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Old 12-31-2012, 02:39 PM   #113
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I don't believe the 2013 will have a DPF and Urea but haven't read up on the changes with the '13 models.
I am told the '13 Ram Diesels WILL have urea.
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Old 12-31-2012, 02:44 PM   #114
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Yes, the newer 1/2 tons can do more, but other than towing a space shuttle (I wonder what the tongue wt. of a space shuttle is?), there is a limit and you are correct.

Can you hold out for another year? Trucks are going to have to have better gas mileage and that may be worth waiting for. The new Tundras apparently are coming out for the 2014 models and maybe they will have a 3/4 ton or better capacity for the 1/2 ton. Our double cab has the 6/5' bed and between 1,500 and 1,600 cargo capacity. The payload differs a lot according to the specific model. Gas tank is small, but it makes us stop more and exercise our legs and backs, so that is a mixed thing. When in remote areas, we carry a couple of gas cans and rarely need them. I understand that the Tundra would be living on the edge of capacity, but maybe it will get better with the 2014 redesign.

Gene
Gene, any way I figure it we have a payload of 1600 to 1800 lbs in the truck whenever we have the trailer in tow. Yes, a 1/2 ton would do it IF you changed the tires to heavier ones, did some suspension "upgrades", but what about all the rest of the truck, and it's reliablity with that kind of constant load?

Anyway, the decision has been made, and later this week I should have the Ram 2500.

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Old 12-31-2012, 02:53 PM   #115
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Dang, Bruce! You're wise to my madness!

Actually, I've found out that popcorn produces a gas that is lighter than air and would actully help with the weight problem.
I'm thinkin' that is the Shiner Bock
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Old 12-31-2012, 02:54 PM   #116
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I'm thinkin' that is the Shiner Bock
Maybe the combo, but the SB never did it before.
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Old 12-31-2012, 05:42 PM   #117
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Gene, any way I figure it we have a payload of 1600 to 1800 lbs in the truck whenever we have the trailer in tow. Yes, a 1/2 ton would do it IF you changed the tires to heavier ones, did some suspension "upgrades", but what about all the rest of the truck, and it's reliablity with that kind of constant load?

Anyway, the decision has been made, and later this week I should have the Ram 2500.

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The decision has been made and I understand it. I put better tires on the Tundra, but don't want to do any suspension changes. The driveline components look like they could handle big loads, but I can't prove it. We have enough in the truck when we travel that we are maxed out and have had no problems with 80,000+ miles, but you take a chance that wear is going to catch up with you eventually.

Good luck with your Dodge.

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Old 12-31-2012, 05:54 PM   #118
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At the stroke of midnight tonight, 31dec2012, Dpdge can no longer make diesel trucks without urea. That is why they are still making 2012 models until the bell rings in Times Square tonight. Get a 2012 diesel before they are gone!
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Old 12-31-2012, 07:31 PM   #119
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The decision has been made and I understand it. I put better tires on the Tundra, but don't want to do any suspension changes. The driveline components look like they could handle big loads, but I can't prove it. We have enough in the truck when we travel that we are maxed out and have had no problems with 80,000+ miles, but you take a chance that wear is going to catch up with you eventually.

Good luck with your Dodge.

Gene
Keep in mind, Gene, you are towing a 7300 GVW trailer, and I a 10,000.
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Old 12-31-2012, 08:12 PM   #120
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Originally Posted by CrawfordGene View Post

Can you hold out for another year? Trucks are going to have to have better gas mileage and that may be worth waiting for. The new Tundras apparently are coming out for the 2014 models and maybe they will have a 3/4 ton or better capacity for the 1/2 ton. Our double cab has the 6/5' bed and between 1,500 and 1,600 cargo capacity. The payload differs a lot according to the specific model.

Gene
Gene

I hope you are correct in your hope that the payload will increase, but I seriously doubt it. The average consumer/TT owner is clueless about payload and GVWR. He is only concerned about the max weight trailer that the manufacturer says the truck will tow. The max trailer weight for my Tundra is 10,000 lbs, but I am exceeding the Tundra GVWR when fully loaded pulling my 5,000 lb Tradewind.

I think that only some suspension upgrades and rear axle and wheel upgrades would be required to increase the payload significantly. Other than that I am quite happy with the truck as is (oh, and please provide a locker rear end).

Steve

Good luck on your Dodge 2500 TD. This is a good thread. Thanks for starting it.

Dan
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Old 12-31-2012, 10:44 PM   #121
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I worked the numbers on a 2013 Kings Ranch 4x4 F150 EcoBoost SuperCrew with 5.5' bed and 3.73 rear end. The specs call for a max towing weight of 11,200 for the trailer with the max combination weight of 17,100 pounds. The suggested payload is 1,900 pounds.

Using the information from the current loaded TV and TT and adding in the gasoline, there remains about 400 pounds of payload available before hitting the upper number limits. The turbocharged gas engine is not bothered by changes in altitude as the normally aspirated engines would be not the larger pickups.

I pushed the numbers on 2012 Dodge 3/4 ton diesel pickups and it was hard to get 2,300 pounds of payload. Going to a 1 ton could add another 760 pounds or so of payload for a single rear wheel and and dual rear wheels could add around 2,100 pounds. You could push the combo weight to 21,000 pounds for pull type trailers. At that point, the truck would have to be nearly loaded to capacity to not rattle the trailer apart from stiff TV suspension.

