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Old 07-03-2015, 06:55 AM   #141
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Those things were mentioned.
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Old 07-03-2015, 07:10 AM   #142
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It is obvious that this guys truck was too small for the trailer.🙈
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Old 07-03-2015, 07:13 AM   #143
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Add to that possibly a driver's false sense of security due to Airstreams being "best towing, easiest towing, most aerodynamic trailers" which perform through the slalom...


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Old 07-03-2015, 07:14 AM   #144
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Even with all its attributes, an Airstream is still 8,800# dead weight behind you-


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Old 07-03-2015, 07:33 AM   #145
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If I implied anything….

It was that I think a tow vehicle with a longer wheel base is safer. A 3/4 ton has a better chance of not being pushed around by a trailer than a 1/2 ton truck.

I know not what caused these accidents. With our original information, I suspected downhill speed/curve/braking combination. When I read that it was a straight away, I was baffled and a little scared. Yesterday I bought four new tires for my tow vehicle.

I had never heard, suspected, or imagined, that a tow vehicle blowout, stood a chance of flipping said vehicle.

I did know that rollovers are very dangerous. Fatal neck injuries, and ejection could happen.
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Old 07-03-2015, 07:37 AM   #146
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These two roll overs and "debate" aside

This thread is important……..it might save a life

take away messages…… go slow downhill-gentle on the brakes
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Old 07-03-2015, 07:50 AM   #147
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What really matters is....

It really doesn't matter whether the TV is big, small, heavy, light, fat, skinny or tall.

What really matters is how well it handles the load!

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Old 07-03-2015, 07:55 AM   #148
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Good driving habits/skills is a key component.
Some people just can't drive- not even a Radio Flyer red wagon-


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Old 07-03-2015, 08:05 AM   #149
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1/2 ton versus 3/4 ton.

Hi, this is getting beat to death with basic terms and statements about how a 3/4 ton truck is better than a 1/2 ton truck. Let's get this straight; For an example there is a forum member who tows a bigger trailer than mine with a 3/4 ton truck that has a lower tow rating and a lower payload than my F-150. There are 3/4 ton trucks with a shorter wheel base than mine. And there are 3/4 ton trucks with less power than mine. Not all 3/4 ton trucks are crew cab, long bed, diesels. And the bigger brakes Etc are for taking care of the 2000 lbs of heavier truck.

So specs are specs and not all trucks are the same. A 3/4 ton truck is not the answer to everything.

Now back to my Kenworth towing my 16' Bambi.
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Old 07-03-2015, 08:12 AM   #150
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Here's some actual tests by a 40-year Airstream dealership of light and heavy tow vehicles and their handling characteristics.

Can-Am RV Centre | Your Towing Experts
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Old 07-03-2015, 08:27 AM   #151
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dznf0g View Post
I also think ASes give many a false sense of "sports car like" handling. How many times do we read of those driving 70, 75, 80 mph....and "I don't even know it's back there".

FALSE

It's back there and has a lot of mass, crude brakes (compared to autos), crude suspension (compared to autos). It WILL wag the dog, when push comes to shove...no pun intended.

Best to the point explanation! Thank you.
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Old 07-03-2015, 08:37 AM   #152
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ROBERTSUNRUS View Post
Hi, this is getting beat to death with basic terms and statements about how a 3/4 ton truck is better than a 1/2 ton truck. Let's get this straight; For an example there is a forum member who tows a bigger trailer than mine with a 3/4 ton truck that has a lower tow rating and a lower payload than my F-150. There are 3/4 ton trucks with a shorter wheel base than mine. And there are 3/4 ton trucks with less power than mine. Not all 3/4 ton trucks are crew cab, long bed, diesels. And the bigger brakes Etc are for taking care of the 2000 lbs of heavier truck.

So specs are specs and not all trucks are the same. A 3/4 ton truck is not the answer to everything.

Now back to my Kenworth towing my 16' Bambi.

The 2011 Ford E350 Superduty (one ton) has an 8,800# GVW and 10,000# towing capacity. A 2006 Chevy Express 2500 (3/4 ton) has a GVW of 8,600# and a towing capacity of 10,000#. The Express handles better because it has a longer wheelbase and more modern steering, braking and suspension.
My Tundra (1/2 ton) has bigger brakes and a higher towing capacity than either of those.
The ratings are often fluff and puff, advertising, smoke and mirrors, marketing, etc.


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Old 07-03-2015, 09:00 AM   #153
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We didn't get a 3/4 8.1 Burb 'cuz it was a 3/4 8.1 Burb, we got it for the room, payload, and the roof was long enough for the fishing boat.


We take stuff, a lot of stuff, we like stuff.


People & dogs too....


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Old 07-03-2015, 09:05 AM   #154
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ROBERT CROSS View Post
and the roof was long enough for the fishing boat.


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Old 07-03-2015, 10:44 AM   #155
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Quote:
Originally Posted by m.hony View Post
The 2011 Ford E350 Superduty (one ton) has an 8,800# GVW and 10,000# towing capacity. A 2006 Chevy Express 2500 (3/4 ton) has a GVW of 8,600# and a towing capacity of 10,000#. The Express handles better because it has a longer wheelbase and more modern steering, braking and suspension.
My Tundra (1/2 ton) has bigger brakes and a higher towing capacity than either of those.
The ratings are often fluff and puff, advertising, smoke and mirrors, marketing, etc.


