Andersen No Sway Weight Distribution

[ROBERTSUNRUS]

Originally Posted by Road Ruler

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It was reported that another possible limitation for some vehicles is that the ANDERSEN has no angle adjustment on the head like most other WDH's.

Hi, the purpose of the angle adjustment on the head is to increase tension on the spring bars; Since the Andersen uses chains, changing the angle of the head would be totally useless.

[dkottum]

Originally Posted by TG Twinkie

Here is the way I see it. In geometrical terms. The connection point (coupler and ball combination) is like the truss on the roof of a house. Although the hitch does not have as high of a peak as a house, it does exist. The roof on your house can hold a tremendous amount of weight. Because the base of the triangle does not change in length when loaded.
The same goes for a WD hitch. Regardless of the brand. If you were to hitch the trailer to the TV without the WD hitch. The odds are that the rear of the TV and the tongue of the trailer would go down. Forming a "V" shape. I think everyone can agree to this.
In the case of the Andersen hitch you tension the chains with no load on the TV. So the rear of the TV and tongue are at a slight upward angle. If you were to lift the rear of the TV with the tongue jack while the coupler is locked onto the ball, the upward angle of the hitch point would be higher. Now if you were to tighten the chains, making the base of the triangle shorter, the WD would increase because when you raise the tongue jack the bottom of the triangle can only increase by the amount of compression of the urethane bushings.
On the conventional WD hitch, the spring bars prevent the connection point from sinking by pulling down on the trailer "A" frame in turn pushing up on the connection point. In effect, shortening the base of the triangle.
The conventional WD is matched to the trailer by the weight rating of the bars.
Perhaps the Andersen hitch should have urethane bushings with varying weight capacities. The unit of measure for rubber is derometer (sp) when it comes to compression figures. Not sure if the same scale is used for urethane.
Anyway. That's my take on it.
I have found it a lot easier to adjust the tension on the Andersen hitch by raising the tongue higher while hitched. As opposed to tightening the nut while the chains are taught. Not sure if the guys at Andersen would agree with this procedure. But it works for me.

Good explanation. And yes the easy (correct) way to tension the chains is with the load off the hitch ball, then lower it and truck and trailer will settle to their proper attitude. That is how Andersen instructs to tension the chains in their directions.

If the trailer is not level or truck at its unloaded attitude, as measured at the wheel wells, the hitch bar height is too high or too low and needs further adjustment. Once done, it is repeatable by counting the threads on the chain tensioner, or measuring compression on the urethane bushing as the chains are tightened (with the tongue jack down and weight off the ball). Very simple and easy.

doug k

[Wazbro]

Originally Posted by ROBERTSUNRUS

Hi, the purpose of the angle adjustment on the head is to increase tension on the spring bars; Since the Andersen uses chains, changing the angle of the head would be totally useless.

You are correct, angle adjustment would make no difference on the Andersen.

The complaint about no angle adjustment belongs on a Hensley thread since Hensley also doesn't have that adjustment and it would make a difference with that hitch.

[star kitty]

I've been following these threads much closer since I recently purchased and installed the Andersen on my TV.

There have been some instances where the pressure on the coupler is causing it to release out of its locked position. Albeit, these are rare, but just once is cause for concern for me.

I have the original coupler on my trailer. Is there a standard replacement cycle for these? I don't know if its in good shape or not. It has worked for two years but that doesn't mean its not going to be an issue.

Is anyone here thinking its a good practice to replace these couplers just due to the number of years it has been in service?

I have yet to put more than 10 miles on the system so it has been unproven to me. I have a trailer that weighs 2640 dry and tow with a Toyota Sequoia. Just looking for some piece of mind is all.

Thank you.

[dmand001]

Originally Posted by star kitty

I've been following these threads much closer since I recently purchased and installed the Andersen on my TV.

There have been some instances where the pressure on the coupler is causing it to release out of its locked position. Albeit, these are rare, but just once is cause for concern for me.

I have the original coupler on my trailer. Is there a standard replacement cycle for these? I don't know if its in good shape or not. It has worked for two years but that doesn't mean its not going to be an issue.

