Toyota Tundra as a Tow Vehicle

[macofpei]

Thank you for starting this thread. I have been looking for a TV since I bought my AS in Oct. I stopped into the local Toyota dealer and was really surprised at the cost of a new Truck. The Gms and Dodges I have been looking at are $$$$$ more.
I know I should buy North American but I am not rich and if I want to enjoy my "later life" I have to save where I can. The Toyota seems like my best bet.
Again, Thank you to all who posted.

[Wingeezer]

Originally Posted by evsjr

I was recently rear-ended by an 18-wheeler (trailer not in tow) which ended the towing career of my Cadillac ESV Escalade. I tow a 2007 27 FB Classic. I am fully aware that I towed at the edge with the Escalade, but carefully controlled loading and never had any problems. However, I am considering replacing the Escalade with the Tundra with 5.7 liter engine and 6-speed transmission. The listed tow rating of this truck is 10,100 lbs. My 27-footer typically weighs in at about 6,600 lbs (NOT counting 800 lbs on the tongue), but is rated up to 9,000 lbs.... can't imagine loading to that limit.

All of my weights are within the advertised capacity of the Tundra with 15 to 20 percent margin.

The truck will become my daily driver and I prefer not going to a 2500 HD Dodge/Chevy/Ford. Have cosidered a 2500 Suburban or GMC, but Toyota looks more user friendly for me.

Any knowledge, experience, or advice out there?

Thanks, Bud (evsjr)

Unless you have already done so, something you might want to check is the CGVWR (combined gross vehicle weight rating) of the Tundra.

I recently bought a 2005 Classic 30, my first AS. Before I bought it, I was already pretty convinced from what I had read on this forum that I would need a 3/4ton truck to pull it comfortably and safely, so I was prepared.

At the time I owned a 1/2 ton Sierra 4x4 extended cab that was fine for my last trailer.

I pulled the AS home from Ohio with my 1/2 ton. It was ok, but not at all the relaxed towing I had with my previous smaller trailer.

The GVW of the AS was within the limits of my 1/2 tons rated towing ability, but when i checked the truck's CGVW, i found that when towing the AS, I was 1000# over the Sierra's rated value.

Since then I have bought a new diesel 2500HD. It won't be quite as convenient as a daily driver, but I'm ok with that. I believe it will be a great match with the AS.

I have been convinced by the old adage I have seen quoted on this forum,

"Better to have more truck than you need than to need more truck than you have!"

I looked briefly at the Toyota trucks but in the end had to rule them out in my case. The dry wt of my trailer is about 7200# and the GVW is 8750#.

[78GussyTX]

"I know I should buy North American but I am not rich and if I want to enjoy my "later life" I have to save where I can."
--
No worries, the Toyota Tundra is made in San Antonio, TX.
--
"I looked briefly at the Toyota trucks but in the end had to rule them out in my case. The dry wt of my trailer is about 7200# and the GVW is 8750#."
--
My Tundra has a towing capacity of 10,800. The Sierra might be different.

If you buy a Tundra and you have a family, I recommend the Crew Cab SR5. The back seat is HUGE. And one neat feature, the side mirrors slide out, you just pull them straight out and you have extended view when pulling, and slide them in when you are done. How cool is that?

[OhScottyOh]

The CGVWR of 08 Tundra Crew Max 4x4 is 16000 lbs.

[Wingeezer]

Originally Posted by 78GussyTX

"I know I should buy North American but I am not rich and if I want to enjoy my "later life" I have to save where I can."
--
No worries, the Toyota Tundra is made in San Antonio, TX.
--
"I looked briefly at the Toyota trucks but in the end had to rule them out in my case. The dry wt of my trailer is about 7200# and the GVW is 8750#."
--
My Tundra has a towing capacity of 10,800. The Sierra might be different.

If you buy a Tundra and you have a family, I recommend the Crew Cab SR5. The back seat is HUGE. And one neat feature, the side mirrors slide out, you just pull them straight out and you have extended view when pulling, and slide them in when you are done. How cool is that?

Yep, I wasn't concerned about your towing ability, My old 1/2 ton Sierra was also adequate in that respect - but only just.

