Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 08-22-2005, 09:02 PM   #1
1 Rivet Member
 
2004 25' Classic
Westmount , Quebec
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 17
Titan vs GMC 2500 ?

I've recently bought a 25 Foot 2005 Classic (7300 lbs). I now need something to tow it with. I was considering a 6L GMC 2500 Sierra 4x4 Extended cab (4.10 Ratio/6 Foot box) but I'm now tempted, hoping for better fuel economy, by the 5.6L Nissan Titan 4x4 King cab with the Big Tow Package (3.36 Ratio - Nissan claims similar to a 4 speed automatic's 4.10). As the Titan is relatively new on the market I was wondering if anyone had towing experience with it (or the Sierra) pulling something similiar to my 25 Foot Classic. Thanks.
__________________

__________________
Daniel LOUIS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-22-2005, 10:12 PM   #2
Aluminut
 
Silvertwinkie's Avatar
 
2004 25' Safari
. , Illinois
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 10,334
Either would do a good job with a 25' coach, but I'd err on the side of a real 3/4 ton. The Titan, though a nice truck isn't truely a 3/4 ton vehicle.
__________________

__________________
Computers manufactured by companies such as IBM, Compaq and millions of others are by far the most popular with about 70 million machines in use worldwide. Macintosh fans note that cockroaches are far more numerous than humans and that numbers alone do not denote a higher life form. -NY Times 11/91
Silvertwinkie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-22-2005, 10:24 PM   #3
Van
4 Rivet Member
 
1977 23' Safari
Hillsboro , Oregon
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 348
Images: 25
Considering the way it is built, it barely qualifies as a 1/2 ton. Nissan makes nice cars and small trucks, but they should either get in with both feet and build a 1/2 ton the way it should be built or not bother.

Get the Chevy.
__________________
Van
2009 F-350 FX4 Crewcab 4x4 6.4l
former '78 Argosy 20' Minuet owner
former '77 23' Safari owner
former 25' Fun Finder X-250BHS SOB owner
current 26' Komfort Trailblazer 262BSLE SOB owner
Van is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-22-2005, 11:13 PM   #4
2 Rivet Member
 
Pappy's Avatar
 
2006 25' Classic
Floyds Knobs , Indiana
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 88
My Tow is the Nissan Titan

We are pulling a New Classic 25 with the Titan.
In the last 2 months we have traveled about 5000 miles with no problems.
We went to Rocky Mountain National park then traveled over the top at 12000ft over to MOAB where the temps were 114 degrees during the day. Had a great time. Above 9000 ft the truck was slow but in the park with posted limits of 30mph we were able to do that. We never let the RPM run over 2500 rpm and selected the appropiate gear. Level pulling at 60mph the engine turns around 1900 in 4th gear. We broke the rear end as the book calls for at 50mph for the first 500 miles. Acceleration is far better than my older GMC motorhome. Stability with the Hensley is excellent. We got 10 plus on gas mileage. We are sold on both the Titan and the Airstream and hopefully this information will help you make your decision. Even though this does not atest to the long term reliability of the Titan I thought I would put in my two cents.

Good luck
Pappy
__________________
Pappy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-22-2005, 11:17 PM   #5
Rivet Master<br><img src="/ugala/forums/images/5rivet.gif">
 
CanoeStream's Avatar

 
2006 25' Safari FB SE
St. Cloud , Minnesota
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 13,279
Images: 19
Blog Entries: 3
Titan owner chimes in...

Go to website of choice and look up the GVWR of the Titan. Do not consider anything about GCWR or 'tow capacity' (9000 pounds is totally unreal if you pay attention to the math). GVWR is the max weight that can be put on just the tow vehicle. Count up weight of passengers, gasoline and anything you might put in the truck cab or box; add tongue weight to your sum. This will allow you to look at a trailer that loaded does not exceed 5500 pounds or so. And it barely makes that... With my Argosy I have wiggle room to carry 2 bicycles or my canoe, just not both at the same time. Forget about carrying the perpetual fruitcake you are going to take back to your Auntie...

I had one very tough incident of keeping the tranny temp gauge from topping out in 30-degree weather while slow grinding up and down tiny US-50 in West Virginia.