Is anyone here thinking its a good practice to replace these couplers just due to the number of years it has been in service?

I have yet to put more than 10 miles on the system so it has been unproven to me. I have a trailer that weighs 2640 dry and tow with a Toyota Sequoia. Just looking for some piece of mind is all.

Thank you.

Once the grease has been cleaned off the coupler it’s a matter of looking at it from the bottom. Make sure that the shoe or claw that is attached to the latch is there and functional. Make sure the spring is functional. Look for overall deterioration. To check it functionally hook it up, latch it then exercise the tongue jack up and down insuring that it holds firmly. You may see the latch move up and down a little and that’s the concern. At this point you’re good to go, for conventional hitches that is, where the pressure is upwards. Now comes the new Andersen Hitch that applies pressure sideways for WD via the chains being drawn tightly. The Andersen requires a solid coupling as only the ball shank does the movement. It’s deceiving once the chains are tightened as it seems solid and can’t be moved. That’s probably true for the amount of pressure applied to the shoe and rear of the coupler. Well guess what, there was an instance where it was moved and the ball actually popped out with the latch secured. The reason is because of internal movement within the coupler. Since the Andersen pins the shoe so tightly to the rear, it grabs it and only one place to go, the path of least resistance and that’s towards a gap. So while on the road it would vibrate and that I believe sheared off the latching mechanism of a user whose ball dislodged. The vibrations so subtle as we’re talking of 1/8 to 3/8” and probably will not be felt. This is what I’ve done though have yet to try it on a long road trip but it solidifies the coupling. Add steel washers about 1-14” in diameter one at time then latch it, then another 1-14”, latching it again. Now taper it a bit with a 1” washer and keep going till you could not latch it. At this point remove the last washer secure the latch. Crank your jack up and down and you’ll notice a more solid coupling. I did call Andersen about this and Steve said it’s a great idea. Mind you it hasn’t been tested long term but I’m going to and will report here sometime in June

[dkottum]

Originally Posted by ROBERTSUNRUS

Hi, the purpose of the angle adjustment on the head is to increase tension on the spring bars; Since the Andersen uses chains, changing the angle of the head would be totally useless.

True. This "fault" with the Andersen non-tilting hitch head originated with towing expert Andrew Thomson at Can Am who suggested (in an earlier test and report) cutting and rewelding the drop bar to get an angle on the hitch head. I hope no one is doing this.

doug k

[TG Twinkie]

I agree with dougk. If the trailer and TV are coupled correctly. The ball should be perpendicular (straight up) in order to have the correct match to the coupler. The trailer and TV should set level when hitched correctly. The coupler and ball are designed for this match.

[Road Ruler]

All other WD hitches using bars apply a downward force on the coupler

Agree. This is one huge advantage to the traditional torsion bar WDH design which the Andsn does not have.

[slowmover]

Originally Posted by dkottum

slowmover, thanks for the report, although you never seen nor used an Andersen.

doug k

Oh, I, too, was tempted by a cheap & lightweight hitch as a secondary for moving other trailers around. But have yet to see data that it works where a WDH is required: Front Axle Weight Restoration where the TW is above 350-lbs (500 for some manufacturers).

Show us that data.

I've made mistakes that cost about this much. The wrong TT tires, for instance. But, unlike "Anderson users who love it" wised up and moved on to what actually works.

Do Anderson users also advocate low tire pressure? Below-spec lug nut torque? . . . I needn't try them to know them a bad idea. And I don't confuse opinion for fact.

That it can't even restore front axle weight on a car makes it laughable.

Scan up the CAT Scale tickets, boys. If others think that the function of a WDH is to mitigate trailer sway, then it's on them. To those who can demonstrate understanding, the case is clear when the numbers are in evidence.


.

[dkottum]

Originally Posted by slowmover

Oh, I, too, was tempted by a cheap & lightweight hitch as a secondary for moving other trailers around. But have yet to see data that it works where a WDH is required: Front Axle Weight Restoration where the TW is above 350-lbs (500 for some manufacturers).