I suggest pushing the specs pretty hard because what you may find as left overs in the 2012 Dodge arena may not do your mission. I was at one Dodge dealer in Scottsdale that had over 20 gas models but only five diesels.

YMMV
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Old 01-01-2013, 12:00 AM   #122
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Is Cummins still urea free?
Funny how they could figure it out but GM and Ford still use urea absorbtion/burn off to meet emmission standard.
I never did understand that...

The "infamous" GM steering knock...your dealer should be familiar with this...have them tighten it up.

Good luck, let us know how you like towing with the Dodge tranny versus the Alli.

B
Yes, it is for 2012; we don't have a urea tank ... and, YES, we love the new safety features and creature comforts. (Incidentally, we traded in an F150 Ford Lariat)
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Old 01-01-2013, 10:54 PM   #123
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I worked the numbers on a 2013 Kings Ranch 4x4 F150 EcoBoost SuperCrew with 5.5' bed and 3.73 rear end. The specs call for a max towing weight of 11,200 for the trailer with the max combination weight of 17,100 pounds. The suggested payload is 1,900 pounds.

Using the information from the current loaded TV and TT and adding in the gasoline, there remains about 400 pounds of payload available before hitting the upper number limits. The turbocharged gas engine is not bothered by changes in altitude as the normally aspirated engines would be not the larger pickups.

I pushed the numbers on 2012 Dodge 3/4 ton diesel pickups and it was hard to get 2,300 pounds of payload. Going to a 1 ton could add another 760 pounds or so of payload for a single rear wheel and and dual rear wheels could add around 2,100 pounds. You could push the combo weight to 21,000 pounds for pull type trailers. At that point, the truck would have to be nearly loaded to capacity to not rattle the trailer apart from stiff TV suspension.

I suggest pushing the specs pretty hard because what you may find as left overs in the 2012 Dodge arena may not do your mission. I was at one Dodge dealer in Scottsdale that had over 20 gas models but only five diesels.

YMMV
Switz

My new Tundra 5.7L is well equipped and only cost 25k out the door in 2008. It is a great TV, but only has a payload of 1,680 lbs. I can't imagine replacing it with a 50K 1/2 ton truck with only 220 lb more payload (plus suicide doors and only a 5.5 ft bed). That would be an easy decision for me. Each to his own though. I would probably look at ways to reduce the payload required by shifting the weight to the trailer or something. Heck, my cap weighs about 250 lbs. I could increase my payload by 250 lbs just by leaving it at home. Just saying.

Dan
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Old 01-09-2013, 12:31 PM   #124
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Changing to a more capable TV

I am doting the "I"s and crossing the "T"s on one of the last of the new 2012 Cummins powered Ram 3/4 ton pickups. It is configured with crew cab, short bed, 4x4, 3.73 rear end and automatic transmission. The truck can tow up to a 12,650 pound trailer, has a GCWR of 20,000 pounds, a GVW of 9,600 pounds and a 2,390 pound payload with fuel included in the curb weight of 7,211 pounds. This truck has the high output version of the Cummins engine which is 800 foot pounds @ 1,600 rpm. The factory hitch is rated 1,200 pounds which is just over the tongue weight of the trailer when unhitched. I may change the hitch for one rated 1,600 pounds.

The current maxed out payload load on my Mercedes TV of 1,300 pounds (includes me, my wife and trailer and 60 pounds of air compressor and jack in the car) will be a little over half of the truck's payload capability. That means we could take another couple or grandkids in the back seat, camping gear in the bed plus the trailer and still have some payload capacity remaining.

The excess towing capability for the 25FB International would cover a longer Airstream (10,000 pounds for 31' units) and the tongue weight would probably be lower per the Airstream sales literature.

The end of model year with factory and dealer discounts took almost $7,000 off of the list price. I found the color and interior of my choice in a fully loaded version of this truck. My initial modification will be substituting an under bed 56 gallon fuel tank for the current OEM 34 gallon fuel tank. I plan to have the Rhino bed liner sprayed on after leaving the dealership.

Making this truck purchase decision was a long process. Reflecting on the actual numbers for my Mercedes and realizing I was at or past the door post numbers for GVW and GAWR and the recommended maximum weight trailer, I knew that I could be in a bind if there ever were an incident. The car was stretched to the limit of the factory recommended capabilities.

I plan on adding additional gages to monitor the transmission, rear end and turbocharger temperatures. I will drive more relaxed knowing that I am not pushing the TV to it's operational limits.

YMMV
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Old 01-10-2013, 07:12 AM   #125
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Switz

Sounds like you looked at all the options and made the right decision for your towing requirements. I believe that a thorough investigation of all the TV's ensures the right decision in the end. I hope that you enjoy your relaxed traveling knowing that you are well under the limits of your TV.

Now, please let us see some photos of your new TV.

Dan
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Old 01-11-2013, 07:38 PM   #126
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Finally brought the Ram 2500 home this evening. It's very nice, and since it's a Laramie, has more bells and whistles than I will learn to use in six months. Hope I got a good one. I'll post a picture here after I get the camper cover on.
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