Truck Shopping and Miss Information.

[tjdonahoe]

Originally Posted by jimfa440

I had a Fiat 1500 (Ram) and dumped it. Boy was I disappointed. Empty and unhitched, it rode like a Caddie, hooked up....it was bullied by the AS.

.........you bought a car...undersized....3/4 ton is what was needed..I have owned a few 1/2 pickups...just grocery getters my 3/4 ton pickups were great.as is my two rams with te 6.7...

[smmckean]

Originally Posted by CWSWine

We are currently researching the possibilities of going from a Class A Diesel Pusher to Classic 33FB. We spent today truck shopping and couldn't believe the recommendations that salesman gave us and all the miss information from Sales Managers that should know better. One Sales Manager told us the RV trailers are perfectly balanced from the factory and should have zero tongue weight and the people that don't know how to properly load RV for travel cause weight on the tongue and endangering people on the road. Another one told use that tongue weight doesn't count against payload.

The first thing I would say to salesman man is the GVWR is 10,000 pounds and the unloaded tongue is 1175 pounds. All four dealers pointed me to half ton trucks. Every half ton we looked at had less than 1250 hitch rating with WD and payload under 1700 pounds payload rating and one had payload of 1150 pounds. We have found 1 Ton Diesels with the sticker on the hitch raing it with WD at 1250 to 1900 pounds of coarse the payloads we more than I would need.

We would like to have enough payload for a golfcart or side by side in the bed of the truck so we going straight to the 1 ton diesel just so we don't have to worry about payload. We have found two used trucks on a 2017 Chevy High Country with 3300 pounds payload and with WD 1500 pound hitch rating and 2016 Ford F350 with a 3600 pound payload and hitch with WD at 1900 pounds.
My first impression is the ride is much better in the Chevy and the level of cabin noise is lot less in the Chevy. One more test drive tomorrow and we going to check out a GMC Denali

I am pulling my Classic 33FB with a 2017 Ford F350 6.7 Diesel (4.10 Ratio). We travelled all over the west (through the Rockies) last summer without issue 11.5-13 mpg.

Your decision is to gear properly....I prefer not to caught of the side of the road or underpowered (when passing the diesel still has acceleration after 65-70mph when the cars will not let you return your lane.) The transmission will hold your load and control you speed on steep declines like Wolf Creek Pass, Colorado.

It is better to spend a few extra bucks now than to be in a situation with inferior equipment and wishing you had made a better choice.

[Hittenstiehl]

That control panel looks very busy. I looked at it again and agree the AC and air and fan buttons are all over the place.

I was really intrigued by the vehicle that was pictured in the image and could not figure out what it was they were backing up to. then I realized it was a split screen and it was each side of the truck.

Lots to get used to in a couple of years since we're driving a 16 year old truck. (that's still doing very well)

[jcanavera]

I am a little curious but I see a lot of pickup trucks as part of my part time job. Do any of you notice that the Ram pickups of fairly newer vintage carry a lot of rust at the top of the rear wheel area. I don't have any scientific numbers but it just seems like it doesn't take a lot of years before that upper rear wheel area starts showing the bubbled paint indicating rust coming from the inside out. Maybe I'm just seeing more Rams than the others in my neck of the woods. I know that other than that area the Rams I see with this are fairly well maintained otherwise. If I were out looking for a pickup and knowing we use a lot of salt in the winter, whether I might pass on the Ram just on that aspect alone.

Jack

[CWSWine]

I guess I got one that was built on Tuesday after a long holiday weekend We have had it to the factory 3 times and twice for the slide leaking that stills leaks. We get between 6 and 7 miles to the gallon and to keep the warranty intact we bring to Freightliner for service that runs 800 to 1000 a year with all the re-torques, lube, filter, and oil. We have spent close to. 5,000 dollars in the last year of. ownership. Now that said I'm in the minority of Discovery owners, most have the usual problems but ours just don't seem like they are never-ending. The AS we will both drive the truck and the Class A only one of does all the driving.

Originally Posted by mikextr

@CWSwine

Just curious. Why are you switching from the diesel pusher to a bumper pull trailer? I've been considering the opposite and may get a diesel pusher with a toad.

[uncle_bob]

Originally Posted by StanA

According to the stats provided by the SmartWeigh people, over 50% of 50,000+ weighed RVs are over capacity in some area - axle weight, gvwr, etc.