Show us that data.

I've made mistakes that cost about this much. The wrong TT tires, for instance. But, unlike "Anderson users who love it" wised up and moved on to what actually works.

Do Anderson users also advocate low tire pressure? Below-spec lug nut torque? . . . I needn't try them to know them a bad idea. And I don't confuse opinion for fact.

That it can't even restore front axle weight on a car makes it laughable.

Scan up the CAT Scale tickets, boys. If others think that the function of a WDH is to mitigate trailer sway, then it's on them. To those who can demonstrate understanding, the case is clear when the numbers are in evidence.


.

Thanks for the opinion, although you have never seen nor used an Andersen.

doug k

[ROBERT CROSS]

Originally Posted by slowmover

The first job of a weight-distribution hitch is to restore the tow vehicle front axle to the unhitched value. This is a vehicle manufacturer requirement.

Good luck finding that data except on trailer TW so light that a WDH may not be necessary. What data is available shows that proper leverage is not forthcoming in restoration of the front axle weight value as shown on a scale ticket.

Anti-sway is only a vehicle manufacturer recommendation, an option. Not required. It is both separate and secondary to the above requirement.

The Anderson fails to meet the test necessary to be called a weight-distribution hitch.

Irrelevant, then, that the anti-sway is better than friction bar type (since all others are as well).

Spend your money on something that works.

.

Originally Posted by dkottum

slowmover, thanks for the report, although you never seen nor used an Andersen.

doug k

Originally Posted by AWCHIEF

I like a good fiction short story.

Originally Posted by SteveH

Your statement above is incorrect, the Andersen does distribute weight just fine.

Although I've not used the Andersen on a big heavy trailer, I do own one and have used it, which is much more first-hand data than you have, Rednax, or whatever your name is today.

I find it very interesting that only the people that have not used an Andersen say it won't work, while everyone that has used it, love it.

So I say to anyone considering an Andersen, who are you going to believe?????

Originally Posted by purman

I have stayed of the Andersen Thread for some time now, as I got tired of providing data that the hitch did work. It was humorous at first, seeing the NAPKIN engineers throw out numbers. but it just gets old proving them wrong over and over again, with scale numbers, first hand experiences and the real engineers at Andersen that did the work in the beginning.

If you want the simplest hitch to put on, that also controls sway and distributes weight, then give it a try.

If you want to say it doesn't work, then buy one and provide some real data to show it doesn't.

Most of the other thread is a waste for most readers as it is fictional data from a napkin, and peoples opinion that it doesn't work when they have never used it. When you have it hooked up, see it distribute weight or see the scale numbers you know it does work.

I also see Andy for can am was brought up again. Any of us with an Andersen hitches can plainly see he didn't follow the directions and didn't hook it up right. And I never saw another post from him. (But then I quite reading it a while ago.) Not sure what the motivation behind his posts where???

So for those interested, all the speculation has been debunked somewhere in the thread, (if you can sift through it to find it) I have well over 3000 miles on mine and love it.

TWIMC....

Doesn't anyone have any CAT tickets to proooove how well it re-distributes the weight?

Like so....660lbs.


Bob

[HowieE]

Originally Posted by slowmover

O

Show us that data.

I've made mistakes that cost about this much. The wrong TT tires, for instance. But, unlike "Anderson users who love it" wised up and moved on to what actually works.

Do Anderson users also advocate low tire pressure? Below-spec lug nut torque? . . . I needn't try them to know them a bad idea. And I don't confuse opinion for fact.

That it can't even restore front axle weight on a car makes it laughable.

Scan up the CAT Scale tickets, boys. If others think that the function of a WDH is to mitigate trailer sway, then it's on them. To those who can demonstrate understanding, the case is clear when the numbers are in evidence.
.

If you want to see the scale tickets check out post 1066 on the Andersen user thread.

http://www.airforums.com/forums/f464...-92131-77.html

My scale tickets are on there also but at right now i can't locate that post.

