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Old 12-16-2012, 06:45 PM   #43
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Oh, and I thought this was understood because I asked about 1/2 ton trucks, but maybe not.....I don't want an SUV.
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Old 12-16-2012, 06:58 PM   #44
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The search for a unicorn ought to be the title of this thread.

Alternatives ought to bracket what one currently perceives as ideal when playing with numbers. Which themselves are only a start. Not the end as is commonly mistaken. Lay them out, the alternatives, each.

An Expedition EL, after all, is rated for a 9k TT. Easily capable in the task.

What of full-sized vans? The Halfback Van Conversion is another one of those alternatives. Even if not as capable a TV as an Expedition, more on par with a pickup.

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Old 12-16-2012, 07:00 PM   #45
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You buy one.

I currently have a truck. If I can't buy what I want, I won't buy something that I don't want just to buy something. I may in the future buy something else, but I'm not to that point now.

If need be, it'll be a simple matter to just go buy a newer truck just like I have. I know it will do the job.
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Old 12-16-2012, 07:50 PM   #46
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The search for a unicorn ought to be the title of this thread.

Alternatives ought to bracket what one currently perceives as ideal when playing with numbers. Which themselves are only a start. Not the end as is commonly mistaken. Lay them out, the alternatives, each.

An Expedition EL, after all, is rated for a 9k TT. Easily capable in the task.

What of full-sized vans? The Halfback Van Conversion is another one of those alternatives. Even if not as capable a TV as an Expedition, more on par with a pickup.

.
Might want to start screwing those horns on horses. I have NO inside knowledge of this....but I have a sneaking feeling that as new "1/2 ton" pickups are introduced in 2014 (GM) 2015 (Ford) and 2016 (Ram????) that the lightest FULL SIZE "1/2 ton" will be 8601 GVW minimum.

I've seen a couple "hints" which make me believe it....but it is my opinion only.
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Old 12-16-2012, 08:02 PM   #47
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I have NO inside knowledge of this....but I have a sneaking feeling that as new "1/2 ton" pickups are introduced in 2014 (GM) 2015 (Ford) and 2016 (Ram????) that the lightest FULL SIZE "1/2 ton" will be 8601 GVW minimum.

I've seen a couple "hints" which make me believe it....but it is my opinion only.
Must be something like 8600 GVW and below must meet some rediculous new government mileage standard, or maybe vehicles above 8600 GVW are not counted in a manufacturers mileage "numbers"?
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Old 12-16-2012, 08:40 PM   #48
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8601 and up are not subject to CAFE regulations. I think we will see 1/2 ton vans and PUs all go 8601 and be pointed less to the "concrete cowboy suburban homeowner".

CAFE has always left the playing field uneven against those manufacturers who are "full line" LD truck manufacturers along with cars.
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Old 12-16-2012, 08:46 PM   #49
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Cafe Regulations = Corporate Average Fuel Economy for us nonauto industry folks. ( I had to look it up)
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Old 12-16-2012, 09:49 PM   #50
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One thing that people seem to forget is that you can easily and relatively inexpensively modify your vehicle with additional leaf springs, air bags, etc., or different gears. Most people want something completely off the shelf that has all the capability needed, myself included due to warranty issues, etc. But especially when compared to the cost of a new or more capable vehicle you can upgrade the suspenstion, gearing, and hitch issues relatively cheaply, assuming that the power plant is sufficient.

I am partial to GM products, and have owned or primary used four such pickups from model year 76 to 94 with the common 350/5.7L, and they would have all been sufficient with the proper suspension to haul anything up to 10K based on what we did with them anyway. I've no doubt the current line of 1/2 ton engines would also be sufficient as they all spec out with higher ratings than even my 94. Don't think you could go wrong with any of them.

I did just get a diesel 3/4 ton, and the three biggest factors in towing ease seem to be proper hitch setup, wheel base, and the weight ratio from tow vehicle to trailer. RV dealers seem to have lost the old impetus to set up the customer's vehicle with the suspension and hitch upgrades due to the proliferation of trucks as tow vehicles over the last 25 years.

My two cents on all this, and I would add in as friendly way as possible, not sure why anyone would consider getting rid of a diesel with only 150K miles, mine as a little over 70K and it's just about broken in. My last three gassers all went 200K+ before any major problems or trade in.

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Old 12-16-2012, 11:06 PM   #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dznf0g View Post
Might want to start screwing those horns on horses. I have NO inside knowledge of this....but I have a sneaking feeling that as new "1/2 ton" pickups are introduced in 2014 (GM) 2015 (Ford) and 2016 (Ram????) that the lightest FULL SIZE "1/2 ton" will be 8601 GVW minimum.
This would mean an increase in the GVWR of about 1,500 lbs. Then they will no longer be 1/2 ton trucks, but 1 ton trucks right?

Steve

The current Tundra meets your specs except for the gas tank (only 26 gal) and the payload (only 1380 lbs). Heres hoping that the new crop of 1/2 ton trucks meets your criteria. These are great criteria BTW. I wish my 2008 Tundra met them. Since mine is only a 2wd, at least it has more payload (1,680 lbs vs. 1,380 lbs).

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Old 12-17-2012, 08:50 AM   #52
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I am not prepared to answer the spec'ing questions until I see concrete specs issued. No they would not be 1 ton trucks at 8601! Heck, I'm looking at a spec sheet right now for a 2013 3500 dually and it's CURB weight, as equipped is 7150#, and GVWR of 13,025#.

This 8601# would be in between a current 1/2 ton and a current 3/4 ton. .....call it a "heavy half".
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Old 12-17-2012, 09:23 AM   #53
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Just looked at the specs of a current 2012 GMC excab 4X4, and it has a GVWR of 7000 lbs., so increasing that number by 1601 lbs. would be a significant change.

Seems to me that would take more change than tires and springs, but I'd bet the chasis is good. I would think things like axles, hubs, wheel bearings, brakes, etc., would also have to be improved. Hope they also address the small rear end housing they use, and finally put disc brakes on the rear.
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Old 12-17-2012, 09:45 AM   #54
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All I know, is that the public unveiling for the press, which included NO HARD SPECS, said 4 wheel discs (out of a new anti corrosive material) and a "heavier rear axle", and more use of hydroforming frame members. Those are the only hints I have for this specific truck.

Ford had already moved the Econoline north of 8600#, presumably because their product mix was making it difficult to meet CAFE in 2012. I believe this will be a trend for mfrs with a heavy truck/SUV mix.....including IMO Toyota. I don't think Nissan, Honda....have a high enough "truck" mix (below 8600# GVWR) to be concerned at this time.
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Old 12-17-2012, 03:39 PM   #55
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Been checking specs and Ram has a Tradsman HD, std cab, 8' box, 1500, with a GVWR of 8610, GAWR (rear) 6000 lbs., and it is available now. So, not only the technology, but the parts are available now. It's just a matter of selecting the parts, and putting them together in a package.

Oh, and it has a max towing capacity of 11,500 pounds with the 4.10:1 rear end gear ratio.
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Old 12-17-2012, 03:52 PM   #56
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Isn't the Tradesman only in a "work truck" trim.
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