Where my old truck fell short was in CGVWR.

I'm not sure how important that is, but my Sierra fell 1000 pounds short in that respect when towing my AS.

I don't know about the Tundra in combination with your trailer. Just thought you might want to check it out to be sure is is within Toyota's specs before plunking down your $$!

Brian.

[t walgamuth]

Originally Posted by Scotty Oh

Hi Tod, The only limits will be the GVWR of the Tundra. I am towing an 08 FB Safari SE but I changed out the mattress for a Tempurpedic, must add 200 to 300 lbs to the tongue, about 1100 tongue wt. I am pretty much fulltime so bed is very important. With TV and AS fully loaded there is about 14K rolling. Going across the Cascade Mts. I have to the check my mirror to see if AS still there. Thanksgiving we drove to Bend over highway 58, Willamatte Pass, set the cruise at 55, speed limit, and let her go. Had to watch the speed on the 40 mph curves, which 45 felt good, and was back up to 55 at the touch of the resume. On the downhill side the speed control downshifts to hold back on speed. Only had to brake on some of the slow curves.
I have 4K/5K on AS and 7K on Tundra averaging 11-12 mpg towing. I am in no hurry, so I keep it down to 55-60. Worst milage on the flats was coming down the Columbia Gorge with a 50 mph head wind, 8 mpg.

Do you calculate your own fuel mileage or use the computer? And have you checked your odomter against the mile markers?

[purman]

Some people say the computer is off. I checked mine a few times on trips and it was off by about .1 to .3 mpg off. Which isn't to bad, because when you refill your tank you can never get the same amount in unless you fill it to the very very top. And that makes a mess so I don't do it. Or you drive till you run out and use gas cans to refill. Yeah I want to do that...

[Gene]

Originally Posted by Scotty Oh

Hi Tod, The only limits will be the GVWR of the Tundra. I am towing an 08 FB Safari SE but I changed out the mattress for a Tempurpedic, must add 200 to 300 lbs to the tongue, about 1100 tongue wt.
I have 4K/5K on AS and 7K on Tundra averaging 11-12 mpg towing.

I disagree Scotty about the "only limits". Payload is the first limit you'll run into with the Tundra. I should've checked to see which Tundra you have (if it's somewhere to be found on the Forum), but on mine it's 1,560 lbs (4wd, double cab, 5.7 L engine). Besides the tongue weight, add in the Airstream spare tire and the weight of the propane (propane: 60 lbs.) plus your added bed weight (if the Tempurpedic weighs an extra 200-300 lbs. what's in it? Lead? How would you get such a heavy item in there?), then for the truck: fuel, coolant, you, spouse(s), children, friends, cargo such as generator, weight distributing system (Equalizer, Hensley, Reese, etc.), all that other stuff that accumulates. I think you find you're near or over the payload.

I have no doubt it'll tow it and feel ok, but there's got to be a price for exceeding the capacity of the truck. It's probably extra wear and tear on the suspension, perhaps on the transmission, differential, drive shaft, etc.

I check mileage the old fashioned way—divide gallons into miles driven. The read out is high (.5 or more), though not as high as in our '06 4Runner (1 to 2). The odometer is also off and reads about 3% high. I checked that against mile markers on interstates a few times for 10 or 20 miles (I don't trust they are placed right either, so the errors even out after a while). It is not all that easy to fill the tank because the backpressure setting on the pump will shut it off at different levels depending where you buy gas and it's hard to get more in, so calculating gas mileage is never accurate as purman says. We have gotten as low as 9 in Nevada on US 50 going over all the mountain ranges and 12+ coming down from Donner Summit going west on I 80. It seems to average around 11.5 or a little less. We drive no more than 65 and do that as much as possible.

Gene

[slowmover]

tow it and feel ok, but there's got to be a price for exceeding the capacity of the truck

rear axle/differential; especially axle bearings on a semi-floating axle.

[OhScottyOh]

Odo is correct to the speedo check markers posted occasional along highway.
I am using the computer average, as my rig does't have a digital read out of current, just bar graph. Wish it had the realtime reading but I guess it doesn't have that instrument package.
Getting the tank filled up equally and fill up is not possible in Oregon, we are not properly trained, thus incapable of performing the the exacting art of selfserve fueling.