Hi

You also see numbers like "90% of rigs checked were set up wrong" in some places. Dig a little and 80% of that 90% were "wrong" because tire pressure in each tire of the TV and trailer had not been individually adjusted to be "just right" (not too much pressure and not too little pressure, set perfect for that number of pounds of load). Oddly enough the only way to get that right in the real world would be to use their weighing service every single time you load things up. Strange how that works out .... I'll live with my tires being 5 psi over optimum pressure and wearing out 2,000 miles early.

Bob

[gypsydad]

Originally Posted by CWSWine

We are currently researching the possibilities of going from a Class A Diesel Pusher to Classic 33FB. We spent today truck shopping and couldn't believe the recommendations that salesman gave us and all the miss information from Sales Managers that should know better. One Sales Manager told us the RV trailers are perfectly balanced from the factory and should have zero tongue weight and the people that don't know how to properly load RV for travel cause weight on the tongue and endangering people on the road. Another one told use that tongue weight doesn't count against payload.

The first thing I would say to salesman man is the GVWR is 10,000 pounds and the unloaded tongue is 1175 pounds. All four dealers pointed me to half ton trucks. Every half ton we looked at had less than 1250 hitch rating with WD and payload under 1700 pounds payload rating and one had payload of 1150 pounds. We have found 1 Ton Diesels with the sticker on the hitch raing it with WD at 1250 to 1900 pounds of coarse the payloads we more than I would need.

We would like to have enough payload for a golfcart or side by side in the bed of the truck so we going straight to the 1 ton diesel just so we don't have to worry about payload. We have found two used trucks on a 2017 Chevy High Country with 3300 pounds payload and with WD 1500 pound hitch rating and 2016 Ford F350 with a 3600 pound payload and hitch with WD at 1900 pounds.
My first impression is the ride is much better in the Chevy and the level of cabin noise is lot less in the Chevy. One more test drive tomorrow and we going to check out a GMC Denali

Ford changed suspension and cabin in the 3/4-1T PU's in 2017; night and day difference in the ride over the 16' and older Fords..I love my 2017 F250 ride and the power/performance of the diesel...that being said, the 2500 -3500 GM or Dodge are fine trucks also; many here tout the price and ride of the Dodge...which ever one you choose, just don't go underpowered for towing a 33'; go for the diesel and max payload if your planning on carrying around a UTV in the bed especially.

[jeffmc306]

Originally Posted by tbashin

What a wanky control set up. Buttons for the A/C are scattered all around that module.

tbashin, it takes a while to get use to the 12" display - my '19 Ram 1500 came with it. I would have been fine with the 8.4" which has conventional HVAC control knobs.

That said, after using it for 6 months, I like option to go full screen on NAV or split the screen and show any combination like NAV + radio.

By the way, if you look at the left side next to the radio you'll see there are dedicated HVAC control buttons. I hit "Auto" once and never touch it except for the temp then touch the physical up or down buttons. The Ram UConnect system is very intuitive.

Old dog (I'm 64 yrs old), new tricks!

[NY24]

By Federal Law, manufacturers of vehicles that are intended / expected to tow something MUST have available, a Towing Guide. Sadly, this is a VERY well kept secret. You MUST ASK for a Tow Guide; I've never heard of Tow Guides being on display racks. The Towing Guide is the BIBLE for what a given model can do. It will have ALL the numbers for ALL of the variations (regular cab, extended cab, crew cab, short / long bed etc, etc, etc). The Towing Guide is basically what that manufacturer's engineers say the capacities and capabilities of a specific vehicle are. Apparently, some salespeople are unaware that Towing Guides exist (and I suspect other salesman are told to NOT tell customers that Towing Guides exist).

PS: I just did a quick Google search. I was able to find the Towing Guide for Ford trucks. Here's a link: https://www.fleet.ford.com/towing-guides/

[Texasdiver]

What percentage of trucks sold today are actually ever used to tow anything? I'm guessing pretty low. And then of those, what percentage tow anything larger than a ski boat 15 miles to the local lake? Or even ever carry more payload than a mountain bike or IKEA dresser?

I'm guessing the percentage of trucks ever used for maximum capacity long distance towing is pretty tiny. So it doesn't surprise me that a majority of models sold today aren't really optimized for that purpose. The manufacturers probably make a lot more money on high-end sound systems than they do on towing features.

