Towing with P-Metric tires on F150?

[mello mike]

Thanks, 2Air, for posting that table. I'd never go with 80PSI on LR-E tires anyway but it does make you wonder what PSI would max out the 2025 max rating. Perhaps 44PSI?

Gene,
I hear 'ya on the OEMs but my whimpy P-metric tires only hold a max of 35PSI. I feel the big rigs passing me and I rarely felt them when I had LR-E tires on my old Excursion.

Maybe I should just stick with my original plan and go with a P-metric 44PSI Michelin?

[Alwhisman]

I have the Michelin LT's. I run mine at 60 PSI. I was more concerned about the distance travelled and tire durability with the truck bed loaded up....

[Gene]

[QUOTE=mello mike;874926
I hear 'ya on the OEMs but my whimpy P-metric tires only hold a max of 35PSI. [/QUOTE]

35 psi!?! C tires max at 45 I believe. D at 65. E at 80. Are these B? On a 1/2 ton truck?

I can see why you want to change. Why not LT's rather than P though? I went with E because I know I'll put a lot of miles on them in relatively few years and I start out with a lot more tread (17/32 I think). Plus, in my experience, you are less likely to pick up nails, screws, etc., with new, deep tread than worn tires. This theory may have been disproven on our last trip, but I'm not letting go of it.

Gene

[mello mike]

Yeah, I am. I'm going with LT's, LT265/70R17 Load Range E. I'll probably keep them around 50-60PSI.

Yeah, these tires are the smallest they put on their F150s. I didn't look at the tires when I bought the truck. That's my fault and will be the last time I make that mistake.

[2airishuman]

mike is reading from the RECOMMENDED inflation pressure sticker...

on the trucks B pillar.

mich' makes at least 2 tires used for light duty trucks in that size...

1 comes with a max COLD inflation of 35psi and the other is 44 psi...

GO READ THE TIRE SIDEWALL for max inflation mike...

it' may not the same as the "recommended" inflation u posted in this thread...

http://www.airforums.com/forums/f463/new-tv-66578.html

btw there are some REALLY good forums out there...

JUST on the 150, 4 150 owners and enthusiasts...
_______

running many E rated tires at anything LESS than 50 psi is foolish.

if the LOAD REQUIREMENTS less than 2200 lbs or so,

just get APPROPRIATELY rated tires.

the axles, springs, rims, hubs AND tires on this 150

are all rated around the same values (rear axle/springs a tad higher)

the WEIGHT of an E rated tire is a negative IF not needed.

and running them SOFT results in heat, squirm, instability and poor handling...

and MIGHT promote failure.

http://www.nittotire.com/assets/safe...t%20Trucks.pdf

the B pillar info is important. that IS the recommended cold inflation pressure for a given load.

IF towing it's important to WEIGH THE RIG and set tire inflation accordingly.

have u weighed EITHER trailer/truck combo yet?

Originally Posted by mello mike

Yeah, I am. I'm going with LT's, LT265/70R17 Load Range E. I'll probably keep them around 50-60PSI.

to further beat this horse since we covered it in the other thread....

265/70 is >5% larger than the oem.

so the speed'o will be off 3-4 mph at 60, torque and hp will be LOWER at the rear and stopping distance will go UP.

the LARGER contact patch (with no increase in load) is more likely to hydroplane and will have LESS grip when it counts.



cheers
2air'

[mello mike]

Originally Posted by 2airishuman

GO READ THE TIRE SIDEWALL for max inflation mike...

it' may not the same as the "recommended" inflation u posted in this thread...
_______

running many E rated tires at anything LESS than 50 psi is foolish.

if the LOAD REQUIREMENTS less than 2200 lbs or so,

just get APPROPRIATELY rated tires.

the axles, springs, rims, hubs AND tires on this 150

are all rated around the same values (rear axle/springs a tad higher)

the WEIGHT of an E rated tire is a negative IF not needed.

and running them SOFT results in heat, squirm, instability and poor handling...

and MIGHT promote failure.

http://www.nittotire.com/assets/safe...t%20Trucks.pdf

the B pillar info is important. that IS the recommended cold inflation pressure for a given load.

IF towing it's important to WEIGH THE RIG and set tire inflation accordingly.

have u weighed EITHER trailer/truck combo yet?

to further beat this horse since we covered it in the other thread....

265/70 is >5% larger than the oem.

so the speed'o will be off 3-4 mph at 60, torque and hp will be LOWER at the rear and stopping distance will go UP.

the LARGER contact patch (with no increase in load) is more likely to hydroplane and will have LESS grip when it counts.

cheers
2air'

2Air,
Appreciate the detailed response. According to the sidewall, the max inflation for my present tires is 35 PSI. No difference between the sidewall and sticker. If I read the payload rating for my tires, the max payload is 1680lbs. I exceed that now. Unfortunately, the selection of tires in the 255/65R17 size is poor. There are no Load Range E tires in that size. There is a Michelin 255 tire which provides a stiffer sidewall at 44PSI but doesn't provide any more loading. Still haven't weighed the truck and trailer.

[2airishuman]

Originally Posted by mello mike

...According to the sidewall, the max inflation for my present tires is 35 PSI. No difference between the sidewall and sticker...

good info

u've not listed the actual model tire...which one is it??

mich makes the LTX a/s in 2 versions that are sized exactly, both with MORE capacity.

the 44 psi version could be used at 35 psi when NOT towing and inflated more when towing.