Better yet, do a search on this website for 'Titan' or 'Armada' -- I've spewed enough about the limits of the basic math as it applies to this platform. As a moderately capable truck I do have many points I like about my Titan. As an owner of a 2006 Safari 25 footer I am going to be shopping for a new tow vehicle once the current purchase and my bank account stabilize. Until then, I'm sticking to the prairies. 25' Classic? No way!
__________________
Bob

5 meter Langford Nahanni

CanoeStream is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-23-2005, 12:00 AM   #6
Rivet Master
 
Big Dee's Avatar
 
2004 30' Classic
San Jose , California
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 1,664
Images: 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by Canoe stream
Do not consider anything about GCWR or 'tow capacity' (9000 pounds is totally unreal if you pay attention to the math).
Wait a minute! GCWR or GCVWR is not the same as "tow capacity" or "tow rating". As RoadKingMoe has taught me, tow ratings are marketing gimics created by the Big Three. But GCVWR is not a gimic and is VERY important as it is the maxium WR for both the truck and trailer and EVERYTHING else. Must never violate the GCVWR.
__________________
"It's the journey."

NorCal Fall Rally, Jackson Rancheria, October 7-9 2011 Click here for more info

Come rally with us.
Big Dee is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-23-2005, 08:16 AM   #7
Aluminut
 
Silvertwinkie's Avatar
 
2004 25' Safari
. , Illinois
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 10,334
I agree, the Titan, though nice is barely a 1/2 ton.

Bottom line is that if it were me, I too would have gone with the 3/4 ton or the 1500HD for a 25' or larger coach.

I fully agree and support the comment that Nissan makes a heck of a vehicle, but if they want into the big boy sandbox, they gotta get fully into it and truely comapre apples to apples...anything less is just propaganda to push tin.
__________________
Computers manufactured by companies such as IBM, Compaq and millions of others are by far the most popular with about 70 million machines in use worldwide. Macintosh fans note that cockroaches are far more numerous than humans and that numbers alone do not denote a higher life form. -NY Times 11/91
Silvertwinkie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-23-2005, 01:33 PM   #8
New Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 3
Titan owner here....and my $.02.

I've logged about 2,500mi in my Titan with a 19' Globetrotter behind me without any problems whatsoever, on the highway it is easy to forget the Airstream is back there.
The Titan is more than capable of hauling a 19 footer fully loaded with wife and dog in the cab and gear in the bed, but to haul a modern and fully loaded 25' safari, I think I would opt for the 3/4 ton.

I've owned both the GMC 1/2ton and recently the '99 Ford f150 (trade-in for Titan), and Silvertwinkies & VAN's comments about the Titan not up to snuff with those trucks strikes me as misplaced patriotism. The Nissan is more than capable as a dependable 1/2ton work truck and is the most powerful and stable while hauling truck between the three half-ton trucks I've owned. But again, it is a 1/2 ton, not 3/4 ton.

-Brad

http://www.nissantitan.info/
__________________
RoadRivets is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-23-2005, 01:59 PM   #9
Aluminut
 
Silvertwinkie's Avatar
 
2004 25' Safari
. , Illinois
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 10,334
Quote:
Originally Posted by RoadRivets
Titan owner here....and my $.02.
Silvertwinkies & VAN's comments about the Titan not up to snuff with those trucks strikes me as misplaced patriotism.
http://www.nissantitan.info/
Not accurate at all.

If you look at the Nissan website, you clearly start to get the sense that smoke and mirrors are being brought in and that unlike comparisons are being drawn.

Maximum towing capacity (lbs.)
Standard 6,500 7,400 7,200
With Big Tow Package N/A 9,500 9,200

What does the "big tow" package include to get a rating jump of 2,000lbs?

Here (again off the Nissan site):

Big Tow Package (SE and LE Only)
Class IV receiver hitch (clearly going to help tow 2000 more lbs)
Additional 7-pin wiring harness plug (this too will be a big help with the extra weight)
Trailer brake controller pre-wiring under instrument panel (another good helper)
Heavy-duty battery (710 CCA) (Still waiting for some meat)
Lower final gear ratio (3.36:1); similar to 4.10:1 on a 4-speed automatic (this is good, but why not just put 4.10s in back instead of playing games in the transmission to get it to be similar?)
Extendable tow mirrors (a must for those looking to tow an additional 2000lbs)
Transmission temperature gauge (good to have so you can see when you begin to cook your trans with all that fancy gearing in it as some here have posted and reported)
Increased tow capacity (this speaks volumes, it has an increased tow capacity....how, what did they do, what is the cost breakdown of this line item)

Clearly, I can see that most of the items here would in fact allow 2000 more pounds to work. No brake upgrades, no trans upgrades, no real gears for torque multiplication, no frame upgrades etc (sarcasm off).