[CWSWine]

Towing Guides are just that “Guides” the numbers are based off a zero option truck and will be different for each truck. Even the towing capacity is variable and the only way you know your true towing capacity is the weight your truck loaded ready to camp and subtract it from the GCWR to find out the true towing capacity. The payload numbers are also based on a stripped truck and that is why in the notes in the “Towing Guide” it says “must not cause vehicle weights to exceed the rear GAWR (Gross Axle Weight Rating) or GVWR (Gross Vehicle Weight Rating). These ratings can be found on the vehicle’s Safety Compliance Certification Label”

Here is a video put out by the RV Safety that been weighing trucks/RV since the ’90s and the ones that come to most rallies.

https://rvsafety.com/rv-education/ma...ks-to-trailers

Originally Posted by NY24

By Federal Law, manufacturers of vehicles that are intended / expected to tow something MUST have available, a Towing Guide. Sadly, this is a VERY well kept secret. You MUST ASK for a Tow Guide; I've never heard of Tow Guides being on display racks. The Towing Guide is the BIBLE for what a given model can do. It will have ALL the numbers for ALL of the variations (regular cab, extended cab, crew cab, short / long bed etc, etc, etc). The Towing Guide is basically what that manufacturer's engineers say the capacities and capabilities of a specific vehicle are. Apparently, some salespeople are unaware that Towing Guides exist (and I suspect other salesman are told to NOT tell customers that Towing Guides exist).

PS: I just did a quick Google search. I was able to find the Towing Guide for Ford trucks. Here's a link: https://www.fleet.ford.com/towing-guides/

[SilverWind]

Never trust Miss Information.

[ForteePlus]

I see NY24 beat me to it as I was going to recommend the Ford Towing Guide. We’re leaning heavily toward an F250 so been reading it. However, there is a lot of good general info and explanation of terms etc regarding towing not specific to Ford. I expect the other mfr’s have one available too, but never looked.

[out of sight]

RAM has a towing spec sheet where they give the weights of all their different configurations. Of course you have to add in the weights of all the optional equipment you want. What is helpful is that they give the axle base weights so you can easily calculate the effect of dropping a certain tongue weight onto the ball and you can get a good picture of how the truck will be loaded before you buy it.

[jcl]

Originally Posted by NY24

By Federal Law, manufacturers of vehicles that are intended / expected to tow something MUST have available, a Towing Guide.

Can you cite a reference for this?

I did a quick check of the FMVSS contents and the word guide appeared twice, the word towing did not appear at all. Maybe it is a different Federal vehicle safety standards organization that you are referring to.

The word trailer appears many times, usually in reference to lighting requirements, etc.

I would be interested to read the law that requires an advisory guide be published, based on a vague definition of whether a vehicle is expected to tow a trailer or not, and given that the guides I have read are not specific.

[CWSWine]

The towing guides are just guides. The numbers to pay attention to are the GAWR, GVWR, and GCWR. Payload numbers and Max Towing Capacity depends on the truck's weight loaded and ready to camp weights with driver and passengers in the truck.



GVWR -minus- Cat Scale Weight = Payload capacity



GCWR -minus- Cat Scale Weight = Max Towing Capacity


Check out the. video I post above and it explains all the critical numbers.

[Douglas Fir]

We’ve trailered a 25 foot Nash across Canada and then around the US (2 trips).
Now we have a Flying Cloud 30.
We never had any problems towing the Nash
And when we towed the AS home ( includes hwy, city and ferry), we (especially the driver) notice how much easier the 30 ft AS was to pull, compared to the NASH.
Driver kept looking back to be sure trailer was still attached, it was that much smoother than the 25 Nash 23d.
Go figure.
Either way, our Ford F-150 (gas) with eco boost has never given us problems.
We also had a tow package with it

[bhayden]

Not on the flying cloud edge of tech but I'm guessing FB doesn't stand for Flying Brick. Not surprised that a sales droid would try to sell you something inappropriate. Slightly surprised they be trying to down sell you but obviously that's what they needed to move.


Dumping way more than what we spent on our 1st house (albeit that 30 years ago) on a truck, I'd be doing my own research and only talk to the sales droid when I had a price in mind and was ready to beat them down to that point... or I walk and buy my 2nd choice. And yes, if you're wondering about my religious convictions, if the Ford dealer jerked me around I'd go write a check to the Dodge/Chevy/Fiat dealer.

[NCMEDIC]

Originally Posted by mikextr

@CWSwine

Just curious. Why are you switching from the diesel pusher to a bumper pull trailer? I've been considering the opposite and may get a diesel pusher with a toad.

I was wondering just the same thing.

[CWSWine]

Here is the thread I start about the switch from DP to AS

http://www.airforums.com/forums/f540...as-197093.html

Originally Posted by NCMEDIC

I was wondering just the same thing.