Towing with Electricity and a Model X

[dasams]

Originally Posted by ohmman

If, for some bizarre reason, I find my state of charge to be worrisome, there is a Tesla Supercharger midway home from the beach.

Can you charge up the X with the AS hooked up?

[ohmman]

Originally Posted by dasams

Can you charge up the X with the AS hooked up?

At the particular Supercharger on this trip, yes. They are pull-through stations wide enough to accommodate the Airstream. However, they are more the exception than the rule right now. I will be posting photos and information as I visit other chargers in future trips, just to give everyone an idea how it plays out.

[ohmman]

First trip report (keeping it on-topic to the towing with electricity portion) - success with a few lessons learned/questions remaining.

First, the nitty-gritty. My 90kWh battery has about 84kWh usable. My 102-mile roundtrip used 62.3kWh. My average consumption, reported by the car, was 577Wh/mi outbound and 646Wh/mi on the return.

I controlled my speed but occasionally got up into the very low 60s with traffic. I would have preferred to stay at or under 55, and I may use TACC to assist with that in the future. That'll help quite a bit with consumption.

Towing power was plentiful - I never felt the desire for more power. Range was plenty adequate for the trip, and I didn't need to stop at the Supercharger to pick up electrons.

I did keep the 7-way plugged in while camped and used the furnace, fridge (on battery), lights, water pump, radio, etc. without battery issues. The battery meter continually reported in the 12.3-12.7 range. I took that to mean that the DC-DC converter in my Tesla was providing at least some trickle into the battery to keep it charged. Maybe I am misreading that.

I'll create another thread to talk about the Airstream-specific details, but I'll put the spoiler here - trip was great, and aside from a few learning opportunities, we found it to be loads of fun.

[Adventure.AS]

Originally Posted by ohmman

First trip report (keeping it on-topic to the towing with electricity portion) - success with a few lessons learned/questions remaining.

[Rocinante]

Congrats, and thanks for the trip report! Given you used all those appliances listed below and the trailer batteries stayed well-charged throughout, I'd suggest the trailer was indeed pulling some current from the car. If you have an ammeter (or if your car console can tell you this), it should be easy to see the power draw from the trailer while parked and connected to the car. Would love to hear the results of that experiment in whatever thread that topic belongs.

Originally Posted by ohmman

I did keep the 7-way plugged in while camped and used the furnace, fridge (on battery), lights, water pump, radio, etc. without battery issues. The battery meter continually reported in the 12.3-12.7 range. I took that to mean that the DC-DC converter in my Tesla was providing at least some trickle into the battery to keep it charged. Maybe I am misreading that.

[ohmman]

Originally Posted by Rocinante

Congrats, and thanks for the trip report! Given you used all those appliances listed below and the trailer batteries stayed well-charged throughout, I'd suggest the trailer was indeed pulling some current from the car. If you have an ammeter (or if your car console can tell you this), it should be easy to see the power draw from the trailer while parked and connected to the car. Would love to hear the results of that experiment in whatever thread that topic belongs.

Thanks, I do indeed have an ammeter and will check it out and report back here or elsewhere.

Full trip report, related to the actual AS experience, is here.

[Piggy Bank]

Sounds like a great outing.

You may want to consider running the refrigerator on propane instead of battery, as it can save on electrical draw.

Also would recommend doing the "same" trip and un-connecting the 7-pin while camping to test your AS batter and its health.

Stream On!

[Nuvite-F]

Originally Posted by ohmman

Finally - the first outing is tomorrow. It is a short trip without any charging requirements - 50 miles out and back, and we are only staying a single night. The location is a beach with dry camping, so there are no hookups for the trailer or for the Model X. If, for some bizarre reason, I find my state of charge to be worrisome, there is a Tesla Supercharger midway home from the beach. Generally speaking, that's just a distant Plan B. We are mostly focused on not forgetting anything imperative and just having a good time at the shore.

I'm hopeful my stock Group 24 battery will be able to keep the furnace running on low all night. We've got extra blankets anyway, just in case.

Wish me luck!

How did it work out for you? Haven't heard anything since.

[ohmman]

Originally Posted by Nuvite-F

How did it work out for you? Haven't heard anything since.

Originally Posted by ohmman

First trip report (keeping it on-topic to the towing with electricity portion) - success with a few lessons learned/questions remaining.

First, the nitty-gritty. My 90kWh battery has about 84kWh usable. My 102-mile roundtrip used 62.3kWh. My average consumption, reported by the car, was 577Wh/mi outbound and 646Wh/mi on the return.

I controlled my speed but occasionally got up into the very low 60s with traffic. I would have preferred to stay at or under 55, and I may use TACC to assist with that in the future. That'll help quite a bit with consumption.

Towing power was plentiful - I never felt the desire for more power. Range was plenty adequate for the trip, and I didn't need to stop at the Supercharger to pick up electrons.

I did keep the 7-way plugged in while camped and used the furnace, fridge (on battery), lights, water pump, radio, etc. without battery issues. The battery meter continually reported in the 12.3-12.7 range. I took that to mean that the DC-DC converter in my Tesla was providing at least some trickle into the battery to keep it charged. Maybe I am misreading that.

I'll create another thread to talk about the Airstream-specific details, but I'll put the spoiler here - trip was great, and aside from a few learning opportunities, we found it to be loads of fun.

I think you missed that response above. Maybe you missed a page? Things went well. However, we haven't been able to get out again with this California deluge. Thankfully, I've been doing some modifications in the interim.

I have booked a trip this summer through the Pacific NW, BC, and Alberta, going through Banff National Park and then down through Glacier in the US. That should be a lot more data!

For those of you who receive Airstream Life, there is a page in the letters section from two others towing with a Tesla. I'm "online friendly" with the couple in the US driving the white Model X. I'm worried about the guy towing an International 23D, mainly based on GVWR and tongue weight limitations.