Now if you look at the GM site, or Ford, Dodge, etc, you will find that the 1/2 tons will take you up to a limit, however, to get to the next level, one needs to go to a 3/4 ton or the 1500HD which will in fact give you a 6.0L engine, upgraded trans, brakes, rear end and, real gears in back without having to do things in the trans. Someone posted here that the trans got hot on their Titan....any ideas why?

Being patriotic has nothing to do with it...it's plain facts. I have towed our fully loaded 25' Safari with the equiv of a 1/2 several thousand miles. I now tow with a 3/4 Suburban. It's a night and day difference. The Titan doesn't even have what I had in my 1/2 equiv.

It goes so far beyond the horsepower and torque ratings....but I do agree 100%, I'd go to the 3/4 ton at or above a 25' (newer) coach.
__________________
Computers manufactured by companies such as IBM, Compaq and millions of others are by far the most popular with about 70 million machines in use worldwide. Macintosh fans note that cockroaches are far more numerous than humans and that numbers alone do not denote a higher life form. -NY Times 11/91
Silvertwinkie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-23-2005, 02:46 PM   #10
Patriotic
 
Chuck's Avatar

 
1973 23' Safari
North of Boston , Massachusetts
Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 4,533
Images: 260
I don't understand. how is it "not qute a half ton", with a 14,800lb gcwr?????????


(my dodge "half-ton" has a 12,500gcwr, and likely weighs more than the titan....)


one thing they don't tell you in the owner's manual is the empty weight. But I'd guess that its probably around 5k lbs. maybe 5500.
with a tow rating of 9400lbs, you could surmise that the empty weight is around 5400lbs. if they include a 150lb driver and a tank of gas with that number...5200lbs.

even if you fill the truck up w/ payload (1500lbs), you're still inside the limit for a fully loaded 25footer.
__________________
Air:291
Wbcci: 3752
'73 Safari 23'
'00 Dodge Ram 1500 4x4 QC
Chuck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-23-2005, 04:20 PM   #11
Aluminut
 
Silvertwinkie's Avatar
 
2004 25' Safari
. , Illinois
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 10,334
Well, the not quite a 1/2 ton was a bit of a joke poking fun. But a 25' Safari for 2004 could weight upward of 6300lbs. Mid year 2005 and beyond that was raised to 7300lbs. Now will everyone get near the max, most likely not, but it is possible and probable that folks will get to 75% to 80% of the Safari's total GVWR.

My whole issue with the Nissan truck line is not that it's not a well made truck, it is, but if you really look at most of the other manufacs of trucks, you'll find solid answers how they might get to 9500lbs from 7500lbs. In the Nissan website, you can see from my post what the "big tow" package includes to add that extra 2000lbs of towing. Moreover, for the sake of the discussion, let's say the other side of the camp is correct, the Titan could tow a 7300lb 25' new(er) Safari. It would do so at over 75% of the pre- "big tow" package addition. Closer to 90% actually. So could it do it, sure, is it a good idea? Not IMHO, but again, it all comes down to choices. I think you'll find most folks here doing the right thing. If it were me, I think the Titan would do just fine with a 19' or 22', but I feel that at 25' (again, newer coach, not vintange), having the exp I've had, you begin to get into 3/4 country, which the Titan is clearly not.

Bottom line, I don't dislike the Titan. If anything it makes for good competition keeping GM and Ford in line. Clearly, GM and Ford see the issue of quality and design....two items the Nissan clearly has....if the Nissan trucks ever get totally there, GM and Ford are gonna be in trouble, no question.