[OhScottyOh]

Gene, Right you are. When I think of limits of GVWR I take all of those things which, comes down to payload.

The mattress is why I have a tongue wt of about 1100, and yes fully loaded with the trailer attached TV wt is about 7500, or about 300 over. GVWR is 7200.

While on the subject, if the tongue is a little high, should the tongue weight differ than when level or a little low?

Another subject, weighed axles the other day, 3300 ft and 3000 rr hitched up. I am just shy of level nose down, maybe 1" differance ft to rr. If I could get level would it take some weight off tongue?

Thanks

[Gene]

Scotty, I believe, now that I know which model you have, your payload is 1,495 lbs. because you have the heavier crew max cab. Also to be subtracted from payload are any options added on, and Toyotas all come with a lot of options. For example, I think they all have running boards and that's got to add 75 lbs. I have a hard tonneau on mine and that's about 60 or 75 lbs. However, and you'll have to check the owner's manual (I could check mine, but I'm too lazy right now to walk outside) and see whether Toyota figures coolant and gas into the payload. I seem to remember something about one or both being accounted for; it was not too easy to find, but there's something somewhere defining it.

I think the Tundra could be easily upgraded to a 3/4 ton. The differential and drive shaft seem up to it, but the leaf springs do not. The 4 wheel disc brakes are massive. On the other hand it has passenger car tires, not light truck tires, and the wheels are 5 hole, not 6. I think the 5 holes equal six because the lugs are pretty big and thus I would think they equal smaller 6 lug systems, but it does make one wonder. I think Toyota may have designed the truck to easily put out a 3/4 ton model if the 1/2 ton did well. If they didn't have to make two different differentials, drive shafts and transmissions for 1/2 and 3/4 ton, they would probably save money in the long run. Other upgrades seem pretty easy to make. With truck sales cratered, they probably are holding back on a 3/4 ton unless Detroit goes under. In that case, I'm sure we'll see a 3/4 ton Tundra very quickly. If I'm right about the parts for that, it may be relatively easy to convert a 1/2 ton to a 3/4 ton. You can discount this entire paragraph as the delusional musings of a man avoiding going to work out.

Interesting how your odometer is correct and mine isn't. My past experience is Toyota odometers are very accurate. Maybe it's the difference between the '07 and '08, or maybe you have the Limited. I have the SR 5. I don't get a bar graph, but do get the current mileage in actual numbers which I don't like looking at unless I'm coasting downhill (besides it's a good way to drive off the road). I understanding changing the oil filter on the '08 is even more difficult than on the '07 (probably designed by a former Chrysler engineer).

I hope you can get trained on self service fueling so you can leave Oregon—it's just too far to Jersey to make it on one tank. Next time we're in Oregon we could run fueling seminars, though hands on training wouldn't be allowed.

Gene

[OhScottyOh]

Hi Gene,
From 97 to 07 I lived in CO, Salida, Poncha Springs, and Steamboat. Been through Crawford a number of times while working the western slope, but it is a bit off the track, and that is good.
Fyi, Just came back from the scales with Tundra bed empty, .5 tank of gas, plus the A.R.E. canope. 3360 ft, 2700 rr, or 6060 gross. Just have to add me and the other stuff.
I have on order Timbren SES rear spring what evers, that will save my spring. Different tires are someting to consider.

[Gene]

Scotty,

We probably went through Reedsport either earlier this year or another year, but I can't remember just where it is. Note that in my last 3 posts, my deteriorating memory may have been mentioned a lot. At least I can remember that.

I just looked at the Timbren website and that is an interesting thought. It appears not to be an air bag. Have you found out anything about how it affects handling? It says to "remove wheel assembly" to install it—I wonder what that means? What about wheel bearings?

Sounds like you either have a camper top or a tonneau and they would weigh about the same, perhaps the top would be more. We weighed ours with us in it (since we always are when we are towing), full tank of gas, but, of course, by now, memory issue, but I think it was similar to your number, but higher which would be expected with gas and 2 people. We have the running boards too for more weight.

