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Old 10-22-2003, 08:02 PM   #29
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Really, Thanks Again!!

i appreciate ALL opinions, and thoughts. I have not been scared off and understand that this is a public forum, but as a new member and hopefully future a/s'er this is a great forum that you have...i 'll be back... as things progress.

marek
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Old 10-22-2003, 08:12 PM   #30
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Good for you, we look forward to hearing how things progress. Addicts like us like nothing better than to drag others down with us I'll let you in on a little secret I didn't realize when I first came here (though you probably have caught on now) - nothing gets people heated up quicker than asking about tow vehicles, unless it's asking which hitch is best. LOTS of opinions, all well intentioned. Then you take them all and do what you want with them. When I was looking for a full size van as a tow vehicle, someone I considered an expert told me don't do it, they're geared all wrong, they're not made to tow, you'll hate it, etc. But you know what? I got one anyway, and we love it. In fact we're heading out this weekend for a little storm-watching at the beach.

Good luck in your search!
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Old 10-23-2003, 10:27 AM   #31
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Re: v6 Ford Explorer haul a 19' bambi ?

Quote:
Originally posted by Marek
Hi,
My wife recently fell in love with Bambi and has started looking for one to call her own. Before going to a dealer I needed to know if anyone is using a v6 suv with a 19' Bambi and how does it do? We have '03 Explorer V6 4x4 with class 3 hitch. The manual states towing limit is around 2500 lbs for this model?

ALso does anyone know what a 03/04 19' Bambi weights?
Having owned both a 99 Bambi and an 02 Explorer I guess I'll stick my nose in.

A 19' Bambi weighs 3600 lbs dry and has a 4500 lb GVWR.

When I bought my Bambi in April 99 I owned a 2WD Ford Ranger pickup with the 4.0 V6 (older pushrod engine-about 160 HP) with a 5-speed manual trans & 3.55 gears. I KNEW that Ford's tow rating for my truck was only 3500 lbs (because of the manual trans, about 5500 lbs with an auto) but I decided to use it anyway. To make matters worse I had replaced the original 225/70-14 tires with a set of 235/75-15s. Solo the truck handled the larger tires OK, but I could definitely tell. I also promised myself that I would change the rear axle ratio after I brought the trailer home.

As expected the truck was a DOG pulling the trailer with the 3.55 gears. So I had a set of 4.10 gears installed and corrected the speedometer (something I had never done for the larger tires). The difference was ABSOLUTELY AMAZING! The truck solo had more power than I ever remembered it having before the tire & wheel swap and the gas mileage stayed about the same.

That truck did a good job with my Bambi. On my first trip (with the trailer) I drove from The San Francisco Bay Area east through Sacramento then took US50 to South Lake Tahoe. I had no trouble keeping up with traffic even while climbing on hwy 50. I ended up replacing the Ranger with a Chevy Silverado for reasons that had very little to do with available power.

I recently owned a 2002 2WD Ford Explorer with the 4.0 V6 (SOHC version-210 HP) with the class V tow package (large receiver, engine & trans coolers, & 3.73 gears). My Explorer was rated to tow about 5,800 lbs. The Explorer had much more power than my Ranger ever did and handled much better. Ford really drops the tow rating for an Explorer without the tow package.

Your Explorer probably has 3.55 gears and 245/65-17 tires. IF you replaced your 3.55 gears with 4.10s (about $12-1500 parts & labor) you would have enough power but you would still have to address things like engine and transmission oil coolers, wiring, and the proper reciever.

If you REALLY like your Explorer than my advise is to bite the bullet and find one with the tow package and trade. If you can afford it I'd recommend the 4.6 V8 as well.
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Old 10-23-2003, 02:15 PM   #32
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The original post states that Marek has a class III hitch on his Explorer, so I assume he has the towing package:

- 3.73 Limited Slip Rear Axle (If Ordered with Advance Trac®, 3.73 Non-Limited Slip Axle is Included)
- 7-Pin Trailer Wiring Harness and Connector; 7-Pin to 4-Pin Adapter
- Frame Mounted Hitch Receiver (Weight Carrying Capacity - 5000 lbs.; Weight Distributing Capacity - 7160 lbs.)
- Engine Oil Cooler (4.0L) with Automatic Transmission
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Old 10-23-2003, 03:21 PM   #33
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Towing experience with a Sport Trac Explorer

