Towing w/ VW TDI post emissions scandal

[jcl]

Originally Posted by Ted S.

All joking aside I think you are correct. They did portray themselves in one light, then cheat, bad. Honesty I have a hard time believing a company like that would make such a decision. I will say I am only going on the little I have heard and read.

I'd be curious if this is the tip of the iceberg. What about all the other related brands? Are they doing the same thing?

Criminal charges are expected

After the CEO, VW has reportedly just fired the next level, including heads of R&D and product development at Audi and Porsche, and the head of VW US.

Caterpillar was guilty of something similar some years back with on highway trucks.

Euro testing is done by manufacturers, not a central authority. Lots of 'optimizing'.

Expect more icebergs.

[jcl]

Originally Posted by avionstream

You are so wrong, you have fallen for all the environmentalists bs. Time will prove they are wrong and we are paying for it now.

Next you are going to tell us that the climate is not changing, and that if it is, man's influences are not the primary cause of it.

[Lance M]

Originally Posted by jcl

Caterpillar was guilty of something similar some years back with on highway trucks.

I think you mean Navistar.

Years Later, Navistar Is Haunted by a Big Engine Blunder - Businessweek

But I could be wrong.

[jcl]

Originally Posted by Top

Purportedly, we landed a man on the moon in 1969 before I was born. I think getting a diesel powered car to meet some basic standards for emissions would be fairly easy if the manufacturer wanted to comply.

VW did meet the emissions standards. But people weren't buying them fast enough, so they engineered less compliance in exchange for more mileage, to spur the adoption of diesels in North America. It worked. Until they got caught.

[n2916s]

Want to experience a world without Environmental Protection? Visit any major city in China. Swim in their rivers, drink their water.

I can't believe anyone would exchange the amazing improvement in U.S. air quality over the past four decades for a couple of MPG...

Mike

[Echelon73]

Originally Posted by Ted S.

I'd be curious if this is the tip of the iceberg. What about all the other related brands? Are they doing the same thing?

I'm pretty sure the Audi A3 tdi is caught up in this too.

[jcl]

Originally Posted by Top

I think you mean Navistar.

Years Later, Navistar Is Haunted by a Big Engine Blunder - Businessweek

But I could be wrong.

Navistar paid penalties. Other companies, including Cat, Detroit Diesel, Cummins, and Volvo, settled with the EPA over claims that truck engines they tested and certified weren't what they sold. They were using defeat devices

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articl...ollution-tests

[dkottum]

These TDI's are such environmental disasters, imagine using one gallon of fuel to travel only 50 miles. We've been driving a TDI as a commuter and family car for almost 20 years, imagine the the waste and harm we have done.

[Denis4x4]

Originally Posted by n2916s

Want to experience a world without Environmental Protection? Visit any major city in China. Swim in their rivers, drink their water.

I can't believe anyone would exchange the amazing improvement in U.S. air quality over the past four decades for a couple of MPG...

Mike

....or you could come to Durango and witness first hand the damage the EPA caused due to their negligence in dealing with toxic water from mining operations.

[n2916s]

No argument about Durango. Absolute screw up.

But, balance that against the cleanup of the rivers, harbors and bays, especially on the east coast, and the far better air quality in every major city in the USA (ask any professional pilot about that...)

Drinking water quality nationwide is far better than in the sixties and seventies.

I still prefer our environment, land, sea and air, over that in those countries that don't have an EPA type agency.

Mike

[ROBERT CROSS]

"Most climate change facts are a decade out of date and can be disputed."


Well.... I'm glad you concede them as facts, if they are a decade old we better get busy and do something.

Bob

[overlander63]

According to two different reports, California (of course) is already considering legislation to prevent VW owners, and others, from registering their vehicles unless they have completed all recalls.

[dkottum]

This is a sideshow. Nothing serious will be done about climate change until 150 million people begin moving north because they can no longer feed themselves in the warmer climates. Then it will be too late.

[xrvr]

Tried to delete my posts because this is off topic. Maybe we can meet at a rally sometime to discuss this, would be fun.

[mojo]

Well for those of you who think that this recall for VW is scandalous, at least no one had to die before the automaker admitted a problem like Toyota and GM.

