you do, but others might disagree. The main purpose of WD is to restore most of the down force so that steering control is maintained.

I don't believe the weight of the WD system will affect your gas mileage measurably.
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Old 02-29-2012, 04:15 PM   #27
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JazzDad,

POI... the integrated sway control only comes into play AFTER the sway is initiated, it does nothing to help prevent it from starting.

As others have noted a WD hitch with sway control would be the best option for all around performance and SAFETY.

Bob
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Old 03-01-2012, 12:36 PM   #28
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Alrighty, then. Now I'll have to do my math all over again as I search for the right WD hitch with sway control. At least most of them seem to have a range of adjustments that will work for my situation.

Thanks for the replies and the gentle nudging.
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