Okay, I have an '02 19' Bambi LS (weights just a tad more than the non-LS). I tow with an '02 Explorer Sport Trac which is a beefed up suspension, longer wheelbase (125.9"vs 114"), short bed pickup version of the Explorer SUV. It has the same 210HP 4L V6, with the 5spd auto tranny and the optional 4:10 limited slip rear end. In this setup, I have absolutely NO problems towing the Bambi. Acceleration is brisk and I can tow easily @ 70+MPH. The 5 spd PLUS the 4:10 rear end keep the V6 in its powerband very effectively. I have towed in the Rockys and found NO problem holding 55MPH easily (could even accelerate ever so slowly going uphill). Gas mileage varies from 9MPG @70MPH to 14MPG @ 55MPH. It came with the external coolers for the tranny, engine oil and power steering from the factory. Recently we discovered (21K miles) that the factory tranny cooler was probably a bit too small. The tranny fluid had begun to turn color and the smell was a bit off...all indicators of high temp (smell was NOT indicative of burning due to slippage, but just not quite the normal odor). I am planning to replace the factory cooler with a Hayden Transcooler of a more appropriate capability. I did have to add the class 5 receiver, but that was a simple bolt on installation as the Sport Trac only came with a Class 3 despite its rated towing capacity of 5700#s.

One thing that MIGHT concern me with the '03 Explorer is the fact that the transmission is a new SEALED design. There is not much real world, long term towing experience with this new tranny, but with a larger cooler, you should be okay.


I understand that my Sport Trac is a compromise vehicle, but we love its utility around town, its ability to haul 5 adults and its handy but small truck bed (we have the factory cover and divider). All in all, it does a good job at everything we have required of it. While a compromise, it is not a severe one.
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Old 10-23-2003, 09:00 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally posted by dmac
The original post states that Marek has a class III hitch on his Explorer, so I assume he has the towing package:

- 3.73 Limited Slip Rear Axle (If Ordered with Advance Trac®, 3.73 Non-Limited Slip Axle is Included)
- 7-Pin Trailer Wiring Harness and Connector; 7-Pin to 4-Pin Adapter
- Frame Mounted Hitch Receiver (Weight Carrying Capacity - 5000 lbs.; Weight Distributing Capacity - 7160 lbs.)
- Engine Oil Cooler (4.0L) with Automatic Transmission
Not so! 2002 or newer Explorers come standard with a Class III receiver (1 1/4").

If you order the towing package you get all the items mentioned plus a class IV/V receiver (2").
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Old 10-23-2003, 09:58 PM   #35
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Standard Explorer comes with a Class II hitch. The Class III/IV hitch is an option. See Fords Web Page
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Old 02-04-2004, 09:46 PM   #36
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Funny, months later after all the discussion, the Ford Explorer, for all its refinements is the number "2" in the rollover category (a rating of 4 is the least likely to roll). All that fancy new sheetmetal and fancy suspension which was suppose to make it more stable than the previous generation seemed to have proven me right in the end. Glad it works for some, but me, I'm feeling pretty vindicated here! Of course now would be the time to see what posts disappear and/or get modified.

http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/NCAP/Cars/2750.html

And before you say the 2004 4x2 Sport Trak is a different beast, take a look under the sheet metal and you'll find a surprisingly similar vehicle.
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Old 02-04-2004, 10:12 PM   #37
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ford explorer

We rent U-Haul at our garage. 2 weeks ago we received a notice from U-Haul Corp. stating that 'U-Haul will no longer rent a tow behind to anyone towing with an Explorer' This included 6' to 14' enclosed trailer, tow dollies, car trailers and open trailers. Looks like they don't want any liabilty from roll over. Just FYI

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Old 02-05-2004, 01:19 AM   #38
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One more time... towing capacity is a marketing gimmick! YOUR vehicle and family are unique.

Fuel your Explorer up, load it with all the people, pets, and cargo that will be in it when you tow, and take it to a CAT Scale. Get a weight ticket that gives you the ACTUAL front (steer) axle weight, rear (drive) axle weight, and total weight. Details on how to do that are posted elsewhere on this forum.

Find your Explorer's Gross Combined Weight Rating (GCWR). If it's the same as an '04 V6 4Dr 4WD Explorer w/tow package, it's 10,000 lbs. This is the MOST that your loaded Explorer AND the wet and loaded trailer (i.e. it's GVWR) can weigh. Subtract the ACTUAL total weight you found from the GCWR, and that's how much wet and loaded trailer your Explorer can PULL... decently on flat land. If you want really good performance in the mountains, use 80% of the GCWR.