Given the cheesy tires that came on the truck, I expect they will wear quickly and I'll go to Michelin LT, perhaps 10 ply. Our last Tundra ('02) also came with cheapo tires and they didn't last much more than 20,000 miles and I've got around 15,000 now on the '08, though these seem to be better than the '02's.

Gene

[OhScottyOh]

Gene, nothing about removing wheels. Follow this link Pick Up Truck Suspension Enhancement Kits from Timbren Industries
Also have TRD Off Road Package. Could use tire different tires when these get tired. Michelin is alway a good choice and Toyo have done well.

[Gene]

Scotty, now that I've read that part of Timbren's website, I see they mean "wheel and tire" when they say "wheel assembly". I was beginning to wonder if they meant removing the discs, rotors, etc. It looks like a simpler system than air bags. When you install it it'll be interesting to hear (or read) how it works.

Have you seen any objective reviews of this product indicating it really does increase payload? I don't understand this stuff very well. Rednax mentioned axle bearings. I guess he meant wheel bearings, but maybe not. That would seem relatively simple to replace—I say that not having repacked wheel bearings in about 25 years.

I didn't see your post 31 until now. It must have come in while I was writing #32. I have been playing with different air pressures in my tires. If I left them at the setting (33 rear, 30 front), the nose is too high though the trailer was close to level. After fooling with all sorts of combinations, I have been adding 4 lbs all around. The truck is more level this way and the trailer seems to be level. It's hard to determine level around here since nothing is level in Colorado. Even a mall parking lot is graded for drainage.

Your question: " if the tongue is a little high, should the tongue weight differ than when level or a little low?" I am an amateur at this. I would think the Hensley needs adjustment. I have an Equalizer and the dealer installed it so I didn't pay much attention. There is an adjustment on the Eq. that will affect levelness and since the washers affecting that are now loose (apparently it's normal for that to happen after a while), I have to learn how to do use the adjustment screw and whether I need to add washers. I have until next spring to figure it out and fool with it in that level place nearby I need to find (it may be my leach field). I imagine all hitches have some sort of adjustments.

There are many threads about this and a lot of the posts are beyond my understanding. When I finally get around to figuring out the system, I will be able to post equally opaque Equalizer adjustment instructions. For you there's the "HaHa" thread in which 2air expounds on the Hensley.

Gene

[smhx4]

We have a 08 tundra crew max with the tow package and 5.7 engine. We tow a 07 safari 25 SE. Its a nice ride and we average 11 mpg. I think everyone would agree our set up is good. But any bigger than that and the opinions will differ.

[Silvertwinkie]

Once you start to get to 25', you really start to get into the 3/4 ton range of vehicle. It is true that 1/2 tons can do the trick, but at 27', that is a heck of a lot of weight. I know the Caddy has some premium upgrades (engine, etc), but it does not have the truck tranny (4l80e), the hubs and most likely had smaller rear diff.

The Nissan offering is a good offering, however I would be reluctant to tow a 27 footer with it, particularly if your towing would be in the mountains.

It's a great truck and at some point Toyota will offer a 3/4 ton truck, but for now, it really is a 1/2 ton beast and has a good amount of frame flex making it a good vehicle for 23 feet or smaller.

Personally outside of towing a 27' trailer I think it's a fantastic truck in nearly category.

[78GussyTX]

Well, we have the 2008 Tundra 5.7 V8 SR5 trim Crew Cab and a 1978 Arogosy trailer that I thought was 30 feet, based on my wife's report (we inherited it from her side of the family), but as far as I can tell from speaking to the guy who serviced it for 30 years and from the documentation, it appears to be 27 feet. Will have to nail that down don't you think? But in any case, it has towed beautifully with the Tundra, even with my pot belly, my wife, three small kids, a load of stuff including power wheel jeeps, and a packed trailer. Have never noticed a problem. But I can confess I have not put a full pencil to it, do I have to? Also have scale locally, I could nail it tothe pound if I really wanted to ...

Regards,

Steve

[Sixty3TW4US]

I have a 04 2wd Tundra towing a 63 TW. It does ok not OK my next TV will be a 3/4 ton something. Looking to the 2010. So I'm a year or so away.