Thanks for checking in!

[aircampr]

Hi Ohmman,

Thanks for this thread. i am finding some great info. I have been towing a 23D with a BMW X5 diesel, with great success. We are looking to trade in for a new X5, and are considering whether we can tow with an X5 Xdrive40e hybrid. We would not likely improve our fuel consumption when towing, but could manage most of our local daily driving on all electric. I have started a separate thread:

http://www.airforums.com/forums/f238...0e-163929.html

My issue is not overall range, but rather whether electric torque will be available to boost the 4 cal gas engine torque for uphill stretches (at least, i think that is my issue!). Your figures for Wh/mile and Wh/ft altitude may be useful to me.

The X5 hybrid has a gas I4 with 240hp and 260ft-lb, which is boosted to 308hp and 336ft-lb by an electric motor with 9KWh batteries (1/10 of yours). The motor can generate from downhill braking, or be driven from the gas engine top recharge the battery. Software uses route elevation profiles to manage the batteries.

So far I am still learning how to approach this problem and this thread is helpful. Thank you, and happy camping!

Charlie

[PKI]

A bit of information for the BMW folks. Posted by invisihitch representative on BimmerFest. Note - do not believe everything you read on the Internet.

(Quote open) -- snip --

BMW expressly prohibits the use of weight-distribution hitches on the X5. And, for a while, they seemed to be taking a hard line on this prohibition when it came to warranty claims. More recently, that stance appears to have softened considerably.

As some posters on bimmerfest have pointed out, BMW's written statement prohibiting the use of WDH appears only in their own hitch documentation. Some have suggested that this means it is BMW's hitch -- not the vehicle -- that cannot handle the forces of WDH. I have pursued this with BMW for two years now, and I believe we may be close to a resolution (which appears to be supported by the softening of the warranty stance). Assuming this gets resolved in the way I hope, we may make a new product announcement. In the meantime, we continue to aligned our position with BMW.

I hope this helps, even if it's not what people would prefer to hear.

Cheers,
Daryl (Quote closed)

My apology for posting this here. It's for information only. No discussion requested or expected.

Now, back to hybrid towing discussion. It's very interesting to consider the 4 cylinder bi-turbo as a tow solution. Will be interested in your experience if you move forward. The manual charge control might well help. Charge going down and use the electric power on the uphill trip. Certainly a different use of the design. Pat

[PKI]

The above was incorrectly posted here. It was intended for the thread on towing with a BMW 40e. My apology for the confusion. Pat

[aircampr]

ohmman,

Are you using electric trailer brakes, with a proportional brake controller? I am interested in how to maximize energy recovery, without compromising safety.

Charlie

[ohmman]

Originally Posted by aircampr

ohmman,

Are you using electric trailer brakes, with a proportional brake controller? I am interested in how to maximize energy recovery, without compromising safety.

Charlie

Yes, I am. I'm using a Tekonsha Prodigy 2. I keep it dialed to a very low setting on flat, medium speed (non-freeway) roads and primarily use regenerative braking from the car to recapture as much kinetic energy as possible.

On the highways, I'll be keeping it at a higher setting and will do the same on hilly or winding terrain.

No real updates for now as I've been doing some mild retrofitting to the trailer to get it ready for a ~4 week trip as far north as Banff. I plan to update with the good and bad on the trip once it starts in a month.

[OTRA15]

Originally Posted by ohmman

. . .
I'll update more as to the ups and downs of towing with my X. For now, I'm excited for our first jaunt to the beach.

FYI we looked at a Tesla X SUV today, towing their new AS demo trailer which is making the rounds all over the US. The recent thread here about an accident near a Tesla demo trailer in Detroit led us to research the new vehicle and the AS combo.

Here is the Tesla Explores page:

https://www.tesla.com/teslaexplores

where the interactive map shows upcoming demonstration events.

We are going to take a test drive and get more info this week. An impressive vehicle.

Cheers,

Peter

[OTRA15]

Originally Posted by ohmman

. . .
I plan to update with the good and bad on the trip once it starts in a month.

Looking forward to hearing about the trip. We are going to test drive an X this week.

Cheers,

Peter

[ohmman]

I will update when I have the chance, but we are underway en route to Glacier NP, Banff, and back through BC and down the West Coast to home. We will be in West Glacier tomorrow.

So far, the trip has gone well. We drive slowly for range reasons - 55 mph mostly as our max, depending on how far we need to go. Charging at the campsite works well. We have had to unhitch at most Tesla charging stops since they are designed for back-in.

We've made it 135 miles between charges but we're close to the limit and had some help from elevation loss. Otherwise, it's more like 120-125 miles.

We've had lots of interest from other campers and passers-by. It has been fun to discuss the abilities of EVs on the trip.

Good luck with your X shopping. If you'd like to talk through it, PM me and I'll give you my phone number. If you need a referral code for free Supercharging, I can offer mine so long as I can be helpful to you.

[Meeks]

Very excited to hear about your trip. Pros and cons and whatever! So fabulous you are doing this and reporting to us. You're one of the electric towing pioneers !

[OTRA15]

Thanks ohmman!

Too bad about having to unhitch at Tesla charging stations. That certainly seems counter-productive to their advertising campaign to promote towing with the new X SUV !!!

Memo to Tesla . . . how about some pull-through charging stations? [ Doh . . . ]

Peter

[ohmman]

There are some pull through stalls but they're not that common. Back in is easier to build because it doesn't require trenching a parking lot.

Headed to East Glacier today from West. Airstream has been very comfortable and easy to tow. A few things are falling off - door trim fell off, sink bracket, little caps and covers - but I can sort that out upon my return. I used 3M automotive tape to secure the door trim for now.