Then look in the door jamb for the Explorer's Gross Vehicle Weight Rating (GVWR). If yours is like a '04, it's 5888 lbs. Subtract the ACTUAL total weight and this is how much wet and loaded tongue weight your Explorer can CARRY... as long as that much, when added to the ACTUAL rear (drive) axle weight doesn't exceed the rear Gross Axle Weight Rating (GAWR).

The tongue weight should be at least 10% of the wet and loaded weight of the trailer, so that's 450 lbs or more for a 4500 lb trailer.

You can sit here all day and listen to opinions from people who don't own YOUR Explorer, carrying YOUR family, OR you can GET THE FACTS FOR YOURSELF!
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Old 02-05-2004, 06:51 AM   #39
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Once More......

Well said, Moe.

Ain't nothin' like knowin' the facts of the matter.
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Old 02-05-2004, 07:20 AM   #40
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Question

I see clearly Moe's point as it's been made ever so eloquently before, but I fail to see how it is applicable in the current context of the conversation. Agree with him or not, no one is talking about tow capacities at this point (those converstations were had in October-- months ago). The converstion currently is simply about the rollover and U-Haul not renting to Explorers.

I've sent you a PM Maurice.
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Old 02-05-2004, 09:04 AM   #41
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Woah!

Thread Police!

With what? To where? With whom?

Isn't the title of this thread is "v6 Ford Explorer haul a 19' bambi "?

Granted, most of the conservation was in late October, but Moe's comments DID bring up the previously undiscussed (on this thread) importance of obtaining an accurate weight.

If my recollection of Physics 101 is correct, the LATERAL stability of a tow vehicle/trailer is of much more importance than rollover tendency of the tow.

Granted, a top heavy vehicle makes for a much less desirable tow vehicle than one with a low center of gravity for several reasons, but, in truth, one of the first questions a trial lawyer is going to ask during litigation following a vehicle (and trailer) accident is -- was the vehicle/trailer loaded beyond the approved capacities as stated by the manufacturers?

Does anyone know of ANY written vertical Center of Gravity specifications issued by a RV or auto/light truck manufacturer?

Anyone towing a trailer, with both the tow vehicle and the trailer loaded within the manufacturers limits, should have some comfort factor (within the limitations of common sense) that the combination is "safe" to take on the highway. Conversely, any time a "rig" is loaded beyond the stated weight (and balance) limitations, regardless of the modifications applied to the tow vehicle, the hitch, or the trailer, the "safety" and roadability of the tow/trailer combination are jeopardized.

As Moe stated, Safety should be the first factor in the decision process to take a vehicle (and family) on the road. Adherence to the stated manufacturers load limits is the primary means ANY driver (whether experienced or first time) has to develop a comfort level that the “rig” will do what it is supposed to do.

In the absence of a “Rollover Measurement Meter”, or more (unwanted) Government interference in the guise of “safety” regulations, Maurice’s comments were (IMHO) entirely appropriate.

Of equal importance, Whistler simply stated that U-Haul would not rent to an Explorer tow vehicle.

No reason for the denial of rent was cited.

At this time do we know if the reason was, in truth, rollover prompted? Perhaps the tire issue? Simple demographics? Or even a frame/hitch problem?
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Old 02-05-2004, 09:47 AM   #42
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I think everyone has some valid points and certainly have a right to their own opinion. I have been impressed with the thought to always error on the side of safety even if it means more time and money.
I was really impressed by reading the posts of FEMUSE. I believe They currently have a '98 International 4700. Their thoughts are not only on pulling but also on stopping. I think their guiding post is bigger is better. I took their thoughts to heart and bought a 3/4 ton club cab long bed dodge cummins diesel pickup. Then we purchased our '01 Bambi. We went coast to coast, mountains,hills etc. and never worried or had cause to worry about pulling, stopping or passing, big rigs etc. When we went out it was never a concern and we always enjoyed the ride. I attribute that to folks like FEMUSE giving their experiences. We didn't want to have to be concerned when going out (enough to be concerned with at work and at home). I think part of our Airstreaming is to be relaxed and comfortable before heading back to the craziness of life. If you can do the same with what ever you pull with, that is wonderful too.
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