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You are comparing two vans to your Toyota pickup???
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Old 07-03-2015, 11:37 AM   #156
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Yep. It is rated 1/2 ton but with bigger brakes and more towing capacity.
My point is that the Ford 1 ton and the GM 1 ton are about the same.
The Ford Econoline 1 ton is 8,800# GVW.
The GM Express/Savana 1 ton is 9,600# GVW.
My point is the advertising hype, etc. of the manufacturers' ratings.
My point is that you don't have to have a 3/4 ton or 1 ton to safely tow an Airstream trailer (or an SOB under 10,000#).
My trailer ready to camp is 8,800#.
The advertised towing capacity, albeit inflated, of the Tundra is 11,400#. I don't know what the real capacity, but it handles the 8,800# just fine.
I can't tell a nickel's worth of difference from my Tundra to a Duramax/Allison, and I've towed a cargo trailer and a car hauling trailer (in addition to travel trailers) all over the whole United States.
A nod to the half ton:
"Push/pull" on the steering wheel for control is easier in a half ton- it gets there quicker with less push/pull-
I can't really say any one rides any smoother or tougher, because we have some one ton duallies in the fleet that ride luxury car smooth.
If I am a fleet manager over a fleet of 300 GM HD trucks, and I still choose a Toyota, either I'm convinced or just plain stoopid/dumb as a rock/ dim as a 2 watt light bulb-
I do have repair records for all the GM and Ford trucks in the fleet. I also have repair records for my Tundra.
No GM or Ford product has as big a back seat or rear doors.
As for as comparing a pickup and vans- the components are mostly the same within a particular manufacturer- the Silverado and Sierra share many components with the Express/Savana.


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Old 07-03-2015, 11:37 AM   #157
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Two Airstream rollovers in a month

Quote:
Originally Posted by m.hony View Post
The 2011 Ford E350 Superduty (one ton) has an 8,800# GVW and 10,000# towing capacity. A 2006 Chevy Express 2500 (3/4 ton) has a GVW of 8,600# and a towing capacity of 10,000#. The Express handles better because it has a longer wheelbase and more modern steering, braking and suspension.
My Tundra (1/2 ton) has bigger brakes and a higher towing capacity than either of those.
The ratings are often fluff and puff, advertising, smoke and mirrors, marketing, etc.


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Tow rating many times are a product of engine, rear axle, and transmission options. So for example my 3/4 ton GMC Savana van had tow ratings all the way from 6,500 lbs to 9,900 lbs. all the 3/4 ton GMC vans had the same frames, wheels and brakes. The key was the engine, tranny, and rear axle choices. I went for the max which resulted in the 6 liter gas engine and the 4.10 rear axle along with the HD transmission.

I owned a half ton Chevy van prior and the upgrade to the 3/4 ton GMC was very noticeable relative to handling and its ability to handle dips and uneven pavement. Ride quality in the half ton while not towing is much better. When towing the 3/4 ton is more comfortable.

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Old 07-03-2015, 11:55 AM   #158
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I have no idea what caused these accidents but the immediate assumption that it was the size of the TV is speculative at best.

as was immediately pointed out in the first post, overloaded past the GVWR in both cases was the likely cause. the poster then went on to explain that with a bigger tow vehicle, you get more GVWR head room. it really is that simple.

when you choose a Mercedes SUV or a 1/2 ton PU, you had better be paying very close attention to your load limits. having a 3/4 or 1 ton PU gives you way more 'head room' in load capacity.

personally, i don't drive slalom courses with my tow and don't intend to start, neat marketing gimmick is all that was.

so unless you are extremely careful, each and every time you load up and go, it is going to be far easier to exceed the GVWR for your SUV or 1/2 ton tow vehicle than you think.

that is the simple message here, nothing more.

as far as the propane refrigerator, that is an abomination on the part of Airstream. your 7 prong plug already has a 12ga wire for passing current to the tow, more than sufficient to run a 3 way refrigerator. now maybe back in the 50s the auto generator could not keep up, but that is hardly the case today. this is just another 'wart' on the manufacturing of these trailers and one that can be a major safety hazard in accidents like the ones that started this thread. can you smell a law suite on this one?????
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Old 07-03-2015, 01:01 PM   #159
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jcanavera View Post
Tow rating many times are a product of engine, rear axle, and transmission options. So for example my 3/4 ton GMC Savana van had tow ratings all the way from 6,500 lbs to 9,900 lbs. all the 3/4 ton GMC vans had the same frames, wheels and brakes. The key was the engine, tranny, and rear axle choices. I went for the max which resulted in the 6 liter gas engine and the 4.10 rear axle along with the HD transmission.

I owned a half ton Chevy van prior and the upgrade to the 3/4 ton GMC was very noticeable relative to handling and its ability to handle dips and uneven pavement. Ride quality in the half ton while not towing is much better. When towing the 3/4 ton is more comfortable.

Jack

This is true.
The 2011 Ford Econoline did not have a sturdy enough transmission.
We bought 14 of them in 2011 and replaced the transmission in every one twice before 100,000 miles.
This caused us to buy a bunch of 3/4 ton and 1 ton Duramax/Allison trucks- the right tool for the job-
That is another ket point- Is it the right tool for the job? Will it hold up to what you intend to do with it? Will it last without breaking down repeatedly?
My Tundra has done well in all areas-


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Old 07-03-2015, 01:01 PM   #160
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There has been a large gap in available tow vehicle power and load capacity between typical 1/2 and 3/4 ton trucks, and this gap is where mid-size to the largest Airstreams are best suited. For most Airstreamers, not all.

Ford is making progress with lighter aluminum bodies, more load capacity and turbo-charged gas engines with a broad tongue range. Ram has a small diesel and very compliant suspensions. Chev/GMC is offering higher load capacity as an option. Titan plans to introduce a small Cummins diesel.

These vehicles are nearing the ideal power and load capacity of our mid-size to large Airstreams for most of us. I suspect in the near future we won't need to bash each others light or heavy duty pickups, most of us will be in-between when towing our Airstream is the primary reason we own a pickup. Some are there already.
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