[Popcycle]

Originally Posted by cwf

Sorry this is happening... Heads are rolling, but that won't fix the problem. To me, those "involved" should clean up their mess. After all, they know where the skeletons are.

Rumor has it, VW is buying back all affected TDIs. Probably after deducting for mileage. They can sell them to China... After all, they breathe different air there than we do!!!

Hope it settles out, I hate to see the "working folks"'on the line who "followed orders" be impacted while the "management" gets fatter.

Just don't respond to the recall.

[jtwind]

Originally Posted by Denis4x4

....or you could come to Durango and witness first hand the damage the EPA caused due to their negligence in dealing with toxic water from mining operations.

The EPA's negligence. I do realize that the EPA goofed up somehow and the mine waste got out, but the negligence as not having this cleaned up in the first place, Why wasn't this waste cleaned up by the mine owners, or Colorado etc. It was a time bomb waiting to happen and there are many more just like it. Is Colorado doing anything now about all the others just waiting to leak, not that I've heard. There is blame here no doubt, but the EPA was trying to keep tabs on things and someone made a mistake.

[alantbird]

I don't think in the end this will be as big as the media paints it.
Our EPA is not one of the most up and up agencies we want to think they are and when they start smogging 747s maybe we can do something realistic about pollution!

My take on what VW did is BRILLIANT!

They will prob. do a software upgrade and someone else will come up with an upgrade buster or some chip to dial in your get up and go and we can call it a day!

[Urbanologist]

If the consumer public THINKS that VW is the only auto manufacture cheating on these tests you better rethink. Want less government, this is what you ultimately can end up with. Corporate lobbyist RUN governments and draft the legislation that allows such criminal behavior AND disasters to happen. Corporations hire the brightest minds ($$$$) to rig the 'system' to their benefit. We expect less government (fewer inspectors) to catch these rats. Additionally, we think civil service should work for lower - and LOWER - compensation. As we KNOW: You won't get a new Land Yacht for the price of a "pop-up" trailer or a new Bambi. Corporate criminals rarely get prosecuted - or serve much time when they are. These EPA mileage tests are NEVER real life experiences - NEVER!! Like Charlie Brown, we keep on kicking at the dang football! Lucy (all businesses) keeps on laughing!! The Top VW executive resigned and will still get a BIG check going out the door. We are collectively stupid by thinking we aren't part of the root problem. Don't buy crappy products or services. EVERYONE with one of the affected VW's need to be looking for class-action legal status. Form THAT posse and find a legal rope!!

[phawk33]

So much misinformation going around folks! How about this for some of my 2 cents logic:

* VW will not buy the affected cars back. How could they buy back 11 million cars at, say, $10K a pop? That would be $110 Billion and they would have to go bankrupt to do this and even then, not enough to pay everyone.
* The mess they are in was caused by pure greed and dishonesty. They could not meet the new EPA standards without UREA catalytic devices because it would have cost too much per vehicle, also making them less attractive to buy.
* Instead, VW added the illegal software to turn on the emissions control devices they had only while the cars are under testing (only the drive wheels moving). After the test, the cars go on their usual way maximizing torque and fuel efficiency at the expense of NOx emissions. Like it or not, lower emissions are the law in most countries!
* So VW will likely simply recall the cars, reflash the software to permanently turn on the emission control devices and tune parameters. So the owners will get lower fuel economy and a decrease in Torque, probably significantly.
* Those owners who refuse to voluntarily have their cars reflashed will probably be stopped at license renewal time by their State's DMVs.
* Then the owners will file massive class-action suits for their damages and VW will be almost ruined.
* Those of you who want to buy VW stock, should also consider buying some ENRON while you are at it
* Other Diesels will not be affected if there was no defeat devices installed. Remember the '07 and '08 Jeep Grand Cherokees with the 3.0L CRD Mercedes engine? Well, they are incredible in performance and fuel economy (I know because I tow my 25' FC with it!). But Chrysler decided to stop offering the 3.0L CRD after 2008 because they couldn't meet the EPA standards without UREA units.

What a mess!!!