Michelin LTX A/S

it wouldn't be logical for the vehicle maker to put tires on that are rated way LESS than the axles or springs...

and they also wouldn't use tires much OVER those ratings...

it appears the axle rating OF THIS MODEL 150 is only 3450/3850 for this truck...

so tires with 2000-2200 lbs capacity are PLENTY.

but obviously there are a lotta choices and options.

cheers
2air'

[mello mike]

Originally Posted by 2airishuman

good info

u've not listed the actual model tire...which one is it??

mich makes the LTX a/s in 2 versions that are sized exactly, both with MORE capacity.

the 44 psi version could be used at 35 psi when NOT towing and inflated more when towing.

Michelin LTX A/S

it wouldn't be logical for the vehicle maker to put tires on that are rated way LESS than the axles or springs...

and they also wouldn't use tires much OVER those ratings...

it appears the axle rating OF THIS MODEL 150 is only 3450/3850 for this truck...

so tires with 2000-2200 lbs capacity are PLENTY.

but obviously there are a lotta choices and options.

cheers
2air'

My tires are the Michelin 255/65R17 LTX A/S (35PSI) tires, the sucky ones.

I'm looking for a stiffer sidewall because I can feel it when the 18 wheelers pass me. Never felt that with the Load Range E tires. When you say more capacity, are you referring to the 44 PSI rating?

[mello mike]

Issue closed. Yesterday I bought Michelin LTX M/S 2 255/65R17 (PSI 44) tires for my truck. These tires give me a stiffer sidewall when towing and give me a little better traction in mud and snow. Now I just have to sell the old ones.

[jm2]

Originally Posted by 2airishuman

jm'

check those tire size parameters again...



and the rugged trail t/a is an LT tire...

whoops! that would correctly be 'P275/65R18'.

I never knew that dsylexia also included turning numbers upside down!


also, though not critical to this discussion, I've always understood that a "P-metric" designated tire is a "passenger" grade tire, and that "light truck" grade tires are designated "LTxxx/xxRxx".

best,

[2airishuman]

yeah, figured u meant 6 but no guessing is allowed here...

the p/lt distinction we all learned WAS true...

before suv became massive sized people haulers and truck gained 2 more doors...

now it's all a bit LESS clear.

Tire Tech Information - Load Reduction of Euro- and P-Metric Tires on Light Trucks

Tire Tech - Tire Specs Explained

cheers
2air'

[Gene]

The P and LT designations have gotten muddy. Checking carefully the loads a tire can take is important. P's have less load capacity than a like sized LT on a light truck, but it may not be significant for a specific application (see 2air's link above).

SUV and truck manufacturers have always tried to put the cheapest tires they can get on many of their products, probably figuring that most people don't notice. At one time SUV's with 4WD always came with LT M&S tires, but a lot now come with all season tires. Since most people never go off road or drive through snowdrifts, that works ok for many, but not for all. Using P tires may be another way to save money. The P's on our truck were M&S, but they were still cheap tires. I never dreamed Toyota would put P tires on a 4WD full sized 1/2 ton pickup, so I didn't look.

Gene

[2airishuman]

Originally Posted by CrawfordGene

...SUV and truck manufacturers have always tried to put the cheapest tires they can get on many of their products, probably figuring that most people don't notice...

the last generation (09s) DODGE RAM 2500-3500s

came with mich' high end tires often good for 90-100,000 miles.

ford sources a variety for any given vehicle using pirelli, mich', bfg, gy and conti'

none of these are 'cheap tires'

in addition, many trucks are ordered or equipped with an OPTIONAL wheel/tire package...

that FURTHER raises the tire included.
___________

for any vehicle that is HIGH volume PRODUCTION (which leaves out the toy' truck),

the tire sourcing issue becomes adequate SUPPLY...

some of the other good tire brands

don't have the capacity to produce enough tires for a new vehicle,

and the truck makers don't wanna be stalled by lack of rubber.
___________

buyers DO recognize brands, but may not recognize models...
___________

looking at 3/4-1 ton 2010 rams last month they all now have bfgs.

while the NON FLEET 1500s all had nice pirelli or mich tires.

cheers
2air'

[Gene]

True that not all vehicles have cheap tires.

Our '06 4Runner came with Michelins, but they weren't LTX's, the tires they have sometimes used in the past, but something called the Cross Terrain. It looked sort of like a cross between all season and M&S, lasted for at least* 65,000 miles, always had great traction and plowed through snow effortlessly. Strangely, when it came time to get new tires, Michelin no longer made that tire in the 4Runner's size, so now it has LTX's.

Our '02 Tundra came with cheap tires too. The '02 Sequoia had come with cheap ones—I think—the previous owner had replaced them with Michelins sometime well before 30,000 miles. He only kept the Sequoia 18 months, put a lot of miles on it, and sold it.

Availability may be one answer to the OEM tires. It is sometimes said (could it be an old guy's myth?) that tire manufacturers sell not very good tires to vehicle manufacturers for a few dollars each so that the owner will replace them with the same tire. This has never made a lot of sense since when a tire doesn't last long, wouldn't most people buy a different brand? Lots of human behavior doesn't make sense, so….

Gene

*still had enough tread, but we would have had to get new tires in the next 6 months anyway, so why not then instead? When we sell the 4Runner it'll still have good tires on it. We gave the old ones to a relative who needed tires badly.