The real issue though is fuel. None of the manufacs discussed here (in terms of gassers) get much better than 10-12mpg, and if you ask me, at near $3/gallon, few folks aren't buying the big V8s unless it's needed (but is a whole 'nuther thread).
__________________
Computers manufactured by companies such as IBM, Compaq and millions of others are by far the most popular with about 70 million machines in use worldwide. Macintosh fans note that cockroaches are far more numerous than humans and that numbers alone do not denote a higher life form. -NY Times 11/91
Silvertwinkie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-23-2005, 05:10 PM   #12
1 Rivet Member
 
2004 25' Classic
Westmount , Quebec
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 17
Thanks to all for your comments and suggestions. This is my first post (and first Airstream...) and I'm finding the experience extremely interesting. Would gas consumption be similar with both vehicles?
__________________
Daniel LOUIS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-23-2005, 05:23 PM   #13
Patriotic
 
Chuck's Avatar

 
1973 23' Safari
North of Boston , Massachusetts
Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 4,533
Images: 260
websites are run by the marketing department. I wouldn't trust that whatever is on the corporate website is accurate, or includes every technical detail that motorheads like us are looking for.

some of us here hang on those numbers like these were airplanes, or something. they're not. what happens when you exceed those numbers in an airplane? it stops flying. that would be bad. But the numbers mean something concrete, and they are derived from extensive flight testing. "exceed these specs, and you won't be able to fly out of the box canyon. you will smash into the mountain on the other end, because you won't be able to climb over it". that kind of thing. "at weight "x", air temperature "y", you can go "z" high." What happens in a trailer-towing truck when it comes to a mountain? at worst, it comes to a stop.

My point is that I think these numbers from any truck manufacturer are somewhat arbitrary. the number at which they're willing to gamble that there won't be premature component failures, perhaps.

Another point is that all of the half ton trucks have suddenly jumped up 2000 lbs in their manufacturer's-stated towing capacities. What's so different between a '00 ram, and an '02 ram? ok, well, the '02 might have a "hemi". but you know, if you look at the towing charts in my owner's manual, the trucks with the biggest engine has the same gcwr as my truck, with a smaller engine. so that is not the limiting factor. what else could it be? they don't say. Shouldn't a bigger engine be able to tow more?
My truck came with a "tow package", too. it did not include a "different" transmission; but they did add a transmission cooler. and a few other things, too, that as you pointed out, don't really make a dent in the TV's actual hauling capability.

Even so, if the gcwr is actually based on something solid, the 25 footer is well inside the spec. In the old days, they went by horsepower and wheelbase...the Titan has both of those, too.
__________________
Air:291
Wbcci: 3752
'73 Safari 23'
'00 Dodge Ram 1500 4x4 QC
Chuck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-23-2005, 08:51 PM   #14
Van
4 Rivet Member
 
1977 23' Safari
Hillsboro , Oregon
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 348
Images: 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by RoadRivets
Titan owner here....and my $.02.


I've owned both the GMC 1/2ton and recently the '99 Ford f150 (trade-in for Titan), and Silvertwinkies & VAN's comments about the Titan not up to snuff with those trucks strikes me as misplaced patriotism.

My comment doesnt come from misplaced patriotism. It comes from finding out how they are built. I'm talking about the strength and design of the frame, gears and even the number and size of the bolts holding the bed to the frame.

Ford overbuilds their trucks. Better that than cutting corners.

To each their own though. The Titan is a nice looking truck but there is a reason that Ford trucks are #1.
__________________

__________________
Van
2009 F-350 FX4 Crewcab 4x4 6.4l
former '78 Argosy 20' Minuet owner
former '77 23' Safari owner
former 25' Fun Finder X-250BHS SOB owner
current 26' Komfort Trailblazer 262BSLE SOB owner
Van is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
IPOD ready mandolindave Off Topic Forum 49 05-11-2011 12:39 PM
Trailor brakes on 2003 2500 chev joel Tow Vehicles 9 10-10-2003 06:30 PM
GMC 1500 Z-71 what mods for towing ? Rod Pease Tow Vehicles 5 01-07-2003 02:32 PM
GMC Coop - Orlando, FL ViewRVs Airstream Motorhome Forums 6 07-26-2002 06:43 PM
Interesting link GMC coop ALANSD Link Archive 8 03-14-2002 02:40 PM


Virginia Campgrounds

Reviews provided by




Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 09:52 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

Airstream is a registered trademark of Airstream Inc. All rights reserved. Airstream trademark used under license to Social Knowledge LLC.