O Yes I also suggest lower tire pressure than what is on the sidewall of the tires depending on your trailer weight and number of tires checked against the manufacture inflation chart.

[Road Ruler]

Thanks for the opinion, although you have never seen nor used an Andersen.

With all due respect to the user's/owners of the Andsn.

Many of us have not tried this product for various reasons. My reason is I am perfectly happy/satisfied with my Reese Dual cam.

We don't need to have used it to have an opinion or to comment about it.

We have read the numerous reports, have read about the ongoing issues, and have the right to make our own decisions regarding the product.

In my case I have read enough about it from user's and non user's to know I have no interest in it. It's not that complicated.

[HowieE]

Yes

With any new product there will be issues, questions, and misunderstandings.

Those of you that may be following my thread
http://www.airforums.com/forums/f464...-92131-77.html
Have seen that I had questions and mind exercises before I bought an Andersen. And yes during installation I questioned some of the suggestions in the manual. And yes after installation there was an issue of chain angle. And yes there is currently a question relation to the commonly used Atwood coupler.

Andersen has addressed ever issue that the users have brought up making a superior product even better with the resolution of these questions.

Just got back from a trip to Fl. and the question I now have is I need a verification system to tell me the trailer is still back there because the ride is so smooth I have to use my mirrors often to check it out.

I used a Reese system for close to 40 years and if you have never seen the difference between night and day you will not understand what the users are saying.

[Road Ruler]

I used a Reese system for close to 40 years and if you have never seen the difference between night and day you will not understand what the users are saying.

We are using a Can Am set up. The combination is set up optimally. It is a smooth comfortable drive. I am talking about a one finger on the steering wheel even with a 30MPH cross wind or when semi's pass. I have towed a trailer with a Hensley. I have towed a car on a car hauler with no WDH.
I know what is nice and what is bad.

[HowieE]

Originally Posted by slowmover

Anti-sway is only a vehicle manufacturer recommendation, an option. Not required. It is both separate and secondary to the above requirement.

The Anderson fails to meet the test necessary to be called a weight-distribution hitch.

Irrelevant, then, that the anti-sway is better than friction bar type (since all others are as well).
.

Your information seam to be a bit out of date

In those days when people were towing wit lightly sprung Cars WD was a requirement in order to retain the steering geometry of the front axle. Now with most people towing with some form of truck that is less relevant but still a consideration.

Again now a days the trailer tend to be longer and thus more susceptible to sway.

There is an inherent problem to any of the Cam sway controls that all to often goes unnoticed. The bars are not accurately made to the same length. If the bars are switched side to side this often results in them not sitting completely on the saddle. In this condition the first movement is additive to the sway not subtractive and thus actually adds to the sway.

The friction system built into the Andersen is constant and thus reacts instantly.

[dkottum]

I set my Andersen (and my Equal-I-Zer) according to mfg's instructions, using wheel well measurements. I have driven both thousands of miles and they both work very well, but the Andersen performs much better. I have not seen any need to weigh either one.

I'm not here to PROVE anything on this USER'S thread, just report my installation and experience. You have it as best I can, if you want more buy one, or ask Andersen.

Those who don't want to accept or understand the concept, won't, no matter what information is provided.

doug k

[steveirving]

Hi all, got my anderson hitch . Towing our 24' 59 tradewind with our toyota highlander. System totally controls sway and completely eliminates the rear end sag. Four tires firmly planted. Happy campers.

[themartaman1]

Why do people tell me something is not good when they have never tried one. Are all these people qualified engineers? Or just armchair engineers? I have read everything I can find on the Anderson and that is why I have one. It suits my age and travels perfectly as it does many others. Nothing is perfect. But gone are some of the things that annoyed me. Like the snap crackle and pop of bars when turning or backing up. My little old 1972 Safari is a joy to pull now. Easy to hitch and unhitch.

[steveirving]

Drove on I-70 today towing our tradewind with toyota highlander v6, fully loaded, 65 mph in very windy conditions across ohio. Andersen no sway could not have performed better. Awesome product.